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youngredbullfan

The Wire and the Sopranos >>>>>>>> Breaking Bad

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I think this is pretty obvious. 

But I'll explain anyway. 

Breaking Bad's depiction of the drug trade and crime in general was laughably unrealistic. It and the dialogue surrounding it was exactly how you'd imagine a suburban physics teacher to write it. Which I think is related to its ultimate problem: it was a detached-from-reality personal morality tale that never properly interrogated drugs, drug enforcement, drug addiction, healthcare, mortality, or anything important really. It often veered into being a power fantasy for its audience, an imagining that a superior class upbringing would automatically equate to a mastery of the underworld.

The Sopranos and the Wire, on the other hand, explore and interrogate crime, society, and the American experience in an entertaining but still complex way that makes them imminently relevant and rewatchable. 

Don't get me wrong, I still think it's a good show overall. It's good drama, the lead actor is fantastic, and it ends on a strong note. It's just not a masterpiece on par with the other two shows mentioned. 

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Can't say I disagree, but I see Breaking Bad more as a character study than any serious sociological discussion. At its core it is only about the complete moral destruction of a person and the impact that has on the people close to him.

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Of the three, the Sopranos is my favorite. Kapeesh.

How That 'Many Saints' Narration Twist Redefines 'The Sopranos' | IndieWire

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1 hour ago, Maynard Delecto said:

The SJW Television Network

All White Guilt. All the time.

Come On What GIF by MOODMAN

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1 hour ago, SharkTanked said:

Can't say I disagree, but I see Breaking Bad more as a character study than any serious sociological discussion. At its core it is only about the complete moral destruction of a person and the impact that has on the people close to him.

The world of organized drug trafficking is just a weird setting for a character study of a guy like Walt.. it's just a gimmick IMO.

That's why I think Better Call Saul is a better show: the world of a criminal lawyer they create is much more internally consistent and realistic 

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Just now, youngredbullfan said:

The world of organized drug trafficking is just a weird setting for a character study of a guy like Walt.. it's just a gimmick IMO.

That's why I think Better Call Saul is a better show: the world of a criminal lawyer they create is much more internally consistent and realistic 

I find the realism of it to make it less impactful personally. We see examples all the time of lawyers selling out their moral codes. Seems to be a particular occupational hazard. In fact it follows the vast majority of the depictions of lawyers.

It is the bizarre circumstances of a science teacher cooking meth and turning into a drug lord from it, in all its glorious cognitive-dissonance, that provides more power to the fall, imo. I don't think the setting being realistic is necessary to get the emotional draw. In fact I think realism somewhat damages the impact of the journey in this case. In many ways its absurdity is what gives it its power.

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haven't seen the sopranos nor the wire, but breaking bad was never meant to be a serious exploration of the world of the drug trade in the same way star wars isn't supposed to be a serious take on science fiction.  the sci fi provides the backdrop for the story - as do the drugs

breaking bad is probably the best story i've ever been told on a screen.

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4 hours ago, youngredbullfan said:

It often veered into being a power fantasy for its audience, an imagining that a superior class upbringing would automatically equate to a mastery of the underworld.

i got the sense that it was walter's hubris -- erroneously held -- that led him to believe this.

it was why gus was able to manipulate him

if the audience got the idea that it was a positive power fantasy whereby an educated white man could dominate the underworld, they got entirely the wrong message.  walter's brains got him out individual tight spots only to further cement his fate -- castoff, forgotten by his wife, hated by his son, and unknown to his daughter.  he alienated everyone he was supposed to love and support because he let himself fool himself into thinking he was loving and supporting them.  and that's just his family.  the rest of the underworld wanted him dead.

brilliant story.  "For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?"

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4 hours ago, SharkTanked said:

Can't say I disagree, but I see Breaking Bad more as a character study than any serious sociological discussion. At its core it is only about the complete moral destruction of a person and the impact that has on the people close to him.

All of that and a bit of dark comedy as well.

The acting was great too.

 

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1 hour ago, AndroidAggie said:

i got the sense that it was walter's hubris -- erroneously held -- that led him to believe this.

it was why gus was able to manipulate him

if the audience got the idea that it was a positive power fantasy whereby an educated white man could dominate the underworld, they got entirely the wrong message.  walter's brains got him out individual tight spots only to further cement his fate -- castoff, forgotten by his wife, hated by his son, and unknown to his daughter.  he alienated everyone he was supposed to love and support because he let himself fool himself into thinking he was loving and supporting them.  and that's just his family.  the rest of the underworld wanted him dead.

brilliant story.  "For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?"

Sorry AA, but just no. Everything must be viewed through a political lens. No fun allowed. #PurEtDur

 

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4 hours ago, SharkTanked said:

I find the realism of it to make it less impactful personally. We see examples all the time of lawyers selling out their moral codes. Seems to be a particular occupational hazard. In fact it follows the vast majority of the depictions of lawyers.

It is the bizarre circumstances of a science teacher cooking meth and turning into a drug lord from it, in all its glorious cognitive-dissonance, that provides more power to the fall, imo. I don't think the setting being realistic is necessary to get the emotional draw. In fact I think realism somewhat damages the impact of the journey in this case. In many ways its absurdity is what gives it its power.

Using the drug trade as the vehicle to draw that absurd contrast was misguided, IMO. It was a gimmick, too farcical to really carry emotional resonance for me. Its inconsistent pacing, from brutally slow to total reliance on "what happens next" and edge-of-your-seat tension also makes it less rewatchable. That's most TV though, and there's nothing wrong with that. It's just not masterpiece level in my opinion.

 

2 hours ago, AndroidAggie said:

haven't seen the sopranos nor the wire, but breaking bad was never meant to be a serious exploration of the world of the drug trade in the same way star wars isn't supposed to be a serious take on science fiction.  the sci fi provides the backdrop for the story - as do the drugs

breaking bad is probably the best story i've ever been told on a screen.

The bolded statements are related

1 hour ago, Aslowhiteguy said:

All of that and a bit of dark comedy as well.

The acting was great too.

 

Oh yeah, it could be really funny at times. Not as funny as the Sopranos, but funny. 

Cranston was incredible. Other supporting actors weren't as consistent.

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1 minute ago, youngredbullfan said:

Using the drug trade as the vehicle to draw that absurd contrast was misguided, IMO. It was a gimmick, too farcical to really carry emotional resonance for me. Its inconsistent pacing, from brutally slow to total reliance on "what happens next" and edge-of-your-seat tension also makes it less rewatchable. That's most TV though, and there's nothing wrong with that. It's just not masterpiece level in my opinion.

 

The bolded statements are related

Oh yeah, it could be really funny at times. Not as funny as the Sopranos, but funny. 

Cranston was incredible. Other supporting actors weren't as consistent.

I liked both of those series. I never watched The Wire. After reading your post, I checked HBO and the first five seasons are on demand. 

I'm going check it out. If I end up binge watching that show, I'm blaming you and our Best Buy meeting is on again.

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The Wire to me is hands down the best show ever.  The writing was superb.  The acting was great.  Season 5 went off the rails a little, but overall there is nothing better to me.  

I think one thing I really appreciated was that the writing made everyone human and multifaceted.  There were parts of each character that were good and bad.  They were grey.  Not black and white like a lot of shows and more how people are in real life.  

So many great characters too.  

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Respect your opinion, even if it's wrong. The Wire and soprano's were great shows, but neither come close to consistency of the episode after episode masterpieces that breaking bad brought. It was a perfect balance of exciting drama and underlining complex themes. Also, my girlfriend's old place is in some of the shots. Masterpiece.

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