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HawaiiMongoose

Best basketball additions to the MWC?

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16 minutes ago, Ibanez said:

Gotcha. Still not convinced. 😆. But I trust most of you guys so if they are worth it then come on over.

Don’t get me wrong.  I’m sharing the information to explain why they might be in play.  But for hoops I think GCU or UH is the more sensible add.  GCU is the defending WAC champ and UH has been competitive historically against current MWC members.  And both schools put way more fans in the stands than UC Davis.

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1 hour ago, Ibanez said:

Gonzaga. That's it. There is no one else.

However, if the MWC has to expand by one on hoops if Air Force and Colorado State leaves and Gonzaga says no you get Grand Canyon and try to get a WCC school, preferably St. Mary's to kinda coast Gonzaga to join. There is no one else.

Gonzaga and SMC would be nice (they’d get to keep the rivalry). I don’t think fans matter (GU only seats 6k) - it’s about tv fans. Not sure GCU gets a lot of eyeballs outside PHX but not really sure. 

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15 minutes ago, bsu_alum9 said:

Gonzaga and SMC would be nice (they’d get to keep the rivalry). I don’t think fans matter (GU only seats 6k) - it’s about tv fans. Not sure GCU gets a lot of eyeballs outside PHX but not really sure. 

For sure that's a selling point for Gonzaga.  Saint Mary's, not so much.  Doubt they get significant TV ratings outside Moraga and certain parts of Australia.

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4 hours ago, bigd said:

Gonzaga is the only one. I’m not opposed to adding Hawaii as a full member though. Losing CSU and AF would make it more of a western league and cut down at least somewhat on their required travel.

Hawaii is a further trip for every member than to CSU or AF.  Also, as an illustration, for UNLV, it would be a shorter flight to NYC (2,250 miles) than Hawaii (2,750 miles).  It’s even shorter for San Diego State to go to NYC (2,450 miles) than Hawaii (2,600 miles).

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1 hour ago, HawaiiMongoose said:

- $40 million athletic budget (higher than New Mexico, San Jose State, North Texas and UTSA)

- 49K students and 293K living alumni

- Academically elite (ranked #38 among USNWR National Universities)

- 8K-seat basketball arena

- New $50 million athletic performance center

- Could eventually move football up to FBS if the conference needed another football school

- Sacramento metro area is 26th largest in the U.S.

- Easy travel to San Jose State, Fresno State and Nevada

I think the downside is that none of the three above-mentioned MWC schools would want the recruiting competition.

You put a school right in prime recruiting territory for Fresno, Nevada, SJSU, etc. and they suck the MWC tit until they’re good enough to get a PAC-12 invite. The PAC would love to add them, but they’ve said UCD would have to grow in another conference until good enough. Then you just created another P5 right in prime recruiting territory. Don’t be the stupid one that falls for that trap. 

kat.jpg

 

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3 hours ago, HawaiiMongoose said:

Don’t get me wrong.  I’m sharing the information to explain why they might be in play.  But for hoops I think GCU or UH is the more sensible add.  GCU is the defending WAC champ and UH has been competitive historically against current MWC members.  And both schools put way more fans in the stands than UC Davis.

 

With that said, and all the built-in advantages Hawaii has in its current conference, how can anyone explain their middling status in league standings the last nine years?

5th (out of 10), 4th (out of 9), 5th, 1st, 5th, 6th, 4th, 4th, 6th (out of 11)

And according to basketball reference, UH's all-time h2h record in the Division 1 era

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/hawaii/head-to-head.html

vs Cal Poly: 12-9

UC Riverside: 12-9

Cal State Bakersfield: 1-2 (swept by the Birds in '20-'21)

Long Beach State: 15-16

UC Santa Barbara: 8-12

UC Irvine: 6-18

Go figure.  Hawaii dominates Fullerton, CSUN and UC Davis, though.

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11 minutes ago, jdgaucho said:

 

With that said, and all the built-in advantages Hawaii has in its current conference, how can anyone explain their middling status in league standings the last nine years?

5th (out of 10), 4th (out of 9), 5th, 1st, 5th, 6th, 4th, 4th, 6th (out of 11)

And according to basketball reference, UH's all-time h2h record in the Division 1 era

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/hawaii/head-to-head.html

vs Cal Poly: 12-9

UC Riverside: 12-9

Cal State Bakersfield: 1-2 (swept by the Birds in '20-'21)

Long Beach State: 15-16

UC Santa Barbara: 8-12

UC Irvine: 6-18

Go figure.  Hawaii dominates Fullerton, CSUN and UC Davis, though.

Don’t want to go too far down the rabbit hole here but in my view the reason is simple: UH hasn’t made a good head coaching hire since Riley Wallace retired in 2007.

Bob Nash had been associated with the program for decades as a player and assistant coach and was Wallace’s logical successor, but despite personifying loyalty and integrity turned out not to be head coach material.  Gib “Glib” Arnold was a good judge of talent and great recruiter but not an effective teacher or X’s and O’s guy.  He also played fast and loose with NCAA rules and got us sanctioned and had to be fired in disgrace.  And now we have Eran Ganot, who earned a lot of accolades for winning a conference title with Arnold’s recruits but has turned out to have difficulty connecting on a personal level with his team and can’t sign talented enough players to make us a contender in the league.

It’s just one UH fan’s opinion but I think our past history shows we can be very competitive with the right leader at the helm.  We were darned formidable during much of our time in the WAC and I believe we could be again in the Big West or MWC but we need to hire a more capable head coach.  It still bugs me that we turned down Kyle Smith twice (in favor of Arnold and then Ganot) and now he’s coaching in the Pac-12.

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UCSB looks like a pretty good choice to me.

If the MWC loses teams, a good starting point would be to add a new basketball/olympic member to have an equal number of teams in each sport.

.

If AFA and CSU go to the AAC, it seems really important for the MWC to take decisive action, and to formulate a plan as to how they would respond.  The AAC was caught flat-footed when they were sandbagged by the Big 12, and that wasn't a good look for them.

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It blows my mind that there is any support from you all for GCU.  They are a for profit school, they are a diploma mill and they have won the conference once.  They did so in a year that NMSU had to practice and play out of Phoenix and had 10 games canceled or moved because of covid.  NMSU had a major down year, yet they still got the the WAC championship game.  NMSU owns the WAC and went to the NCAA several times in the WAC that included Boise, Nevada, Utah State, etc.  How is GCU more attractive in basketball than NMSU?  So strange...

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1 minute ago, PojoPops said:

It blows my mind that there is any support from you all for GCU.  They are a for profit school, they are a diploma mill and they have won the conference once.  They did so in a year that NMSU had to practice and play out of Phoenix and had 10 games canceled or moved because of covid.  NMSU owns the WAC and went to the NCAA several times in the WAC that included Boise, Nevada, Utah State, etc.  How is GCU more attractive in basketball than NMSU?  SMH...

Your NewMags would be a solid B-ball and Baseball add.

There are two problems though. Your Sister Institute to the North and your Indy FCS level football program.

Solve those problems and you have a shot.

"We don't have evidence but, we have lot's of theories."

Americans Mayor

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Just now, Spaztecs said:

Your NewMags would be a solid B-ball and Baseball add.

There are two problems though. Your Sister Institute to the North and your Indy FCS level football program.

Solve those problems and you have a shot.

I understand all that.  I'm not saying we have a shot at all sports in MWC.  The OP is "best basketball additions for the MWC".  I would have never in my life thought even one poster would think GCU was a good fit for the MWC, let alone a better program than NMSU.

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2 hours ago, PojoPops said:

I understand all that.  I'm not saying we have a shot at all sports in MWC.  The OP is "best basketball additions for the MWC".  I would have never in my life thought even one poster would think GCU was a good fit for the MWC, let alone a better program than NMSU.

So you're saying NMSU would be willing to join the MWC for Olympic sports but remain an independent in football?  I find it hard to believe the NMSU administration would go for that, otherwise of course the Aggies would be on the basketball candidate short list.

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2 hours ago, PojoPops said:

It blows my mind that there is any support from you all for GCU.  They are a for profit school, they are a diploma mill and they have won the conference once.  They did so in a year that NMSU had to practice and play out of Phoenix and had 10 games canceled or moved because of covid.  NMSU had a major down year, yet they still got the the WAC championship game.  NMSU owns the WAC and went to the NCAA several times in the WAC that included Boise, Nevada, Utah State, etc.  How is GCU more attractive in basketball than NMSU?  So strange...

 

GCU doesn't have football so they can balance out Hawaii.  They are  "new money" and in a nice location.  Those are a few reasons.  

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17 hours ago, ph90702 said:

Hawaii is a further trip for every member than to CSU or AF.  Also, as an illustration, for UNLV, it would be a shorter flight to NYC (2,250 miles) than Hawaii (2,750 miles).  It’s even shorter for San Diego State to go to NYC (2,450 miles) than Hawaii (2,600 miles).

All true.  And if geography matters — and I think it should — then AFA annd CSU shouldn’t be seriously considering moving all of their sports to a conference with members in Philadelphia, Greenville and Tampa.  But these are the crazy times we live in.

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2 hours ago, HawaiiMongoose said:

So you're saying NMSU would be willing to join the MWC for Olympic sports but remain an independent in football?  I find it hard to believe the NMSU administration would go for that, otherwise of course the Aggies would be on the basketball candidate short list.

I was responding to the OP and the notion that GCU should be considered for inclusion to the MWC as a basketball only member. 

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1 hour ago, HawaiiMongoose said:

All true.  And if geography matters — and I think it should — then AFA annd CSU shouldn’t be seriously considering moving all of their sports to a conference with members in Philadelphia, Greenville and Tampa.  But these are the crazy times we live in.

I agree.  For the OP, I was pointing out that adding Hawaii makes travel harder.  As far as a conference goes, ideally the farthest two schools would only be 1,000 miles apart at most.

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