Conference Realignment thread

[thespywhozaggedme]

On 12/11/2022 at 4:53 PM, UNLV2001 said:

 

Gonzaga might only be because of Mark Few.........once he retires or leaves, does Gonzaga remain what is has become ?!?! 

And does Gonzaga remain a top 10 program going up against a better PAC schedule every season 

Programs rise and fall, and Gonzaga adds nothing beyond the immediate BB program -- Doesn't even add Market share because Spokane was always WSU territory 

25 years is a pretty long “immediate“. Just saying.

[SalinasSpartan]

On 12/11/2022 at 2:25 PM, roughrider said:

PAC hoops could use it.  TV bosses may like it.   Not sure of the real value of hoops wrt to TV money when you compare to football though. 

The question is how much does Gonzaga get with no football addition to the conference?  And Gonzaga might prefer the B12 based on hoops strength.  Lots of variables in any moves. 

This stuff is like the magma on the big island;  it just flows where it wants and everyone has to react.   We aren't close to done with this stuff.  B10, B12 hold the cards it seems.  The PAC is at their mercy and there is no quarter taken in realignment.

The B10 and SEC hold all the cards in a way that no other conference does; all conferences react to what those two do. They are the only conferences that can truly plan long term, meaning past the next round of TV contracts. 

I don’t think what Gonzaga prefers is all that relevant here because they have no real leverage with the Big 12 or Pac-?. They can play this game with the MWC and WCC, but the Big 12 and Pac-? Could take them or leave them and will only make a deal that makes sense for THEM. 

[SalinasSpartan]

On 12/11/2022 at 3:04 PM, thespywhozaggedme said:

25 years is a pretty long “immediate“. Just saying.

A new conference doesn’t get retroactive credit for the years that Gonzaga has been great. 

[SalinasSpartan]

On 12/11/2022 at 3:00 PM, RSF said:

Incorrect.  DePaul and Marquette, as members of the Big East, are part of the 'P6'.

 

And DePaul, while highly rated at the time (4 #1 seeds in 5 years), did not make the Final 4 in 80, 81 or 82.  They made in '79 led by freshman Mark Agguire, but lost to Larry Bird and Indiana State in the semis.

Agreed, the Big East is a power conference in basketball. If anybody wanted to say there is a P5 on basketball it would be because the Pac-12 doesn’t make the cut, but the Big East is unquestionably on that level. 

[roughrider]

On 12/11/2022 at 4:25 PM, SalinasSpartan said:

The B10 and SEC hold all the cards in a way that no other conference does; all conferences react to what those two do. They are the only conferences that can truly plan long term, meaning past the next round of TV contracts. 

I don’t think what Gonzaga prefers is all that relevant here because they have no real leverage with the Big 12 or Pac-?. They can play this game with the MWC and WCC, but the Big 12 and Pac-? Could take them or leave them and will only make a deal that makes sense for THEM. 

The B12 holds the cards over the PAC.  I'm just talking about the west here.  The B10 can eat the PAC if it wants to.  But the B12 is solid and will take interviews from all the leftovers if the B10 gets even greedier.

[Gonzagafan2021]

Does anyone watch the monty show? They do a lot of PAC 12 Coverage

[roughrider]

On 12/11/2022 at 3:40 PM, UNLV2001 said:

Some programs are maybe only as good as the coach who made the program...........there's a number of CBB programs that fell off the map once the "main guy" departed.

UNLV has been hit & miss since Tarkanian

DePaul is a shadow of the program under Ray Meyer & 3 Final Fours in a row (80, 81,82) 

Marquette has been up & down since Al Maguire

USF was a powerhouse once

All the above programs are not part of the P5 and when they fall off these days it's hard to get it back 

If Gonzaga falls off or returns to their long time norm, then they are just another WCC small catholic school program ..........That's a lot for the PAC to risk on a one program school that brings nothing else to the table 

Sure it's happened many times before.   But Monson got that thing rolling just before Few.  It's got it's own life perhaps.  We'll find out in time. 

And IMO UCLA had the hardest replacement gig, ever.  And while they've had some downs, they are still UCLA.   We're now watching Duke and North Carolina both go through the transition so we'll have more data points soon.

[Spaztecs]

On 12/11/2022 at 4:35 PM, roughrider said:

Sure it's happened many times before.   But Monson got that thing rolling just before Few.  It's got it's own life perhaps.  We'll find out in time. 

And IMO UCLA had the hardest replacement gig, ever.  And while they've had some downs, they are still UCLA.   We're now watching Duke and North Carolina both go through the transition so we'll have more data points soon.

Duke is a valid comparison post Coach K.

The Heels have had many Championship quality Coaches 

[Spaztecs]

In the case of Gonzaga, they are looking out for themselves.

As to the MW, they are just a useful leverage for the Zags

Personally, I think Wazzu might object, but if it brings more $ to the PAC Schools, they're in.

New12 travel might be a hinderance to them.

I think Gonzaga is trying to leverage both Conferences for their benefit.

[WAC_FAN]

WAC and A-Sun officially merging and plans to be a new FBS conference.

[RamSack]

On 12/9/2022 at 10:12 PM, thespywhozaggedme said:

From one of Gonzaga‘s main insiders. Take it for what it’s worth:
 

 

basketballzag

Zag for Life

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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#223

Today, 05:53 PM

P12 is going to blow up once UCLA/USC both bolt because Arizona, Utah, ASU, and Colorado are also in advanced talks with the Big 12. The remainder of the Pac 12 (minus Oregon & Washington) will join the mountain west.

Where are Oregon and Washington going in your doomsday scenario?
 

The P12 will take SDSU and maybe another MW school once USC and UCLA bolt. If Arizona, ASU, UU and CU leave, the P12 will then cherry pick a few more schools from the MW and possibly another conference. The P12 will survive.

[SalinasSpartan]

On 12/11/2022 at 3:31 PM, roughrider said:

The B12 holds the cards over the PAC.  I'm just talking about the west here.  The B10 can eat the PAC if it wants to.  But the B12 is solid and will take interviews from all the leftovers if the B10 gets even greedier.

I think putting any conference in the same sentence as the B1G and SEC is just silly. As you literally say in this post, the B1G can “eat the PAC if it wants to”. The B1G, and ONLY the B1G will decide what happens out west. Period. If the B1G decides they want more Pac-? Schools, they will get those schools. Then after the B1G has its fill and leaves, sure, the Big 12 would obviously be in a position to pick the bones of the carcass. If the B1G decides the Pac-? Is not on the menu, then the Big 12 isn’t eating anything. Because if Pac schools were going to jump, they would have already. They didn’t. It’s not happening unless the B1G decides to act. 

The Big 12 (and ACC, and Pac) are reactionary conferences now, just like all the other conferences. Now that the B1G and SEC have dictated that power conference realignment has ended for now is the Big 12 in the best position of the 3? Absolutely. But all of those three conferences exist in their current forms because the power 2 allows them to. 

[SalinasSpartan]

On 12/11/2022 at 5:25 PM, Spaztecs said:

In the case of Gonzaga, they are looking out for themselves.

As to the MW, they are just a useful leverage for the Zags

Personally, I think Wazzu might object, but if it brings more $ to the PAC Schools, they're in.

New12 travel might be a hinderance to them.

I think Gonzaga is trying to leverage both Conferences for their benefit.

But they aren’t really in a position to “leverage” anything. I mean, the amount of money Gonzaga can bring isn’t this entirely theoretical and unknowable thing, we can just look at the WCC TV deal…. Both the Big 12 and Pac-? Schools will bring in more money per year than the entire WCC did, with BYU… who is obviously already in the Big 12. 

Look, I don’t doubt that Gonzaga could be added in some kind of way that could add some value to either conference. But the idea that they are in some power position here is just laughable. 

[fanhood]

On 12/12/2022 at 2:31 AM, roughrider said:

The B12 holds the cards over the PAC.  I'm just talking about the west here.  The B10 can eat the PAC if it wants to.  But the B12 is solid and will take interviews from all the leftovers if the B10 gets even greedier.

The B12 holds zero cards "over the PAC."

None of the remaining Pac10 teams are going to join a conference with UCF, West Virginia, Houston, and Iowa State in it, unless they are in a doomsday scenario. 

Per your B1G comment, they are just as likely to take Kansas, as they are Oregon or Washington. 

[roughrider]

On 12/12/2022 at 12:56 AM, fanhood said:

The B12 holds zero cards "over the PAC."

None of the remaining Pac10 teams are going to join a conference with UCF, West Virginia, Houston, and Iowa State in it, unless they are in a doomsday scenario. 

Per your B1G comment, they are just as likely to take Kansas, as they are Oregon or Washington. 

the PAC is a dead man walking if the B10 says so, and the  B12 is taking interviews now for PAC leftovers

[RSF]

On 12/11/2022 at 8:35 PM, WAC_FAN said:

WAC and A-Sun officially merging and plans to be a new FBS conference.

No, they are not.  The football schools of both conferences are intending to form a separate football only league.  The 2 leagues would remain separate for everything else.  The problem they may encounter is, while FCS allows football only leagues (Pioneer and Missouri Valley Football Conference), FBS generally does not.  It'll take them several years to get the schools up to that level anyways (if they ever do).

[NorCalCoug]

On 12/12/2022 at 6:50 AM, roughrider said:

the PAC is a dead man walking if the B10 says so, and the  B12 is taking interviews now for PAC leftovers

Again, the B1G will not stand pat with this  geographic arrangement long term.  There will be more westward expansion.  It’s just a matter of time.  The only people that will be surprised when it happens are the well-known PAC Kool Aid drinkers on this board.  RIP PAC.

[Someone Else]

28 minutes ago, NorCalCoug said:

Again, the B1G will not stand pat with this  geographic arrangement long term.  There will be more westward expansion.  It’s just a matter of time.  The only people that will be surprised when it happens are the well-known PAC Kool Aid drinkers on this board.  RIP PAC.

This is the 4th or 5th time you have posted this graphic... we get it, you like the picture.

The fact is if the B10 wants to take anyone from any conference other than the SEC, they can have their pick (they might be able to take an SEC team too if they wanted). They will do it if, and only if, it means more money to them. 

If they do it, and they certainly will at some point, it will have absolutely nothing to do with geography or westward expansion... they do not care about that... USC & UCLA do not care about that... it's about who can add value and nothing else.  

What does this mean?  It means you can stop posting this graphic.

[Gonzagafan2021]

On 12/12/2022 at 9:30 AM, NorCalCoug said:

Again, the B1G will not stand pat with this  geographic arrangement long term.  There will be more westward expansion.  It’s just a matter of time.  The only people that will be surprised when it happens are the well-known PAC Kool Aid drinkers on this board.  RIP PAC.

How come it hasn't happened yet? I mean if you were reading big 12 media the pac 12 should've died like 5 months ago

[RSF]

On 12/12/2022 at 10:06 AM, Gonzagafan2021 said:

How come it hasn't happened yet? I mean if you were reading big 12 media the pac 12 should've died like 5 months ago

Big 12 media isn't saying anything.  Because there's nothing to say.