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Nevada Wolf Pack

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27 minutes ago, NVGiant said:

I don't follow UNLV's coaching decisions that closely, but I will fully accept your criticisms as truth. I know here Arroyo was not highly regarded by Ducks fans, so there is a history. But you have to ask yourself just why UNLV is forced to overpay for a guy that may have been fired from Oregon. Could be inept leadership. Could be that up-and-coming coaches are at least wary of UNLV's history as a coaching graveyard. Or some combination. I think it will take a special coach to reverse 40 years of losing, even with good facilities.

DRF overpaid and fell in love with Arroyo as the lead candidate because he's exactly like her. Someone that doesn't build anything anywhere, they just bounce around and fall upward. The guy wormed his way around at SJSU, Wyo, Cal, S. Miss, TB, Okie St for 1 year at time until he stuck around at Oregon for 3 years and his welcome was just about worn out until UNLV took him off their hands. 

What does history have to do with the present and future at any football program? What happened under coaches w, x, and y has no bearing on what Coach Z can do at UNLV. Unless there really is some mystical hex at UNLV keeping the program down. Coach A just needs to be competent. 

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2 hours ago, Rebels18 said:

DRF overpaid and fell in love with Arroyo as the lead candidate because he's exactly like her. Someone that doesn't build anything anywhere, they just bounce around and fall upward. The guy wormed his way around at SJSU, Wyo, Cal, S. Miss, TB, Okie St for 1 year at time until he stuck around at Oregon for 3 years and his welcome was just about worn out until UNLV took him off their hands. 

What does history have to do with the present and future at any football program? What happened under coaches w, x, and y has no bearing on what Coach Z can do at UNLV. Unless there really is some mystical hex at UNLV keeping the program down. Coach A just needs to be competent. 

Oh, I've been around enough coaches to know that Coach Z sees what happened with Coach W, X, and Y and says, you know, I may have a better chance to win elsewhere.

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8 hours ago, NVGiant said:

I think it's easier said than done. Facilities are great, but any coach with options has to UNLV's history and at least wonders if it's even possible to win there. Until something changes, I don't think it's seen as a good job. And finding a real difference maker that can reverse decades of history is hard under any circumstances. 

$$$.

And funny thing, Mike Leach was interested in UNLV after he was canned at Texas Tech. However, we had just hired the great Bobby Hauck that we kept instead. Smart move, yeah? But can you imagine Mike Leach at UNLV? It coulda happened, lol.

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13 minutes ago, 4UNLV said:

$$$.

And funny thing, Mike Leach was interested in UNLV after he was canned at Texas Tech. However, we had just hired the great Bobby Hauck that we kept instead. Smart move, yeah? But can you imagine Mike Leach at UNLV? It coulda happened, lol.

There was also, some interest from Nevada at the same time. I don't know, Leach doesn't catch me as a UNLV type coach though

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39 minutes ago, wolfpack1 said:

There was also, some interest from Nevada at the same time. I don't know, Leach doesn't catch me as a UNLV type coach though

Of course he doesn't, lol. No real coach would strike you as a UNLV type coach, am I right? But we had just hired Bobby Hauck anyway, we weren't looking at Leach, he was looking at UNLV.

 

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13 minutes ago, 4UNLV said:

Of course he doesn't, lol. No real coach would strike you as a UNLV type coach, am I right? But we had just hired Bobby Hauck anyway, we weren't looking at Leach, he was looking at UNLV.

 

I guess that’s what needs to happen then. Find a recently fired coach with a brilliant offensive mind and a radioactive reputation looking to rehab his career. And even then, if given the choice Leach still would’ve gone to Washington State because they can pay more and it’s a better job.

This isn’t basketball. Every school in non-power conferences is at a huge disadvantage, and UNLV has forever struggled to compete even amongst its peers. It’s been a coaching graveyard since forever. I think if they find that coach, it’s because they made a real shrewd hire of someone cocky enough and young enough to take on the risk. I don’t think a retread is where you’ll find him, unless there are special down-on-his-luck circumstances like post-Texas Tech Leach.
 

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2 hours ago, 4UNLV said:

$$$.

And funny thing, Mike Leach was interested in UNLV after he was canned at Texas Tech. However, we had just hired the great Bobby Hauck that we kept instead. Smart move, yeah? But can you imagine Mike Leach at UNLV? It coulda happened, lol.

I imagine that you might get another chance at Leach.  I haven't seen anything to make me think that his system will work in the SEC.  Not that it means much, but they were picked to finish last in their division this year.  Mississippi State may give him plenty of chances, but at his age, I can see another stop in his future.

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1 hour ago, 4UNLV said:

Of course he doesn't, lol. No real coach would strike you as a UNLV type coach, am I right? But we had just hired Bobby Hauck anyway, we weren't looking at Leach, he was looking at UNLV.

 

I don't know really, maybe a coach that is low on his luck, looking for a restart with nothing to loose? Maybe someone fired from another university, under none suspicious circumstances.

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11 hours ago, 4UNLV said:

Of course he doesn't, lol. No real coach would strike you as a UNLV type coach, am I right? But we had just hired Bobby Hauck anyway, we weren't looking at Leach, he was looking at UNLV.

 

 

Jeff Horton does :D

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5 hours ago, masterfrog said:

I imagine that you might get another chance at Leach.  I haven't seen anything to make me think that his system will work in the SEC.  Not that it means much, but they were picked to finish last in their division this year.  Mississippi State may give him plenty of chances, but at his age, I can see another stop in his future.

I wasn't saying I wanted Mike Leach, I said that he was interested in UNLV 10 or 12 years ago, in response to wolf pack saying no actual coach would be interested in UNLV. My point was, PAY a decent proven coach what they want, instead of rolling the dice on an assistant, and see what happens.

And btw, so was Ed Orgeron after he was passed over while the interim coach at USC. But again... Bobby Hauck. I think coaches are out there that would come to UNLV, but they weren't going to do it for $3-500K. You get what you pay for.

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5 hours ago, 4UNLV said:

I wasn't saying I wanted Mike Leach, I said that he was interested in UNLV 10 or 12 years ago, in response to wolf pack saying no actual coach would be interested in UNLV. My point was, PAY a decent proven coach what they want, instead of rolling the dice on an assistant, and see what happens.

And btw, so was Ed Orgeron after he was passed over while the interim coach at USC. But again... Bobby Hauck. I think coaches are out there that would come to UNLV, but they weren't going to do it for $3-500K. You get what you pay for.

Bobby Hauck just beat Washington while coaching Montana. Sanford was definitely a solid coach that was canned a year too early. 

UNLV has had some decent coaches (Outside of Sanchez, I won't defend them hiring a HS coach), there are obviously some internal program issues that no one is able to overcome. The last 5 hires have covered every possible option for a G5 program:

P5 retread - John Robinson

Up and Coming Coordinator - Mike Sanford

Dominant FCS Coach - Bobby Hauck

HS Coach - Tony Sanchez

And now back to the up and coming coordinator with Arroyo. All of these coaches were successful elsewhere but couldn't cut it at UNLV. At a certain point you need to look in the mirror to find what the issue is. 

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19 hours ago, NVGiant said:

Oh, I've been around enough coaches to know that Coach Z sees what happened with Coach W, X, and Y and says, you know, I may have a better chance to win elsewhere.

What happened to W, X, Y to deter Coach Z though? Did Sanford, Hauck, or Sanchez not get a fair shake or something?? It's the same deal at UNLV as anywhere else: you have 5 years to show significant progress in positively building the program or you're fired. How's it UNLV's fault that these guys couldn't get it done given half a decade to work with? There's schools out there with less resources than UNLV that haven't been nearly as bad. 

They all got 5-years at a school with middle-tier mid-major resources:  Sanford went 16-43, Hauck went 15-49, and ironically the highschool coach who UNLV got mocked the most over hiring did the 'best' at 20-40.

The highschool guy also secured $35 million for facility upgrades that the AD who fired him got to take credit for and put on her resume to Mizzou. 

 

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11 minutes ago, Rebels18 said:

What happened to W, X, Y to deter Coach Z though? Did Sanford, Hauck, or Sanchez not get a fair shake or something?? It's the same deal at UNLV as anywhere else: you have 5 years to show significant progress in positively building the program or you're fired. How's it UNLV's fault that these guys couldn't get it done given half a decade to work with? There's schools out there with less resources than UNLV that haven't been nearly as bad. 

They all got 5-years at a school with middle-tier mid-major resources:  Sanford went 16-43, Hauck went 15-49, and ironically the highschool coach who UNLV got mocked the most over hiring did the 'best' at 20-40.

The highschool guy also secured $35 million for facility upgrades that the AD who fired him got to take credit for and put on her resume to Mizzou. 

 

Hauck was able to get UNLV to a bowl game and the programs best season in the last 20+ years. Sanford finished 5-7 twice in a MUCH tougher conference. The team he coached that beat Arizona State and Iowa State likely would've gone 8-4 in the current MW.

Sanchez was more consistently able to get 4 wins, but was never close to having a winning team, unlike the prior two which were fired too soon Sanchez was given too much time.  

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Just now, Rebels18 said:

What happened to W, X, Y to deter Coach Z though? Did Sanford, Hauck, or Sanchez not get a fair shake or something?? It's the same deal at UNLV as anywhere else: you have 5 years to show significant progress in positively building the program or you're fired. How's it UNLV's fault that these guys couldn't get it done given half a decade to work with? There's schools out there with less resources than UNLV that haven't been nearly as bad. 

They all got 5-years at a school with middle-tier mid-major resources:  Sanford went 16-43, Hauck went 15-49, and ironically the highschool coach who UNLV got mocked the most over hiring did the 'best' at 20-40.

The highschool guy also secured $35 million for facility upgrades that the AD who fired him got to take credit for and put on her resume to Mizzou. 

 

The history of losing is the deterrent. I don't know why they always fail but I do know every coach for 40 years has failed, unless you count Harvey Hyde. Who, you know, bent a rule here and there. Coaches notice that sort of thing. Unlike in basketball, UNLV football has no brand. No tradition. No culture of winning. The facilities are great now, but most schools have great facilities (my alma mater a notable exception).

Not every coach is willing to take on that challenge of trying to turn around a program that isn't just bad, but historically one of the worst FBS programs. In fact, most coaches are pretty risk averse. And among the group of coaches who are either confident or desperate enough to pursue the job, you have to identify the guy who actually CAN turn it around. That's harder still. Obviously, UNLV has potential. But it's going to take someone special to turn around all those decades of ineptitude, in my opinion.

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On 9/21/2021 at 4:03 PM, bsu_alum9 said:

 

Would cost them about $4 million to fire him.  But if you consider how much they are losing in ticket sale potential ($500k+ per game) it might be worth it to cut their losses early.  But could anyone win in Vegas?

Harvey Hyde did !

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On 9/22/2021 at 9:00 PM, NVGiant said:

Jokes aside, It just seems no matter what UNLV tries they are doomed. Over the last 40 years they’ve tried the aging legendary coach, poaching a rival’s head coach, assistants from high-profile programs, successful FCS head coaches, and even a high school coach. Outside of an outlier year here and there, it’s the same result coach after coach. Whatever their issues, clearly it’s not just coaching. I don’t know what would work. An guy like Nick Saban or urban Meyer could turn that thing around but those guys are really hard to find.

 

And they would bail for a P5 program the first chance they had.

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On 9/23/2021 at 12:10 PM, NVGiant said:

I don't follow UNLV's coaching decisions that closely, but I will fully accept your criticisms as truth. I know here Arroyo was not highly regarded by Ducks fans, so there is a history. But you have to ask yourself just why UNLV is forced to overpay for a guy that may have been fired from Oregon. Could be inept leadership. Could be that up-and-coming coaches are at least wary of UNLV's history as a coaching graveyard. Or some combination. I think it will take a special coach to reverse 40 years of losing, even with good facilities.

I would add to that the boatload of Vegas kids playing ball in the MW, PAC, and FCS level just not at UNLV.

Why are they leaving Vegas to play ball ?

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3 hours ago, bigd said:

Hauck was able to get UNLV to a bowl game and the programs best season in the last 20+ years. Sanford finished 5-7 twice in a MUCH tougher conference. The team he coached that beat Arizona State and Iowa State likely would've gone 8-4 in the current MW.

Sanchez was more consistently able to get 4 wins, but was never close to having a winning team, unlike the prior two which were fired too soon Sanchez was given too much time.  

The rebels won those games IN SPITE of Hauck. Hauck just happened to be the coach at UNLV when Caleb Herring decided to take over the season and win those games. Nick whatever his name was was falling flat on his face, the rebs were down 21-0 in the 3rd quarter against Central Michigan and Herring convinced him to let him play, the rest played their hearts out for Caleb. I watched the attitude change as soon as he went in (I kept my tickets on the front row for that reason). Sanchez did a better job with the fundamentals, and coaching than Hauck did. All Hauck wanted to do was trick plays. Here's the thing about Hauck, and I remember Montana fans saying this when he came here...he can maintain a successful program, but he can't build one. He either made no effort here, or was just way out of his league. Good for him for beating Washington, he's back where he belongs.

Sanford WAS better than Hauck, no doubt. Everybody was better than Hauck, including Sanchez.

 

3 hours ago, Spaztecs said:

I would add to that the boatload of Vegas kids playing ball in the MW, PAC, and FCS level just not at UNLV.

Why are they leaving Vegas to play ball ?

Hauck never set foot in a high school in Las Vegas. I don't think even once, the local coaches spoke often about never seeing him there to recruit, and players going elsewhere said the same. Stupid. I don't remember about Sanford, I had a lot going on then. Sanchez couldn't for several years because he had coached at Gorman, and had to get special permission to recruit a kid from there. He did get a few from around town, just not the ones that you noticed elsewhere.

But why would a kid go to UNLV when they have options like USC, Stanford, Ohio St, etc., who also have great coaches, and they get to WIN. They could even win in Fresno, for hell's sake, lol, but they've had better COACHES.

For once I'd like to see UNLV make an  actual effort to improve their football program, which includes spending a buck for a decent coach. Not a washed up retread (although he did ok until he took over AD duties, then it went right to sh*t), not an assistant, not an FCS coach, not a high school coach. $$$ will get one here, especially now. Sometimes you have to spend money to make money, yeah? If they don't do that, the rebs will forever be limited in what they can do, or where they can go. Can you imagine where UNLV would be right now with a decent football program? We've got a ton of advantages here, including being in Las Vegas itself, just once I'd like to get a real coach and see what happens.

Now I gotta go win powerball so I can buy the rebs a coach.

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9 hours ago, Spaztecs said:

Harvey Hyde did !

 

In 1984, four of those wins over programs that no longer exist (Wichita State, CSU Fullerton, Pacific and LBSU).  And of course, that whole season was later vacated by the NCAA :ph34r: 

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