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shizzle787

The next dominoes of conference realignment.

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Though it doesn’t necessarily make a lot of sense for CSU to leave the MWC to join the AAC at first glance.  I can kind of see a few reasons why they might strongly consider it.  Some of the reasons are factual, some are opinions based on how the media tends to portray western teams / conferences and some of the reasons come from making the assumption that Boise State indeed is invited to join the Big 12 within a few years.

Reasons for CSU to consider leaving the MWC to join the AAC would be the following:
1.  No longer are tied to the Boise State special TV distribution deal.
2.  No longer would need to compete against Boise State in the Mountain Division and may find themselves more competitive in a weakened AAC (no UCF, No Cincinatti and to a degree No Houston).
3.  East Coast media bias.  There is a reason that every expansion team the Big 12 seems to invite comes from either Big East remnants or from the AAC (exception being TCU though they did agree to join the Big East first, they never played in it).  And even though I agree with Thompson, which is rare, that the AAC beating the P6 drum didn’t get them included and are in the same group of five boat per say.  The AAC boat, because of the East Coast Media bias is more like a yacht instead of the canoe the MWC is portrayed to be floating around in.
4.  If Boise State does get invited to join the Big 12, the media value within the MWC will tank even with the special deal going away.  CBS has Tier 1, Fox has Tier 2 (except for Boise State), Fox appears to mainly be in it for Boise State and no other reason.
5.  CSU could have quite a few games televised on ESPN which has more viewership than FS1 or on ESPN 2 / ESPNU which tends to have more viewership than CBS Sports Network.  ESPN+, though not the greatest quality, does provide any CSU fan the opportunity to watch all of their games.
6.  Because many of the teams CSU would face are either in the Central or Eastern Time Zone, they may end up with more slightly earlier game times especially when on the road which again provides more possible eyeballs watching the game.
7.  I would suspect CSU could be more competitive in the AAC and with being more successful, comes more positive media attention.
8.  If and when the Big 12 expands, it could raise CSUs profile when the Big 12 considers expanding again.  Goes back to the East Coast Media bias and the Big 12 Conference, the most likely conference to expand with either an AAC or MWC team, tending to focus more on the teams from the AAC.
9.  History reflects that when an eastern conference football and/or basketball team performs well, they get far more positive media backing when compared to teams that are performing well in the west.  Example:  Big East had the special status prior to 2013 but one could argue the MWC was stronger with Utah, TCU and BYU from 2006-2010 and stronger with Boise State & TCU from 2011-2012.  PAC 12 gets less positive media attention than even the ACC (which is Clemson only), Big 12 (Oklahoma only) tends to get.
10.  Boise State will most likely always garner special attention from CBS, ESPN & FOX.  That spotlight on Boise State, provides a very myopic view of the MWC.  So unless someone else within the MWC wins the conference regularly, like San Diego State did for a couple of years, very little of that light is displayed on the rest of the MWC teams.

Reasons to stay tends to be based off of CSU keeping their rivals (which I’m all for in this day and age) and playing in their own geographical region which will most likely negatively impact attendance at games.  If Air Force goes with them, well, they at least get one of their rivals.  If the current TV revenue the AAC is making can be maintained, and that is a big “IF”, CSU may find it worth taking a risk even if attendance drops a bit.  Granted, if CSU wins while in the AAC, the attendance will get better.  Just like if they would win more often in the MWC.  Frequently winning games can solve or alleviate a lot of problems.

Just offering an opinion on why CSU and/or Air Force might consider a change in conference.  Granted I don’t post that often, so I maybe way off on the assumptions I’ve made.
 

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1 hour ago, hukilauh said:

Though it doesn’t necessarily make a lot of sense for CSU to leave the MWC to join the AAC at first glance.  I can kind of see a few reasons why they might strongly consider it.  Some of the reasons are factual, some are opinions based on how the media tends to portray western teams / conferences and some of the reasons come from making the assumption that Boise State indeed is invited to join the Big 12 within a few years.

Reasons for CSU to consider leaving the MWC to join the AAC would be the following:
1.  No longer are tied to the Boise State special TV distribution deal.
2.  No longer would need to compete against Boise State in the Mountain Division and may find themselves more competitive in a weakened AAC (no UCF, No Cincinatti and to a degree No Houston).
3.  East Coast media bias.  There is a reason that every expansion team the Big 12 seems to invite comes from either Big East remnants or from the AAC (exception being TCU though they did agree to join the Big East first, they never played in it).  And even though I agree with Thompson, which is rare, that the AAC beating the P6 drum didn’t get them included and are in the same group of five boat per say.  The AAC boat, because of the East Coast Media bias is more like a yacht instead of the canoe the MWC is portrayed to be floating around in.
4.  If Boise State does get invited to join the Big 12, the media value within the MWC will tank even with the special deal going away.  CBS has Tier 1, Fox has Tier 2 (except for Boise State), Fox appears to mainly be in it for Boise State and no other reason.
5.  CSU could have quite a few games televised on ESPN which has more viewership than FS1 or on ESPN 2 / ESPNU which tends to have more viewership than CBS Sports Network.  ESPN+, though not the greatest quality, does provide any CSU fan the opportunity to watch all of their games.
6.  Because many of the teams CSU would face are either in the Central or Eastern Time Zone, they may end up with more slightly earlier game times especially when on the road which again provides more possible eyeballs watching the game.
7.  I would suspect CSU could be more competitive in the AAC and with being more successful, comes more positive media attention.
8.  If and when the Big 12 expands, it could raise CSUs profile when the Big 12 considers expanding again.  Goes back to the East Coast Media bias and the Big 12 Conference, the most likely conference to expand with either an AAC or MWC team, tending to focus more on the teams from the AAC.
9.  History reflects that when an eastern conference football and/or basketball team performs well, they get far more positive media backing when compared to teams that are performing well in the west.  Example:  Big East had the special status prior to 2013 but one could argue the MWC was stronger with Utah, TCU and BYU from 2006-2010 and stronger with Boise State & TCU from 2011-2012.  PAC 12 gets less positive media attention than even the ACC (which is Clemson only), Big 12 (Oklahoma only) tends to get.
10.  Boise State will most likely always garner special attention from CBS, ESPN & FOX.  That spotlight on Boise State, provides a very myopic view of the MWC.  So unless someone else within the MWC wins the conference regularly, like San Diego State did for a couple of years, very little of that light is displayed on the rest of the MWC teams.

Reasons to stay tends to be based off of CSU keeping their rivals (which I’m all for in this day and age) and playing in their own geographical region which will most likely negatively impact attendance at games.  If Air Force goes with them, well, they at least get one of their rivals.  If the current TV revenue the AAC is making can be maintained, and that is a big “IF”, CSU may find it worth taking a risk even if attendance drops a bit.  Granted, if CSU wins while in the AAC, the attendance will get better.  Just like if they would win more often in the MWC.  Frequently winning games can solve or alleviate a lot of problems.

Just offering an opinion on why CSU and/or Air Force might consider a change in conference.  Granted I don’t post that often, so I maybe way off on the assumptions I’ve made.
 

My response.

Not worried about Boise State and their special deal.  It won't last and it's not CSU's job to deal with that.

If CSU wants to leave to join a weaker conference in order to get a better record, I'm done with my alma mater.  Play the best teams you can and if you're not good enough, get better.

I can't anticipate any better income in the AAC.  It might have a better spin to it, but no.  The money will not get better over there, despite having to live on ESPN+.

This myth about CSU attendance is hilarious.  You can base your total opinion on one game against Boise with a dead man walking coach at CSU the day after a blizzard, but the fact is that we've played only two home games this year and are averaging over 30K attendance.  ECU isn't going to improve that.

If we go to the AAC we can bank on being the conferences late night game for every home game, and probably some away games.  TV will definitely not get better.

Again, this has nothing to do with Boise.  If Boise and SDSU bail on the MWC, we're on board with the wagon train.  That ain't happening.  CSU's best future lies in staying put and getting better, not running away and succeeding in a lesser conference.

Our administration doesn't have the brains that God gave geese, so I guess it'll be farewell MWC, but it will be the dumbest decision in the history of The Colorado State University and booster funding will find the red in a very big hurry.

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I don't know, like I said I don't see AFA or CSU leaving for AAC, Just yea don't see it happening to me makes really no sense because the costs would cancel out anything else that would happen and they could have left before but didn't. Rice was in MWC before and wanted to leave so they won't be coming back again.

I mean really only logical choices it seems would be North Texas and UTSA to expand but does nothing just like AFA and CSU does nothing for AAC except creates more costs for schools. 

 

But just in truth let's just blow it all up then, blow up all the conferences, and have everyone play whoever they want. 

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7 hours ago, Headbutt said:

I have no idea whether this hot rumor has legs or not.  I do know that the overwhelming sentiment of CSU fans is to NOT go to the AAC.  I do know that a number of boosters have relayed that sentiment to the BOG.  Our President and AD do seem to have the common sense and intellect of your average pocket gopher, so it is possible, but I'm going to call it very unlikely.

Now, I read all these musings from those outside the MWC on what should happen next and if they are even close to correct, the rest of this conference needs to go with us if it should happen.  Pretty much all of those scenarios leave a good conference with some really good programs mired in eternal mediocrity.

Folks couldn't save this crapfest conspiracy garbage for the offseason?

Sadly CSU has made bad decisions since blowing up the WAC which cost the holiday bowl.     

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Yes, CSU cost the MWC the Holiday Bowl.  They also invented Covid.

That was dumb.

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On 9/22/2021 at 8:12 PM, shizzle787 said:

The draw for Air Force is eastern exposure and playing Navy in conference to free up an OOC game. Colorado State also is probably interested in eastern exposure and tagging along with their buddy. 

 

If the USAFA want to go East:  F' our "buddy."

CSU is a WESTERN UNIVERSITY in the Inter-Mtn West.  We need to stay w/our buddies (wyo, NewMX, Utah St, Nevada Northern, Diego & FresNO).

We looked East for 2-recent coaches (Bobo & HCSAddazio) & look at what's that has gotten us.

HUGE MISTAKE:  if los Rammies for sake the MWC & go East 

 

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On 9/22/2021 at 8:09 PM, Big Frog II said:

Air Force and CSU joining the ARESCO ATHLETIC CONFERENCE makes no sense what so ever.  Do they think SMU, Tulane, Tulsa, and Memphis are going to be big draws? 

Never underestimate the power of The Farce.

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15 hours ago, Headbutt said:

Our administration doesn't have the brains that God gave geese, so I guess it'll be farewell MWC, but it will be the dumbest decision in the history of The Colorado State University and booster funding will find the red in a very big hurry.

I first seriously thought about SDSU needing to look to get out of the MWC when it was announced Utah would join the Pac, which was 11 years ago. I started comparing SDSU with other MWC members in terms of chances for B12 membership in the future time because a long time poster on the old Aztectalk board had started a lengthy, persuasive thread explaining how that just might be possible. (One thing he said which hadn't occurred to most of us was that SD doesn't just have a much larger airport than Boise, SD is actually no farther west.) As to CSU, I remember thinking it was a much better candidate than SDSU because CU had left for the Pac, there were solid rumors CSU was going to build itself a new stadium, that although CSU football had similarly been down for several years, the Rams had previously had an impressive run under Sonny Lubick, and that CSU had a considerably higher academic ranking with USNWR.

Well, although CSU got the stadium built, that hasn't seemed to help the football team one iota and in the meantime, SDSU will open ITS new stadium next year. Also, over the last 11 years the Chargers have left SD and SDSU's football program has improved significantly while CSU's program continues to flounder. And USNWR now ranks SDSU academics at the same level as CSU's.

Ft. Collins is a great town in a beautiful location but it seems that, as you say, CSU's administration hasn't been doing much to take advantage of that.

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23 hours ago, Antarctic79 said:

If AFA bolts to the AAC which I honestly think would be good for them.  They'd be exposed to two more time zones where their alumni could attend games.  Would AFA prefer to park their Olympic sports in a Conference other than the AAC to be more competitive like Navy? 

It's also overlooked that travel doesn't bring the same problems for the Air Force Academy that it does for CSU. AFA doesn't have to charter flights if it doesn't want to. That's because the Air Force OWNS planes and HAS ITS OWN PILOTS.

To me there are far more reasons for the AFA to join the AAC for football and move its Olys into a minor league conference than it does for the AFA to remain in the MWC.

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12 hours ago, GoState99755 said:

 

If the USAFA want to go East:  F' our "buddy."

CSU is a WESTERN UNIVERSITY in the Inter-Mtn West.  We need to stay w/our buddies (wyo, NewMX, Utah St, Nevada Northern, Diego & FresNO).

We looked East for 2-recent coaches (Bobo & HCSAddazio) & look at what's that has gotten us.

HUGE MISTAKE:  if los Rammies for sake the MWC & go East 

 

In order for Thompson to keep CSU in the MWC I can see only one possible argument.  

Chewy Defense.jpg

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2 hours ago, 818SUDSFan said:

I first seriously thought about SDSU needing to look to get out of the MWC when it was announced Utah would join the Pac, which was 11 years ago. I started comparing SDSU with other MWC members in terms of chances for B12 membership in the future time because a long time poster on the old Aztectalk board had started a lengthy, persuasive thread explaining how that just might be possible. (One thing he said which hadn't occurred to most of us was that SD doesn't just have a much larger airport than Boise, SD is actually no farther west.) As to CSU, I remember thinking it was a much better candidate than SDSU because CU had left for the Pac, there were solid rumors CSU was going to build itself a new stadium, that although CSU football had similarly been down for several years, the Rams had previously had an impressive run under Sonny Lubick, and that CSU had a considerably higher academic ranking with USNWR.

Well, although CSU got the stadium built, that hasn't seemed to help the football team one iota and in the meantime, SDSU will open ITS new stadium next year. Also, over the last 11 years the Chargers have left SD and SDSU's football program has improved significantly while CSU's program continues to flounder. And USNWR now ranks SDSU academics at the same level as CSU's.

Ft. Collins is a great town in a beautiful location but it seems that, as you say, CSU's administration hasn't been doing much to take advantage of that.

At one point, not long ago, an unnamed MWC asst. coach was quoted as saying basically that CSU has done less with more than any school he can think of.  It was reported as an unnamed assistant.

I'd say Rocky was spot on with that comment.

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15 hours ago, sactowndog said:

Add 4 Texas schools and move them west 

What is the point of adding schools from Texas?  Why can’t people do simple math? This is a net loss for all schools MWC. 

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2 hours ago, 818SUDSFan said:

It's also overlooked that travel doesn't bring the same problems for the Air Force Academy that it does for CSU. AFA doesn't have to charter flights if it doesn't want to. That's because the Air Force OWNS planes and HAS ITS OWN PILOTS.

To me there are far more reasons for the AFA to join the AAC for football and move its Olys into a minor league conference than it does for the AFA to remain in the MWC.

You think AFA can fly wherever, whenever for no $$? I don’t buy that. 

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3 minutes ago, NevadaFan said:

What is the point of adding schools from Texas?  Why can’t people do simple math? This is a net loss for all schools MWC. 

Not if it improves the TV money.

Adding UTEP, UNT, Texas St and UTSA would pretty much increase our population base to almost double what we have now.  Now how much is that worth for our TV partners is up to them.

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2 hours ago, 818SUDSFan said:

It's also overlooked that travel doesn't bring the same problems for the Air Force Academy that it does for CSU. AFA doesn't have to charter flights if it doesn't want to. That's because the Air Force OWNS planes and HAS ITS OWN PILOTS.

To me there are far more reasons for the AFA to join the AAC for football and move its Olys into a minor league conference than it does for the AFA to remain in the MWC.

You’re high if you think AFA athletes travel to games on a C-130, C-141, C-17, or a C-5. They charter or fly commercial just like everyone else does.

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16 minutes ago, sean327 said:

You’re high if you think AFA athletes travel to games on a C-130, C-141, C-17, or a C-5. They charter or fly commercial just like everyone else does.

Wait, I thought they all showed up on their training gliders!! 

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1 hour ago, NevadaFan said:

You think AFA can fly wherever, whenever for no $$? I don’t buy that. 

Where did I say "for no $$?"

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1 hour ago, NevadaFan said:

What is the point of adding schools from Texas?  Why can’t people do simple math? This is a net loss for all schools MWC. 

Depends on if you count math in a year or use discounted probabilities over the next 10-15 years.  

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53 minutes ago, sean327 said:

You’re high if you think AFA athletes travel to games on a C-130, C-141, C-17, or a C-5. They charter or fly commercial just like everyone else does.

https://gazette.com/sports/air-force-football-ditches-charter-flight-returns-to-military-roots/article_06244659-d49c-5cf0-94aa-39da9b732d1a.html

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