Conference Realignment thread

[utgrizfan]

1 minute ago, nvspuds said:

It is extremely unlikely that the MW would get raided to the extent they would look to add any schools, particularly ones from FCS.  The original MW had 8 schools..The best version had 9.  

One of the things that helps a bit with the TV contracts is the PST slots to fill the broadcasting day.  They are it at the moment because the Pac 12 has their own network.  CBS/Fox and their secondary stations has been great for MWC basketball as far as exposure.  Football means night games which isn't as helpful.  It is a trade off..

MST schools also benefit..However, there are a jillion CST schools and there is a lot of schools who compete for those "tee times". 

The FCS schools that you claim are just as good as the current MW schools don't help with tv..They don't add anything the MW doesn't already have..

I wouldn't get your hopes up too high..

My hopes aren't high, it was merely me looking at things from a football competiveness standpoint. Well aware in terms of Media markets all are lacking.

[nvspuds]

Just now, utgrizfan said:

My hopes aren't high, it was merely me looking at things from a football competiveness standpoint. Well aware in terms of Media markets all are lacking.

If the conference already has enough for football they just don't need to add any football school from anywhere..Not to say they won't but said candidates would have to bring more to the table than just being another game on the schedule..Even if the school is competitive.

No FCS school at this time brings that..

[utgrizfan]

7 minutes ago, nvspuds said:

If the conference already has enough for football they just don't need to add any football school from anywhere..Not to say they won't but said candidates would have to bring more to the table than just being another game on the schedule..Even if the school is competitive.

No FCS school at this time brings that..

Again not advocating for right now. The WAC at most I feel won't be ready for an FBS jump for up to 10 years and even then that's no garuntee.

[Spaztecs]

4 hours ago, StanfordAggie said:

I don't favor adding NDSU to the MWC, but let's also give credit where credit is due. Sagarin ranked NDSU among the top 30 teams nationwide basically every year from the early 2010's up to 2019 (including FBS schools). They would have been the #1-ranked team in the MWC according to Sagarin many of those years. They have not lost to an FBS opponent in a long time and they beat several ranked FBS schools during that time period. (Indeed, most FBS schools won't even play them any more because they are too afraid of losing. NDSU was supposed to play Oregon in 2020. I'm really sad that the pandemic canceled that game, because it probably would have been one of the best OOC games of the year.) I have very little doubt that these teams would have been competitive in the MWC. NDSU has built a true football powerhouse. 

Do I think they should be invited to the MWC? No. They would have the lowest budget in the MWC by far. They play in a very small market. And even very strong FCS programs are not always successful after jumping to FBS. (I don't know about NDSU, but I know many FCS powerhouses take advantage of the fact that FBS players can transfer to them without sitting out a year. That recruiting benefit disappears when you make the jump to FBS.) But I'm also not going to say that they wouldn't be competitive in the MWC. If they are capable of beating schools like Minnesota, Kansas State, Iowa State, and Iowa (who was ranked #13 at the time), they would definitely hold their own in the MWC.

Those were one off games. Do you have the quality depth to survive an 8 game MW schedule ?

Go and look at Boise, SDSU or CSU's remaining schedule. Could you hold up against that ?

[utgrizfan]

4 minutes ago, Spaztecs said:

Those were one off games. Do you have the quality depth to survive an 8 game MW schedule ?

I think for sure they could compete with the lower echelons of the conference. SDSU beat the crap out of Colorado State in their house and I don't think they are as good as NDSU is. Consistently long-term I see it as a possibility considering if they were FBS they would be getting more scholarships and have a good reputation being the Alabama of FCS and as Giant Killers.

Granted this is a moot point however as the Mountain West Conference has already stated they can't and will not expand so everything discussed is hypothetical at this point.

[Spaztecs]

1 minute ago, utgrizfan said:

I think for sure they could compete with the lower echelons of the conference. SDSU beat the crap out of Colorado State in their house and I don't think they are as good as NDSU is. Consistently long-term I see it as a possibility considering they would be getting more scholarships and have a good reputation being the Alabama of FCS.

Could they hold up against SDSU or Boises remaining schedule ?

[utgrizfan]

7 minutes ago, Spaztecs said:

Could they hold up against SDSU or Boises remaining schedule ?

Frankly I think they would be competive in most of the games and maybe upset one but overall the best-case scenario would be they would be a middle-of-the-road MWC school. NDSU in particular though undefeated this year is not as strong as past teams and they seem to be having some quarterback issues currently

[aztecsrule72001]

I just don't see any way the MW adds any of the Dakota or Montana schools without them going to the WAC and proving themselves at an FBS level (like Boise St. did) even in a worse case scenario where the Pac gets picked apart from the Big10 and Big12 and lose 8 schools the MW can still back fill with UTEP, NMSU, Texas St. and LA Tech. Then wait for the WAC to move up to FBS and pick up the next upcoming school.

[nvspuds]

13 minutes ago, utgrizfan said:

Frankly I think they would be competive in most of the games and maybe upset one but overall the best-case scenario would be they would be a middle-of-the-road MWC school. NDSU in particular though undefeated this year is not as strong as past teams and they seem to be having some quarterback issues currently

It does not matter at all that NDSU might be competitive...The MW already has competitive teams in the conference..NDSU does not provide anything the MW doesn't already have..

[utgrizfan]

2 minutes ago, nvspuds said:

It does not matter at all that NDSU might be competitive...The MW already has competitive teams in the conference..NDSU does not provide anything the MW doesn't already have..

Why I'm not advocating for them to join the conference especially considering it's a moot point with the announcement there's going to be 0 expansion. Merely was responding to how competitive I feel they would be. The best bet for them along with the Montanas is if and when the WAC declares for FBS.

And that's only because a handful of the teams in the conference either don't want to make the move (SUU and Dixie) and there's hesitation from the other Texas schools except for SHSU and Tarelton State

[StanfordAggie]

2 hours ago, Wyobraska said:

How do you compare FBS to FCS teams though using something like Sagarin?  I know he includes them but I just don't really see how you can draw much from it.

There's enough games between FBS and FCS opponents that you can draw some inferences. I'm not sure how reliable it is. Having said that, how many G5 FBS schools have as many road wins against P5 schools as NDSU does in the past decade? Very few, if any. I don't think it's crazy to think that NDSU would be a top-30 team if they played in FBS.

[nvspuds]

2 minutes ago, StanfordAggie said:

There's enough games between FBS and FCS opponents that you can draw some inferences. I'm not sure how reliable it is. Having said that, how many G5 FBS schools have as many road wins against P5 schools as NDSU does in the past decade? Very few, if any. I don't think it's crazy to think that NDSU would be a top-30 team if they played in FBS.

Well , I do think reasonable people can disagree..

[Billings]

24 minutes ago, aztecsrule72001 said:

I just don't see any way the MW adds any of the Dakota or Montana schools without them going to the WAC and proving themselves at an FBS level (like Boise St. did) even in a worse case scenario where the Pac gets picked apart from the Big10 and Big12 and lose 8 schools the MW can still back fill with UTEP, NMSU, Texas St. and LA Tech. Then wait for the WAC to move up to FBS and pick up the next upcoming school.

agreed.  I think there is zero chance of the MWC ever going to the Dakotas other than a total conference meltdown.  UTEP and Texas State are the next two teams in all likelihood.

[Wyobraska]

4 minutes ago, StanfordAggie said:

There's enough games between FBS and FCS opponents that you can draw some inferences. I'm not sure how reliable it is. Having said that, how many G5 FBS schools have as many road wins against P5 schools as NDSU does in the past decade? Very few, if any. I don't think it's crazy to think that NDSU would be a top-30 team if they played in FBS.

I give NDSU a lot of credit.  They are a great team at their level and what they have been able to do is remarkable, bit top 30 right away?  I don't see it.  

It is one thing to get your team up for a big game, but to play FBS competition for a whole season is another story.  They would need time to build their scholarship players up to 85 as well.  They would suffer depth issues. 

Would their recruiting strategy have to change? 

 I think with the different levels of competition it is just too hard to rank them as an FBS type school.  We've seen a lot of times where the transitive property of wins doesn't work. 

Their FBS wins have not been that impressive from the standpoint of beating great teams.  Just like when a G5 team beats any P5 team it is a good win for that level, but I don't think NDSU has beaten a top 30 team during their run.  

[East Coast Aztec]

1 minute ago, Wyobraska said:

I give NDSU a lot of credit.  They are a great team at their level and what they have been able to do is remarkable, bit top 30 right away?  I don't see it.  

It is one thing to get your team up for a big game, but to play FBS competition for a whole season is another story.  They would need time to build their scholarship players up to 85 as well.  They would suffer depth issues. 

Would their recruiting strategy have to change? 

 I think with the different levels of competition it is just too hard to rank them as an FBS type school.  We've seen a lot of times where the transitive property of wins doesn't work. 

Their FBS wins have not been that impressive from the standpoint of beating great teams.  Just like when a G5 team beats any P5 team it is a good win for that level, but I don't think NDSU has beaten a top 30 team during their run.  

A win at Iowa is always big.  And that wasn't a bad Iowa team either, they finished just outside the T25 after they lost a bowl game.  The K-State game is overblown, as they just weren't that good, the previous season's success had them ranked.  And beating the Goofers a couple times during the Kill years wasn't difficult either.  But the Iowa win was a good one.

[Professorbum]

29 minutes ago, Wyobraska said:

I give NDSU a lot of credit.  They are a great team at their level and what they have been able to do is remarkable, bit top 30 right away?  I don't see it.  

It is one thing to get your team up for a big game, but to play FBS competition for a whole season is another story.  They would need time to build their scholarship players up to 85 as well.  They would suffer depth issues. 

Would their recruiting strategy have to change? 

 I think with the different levels of competition it is just too hard to rank them as an FBS type school.  We've seen a lot of times where the transitive property of wins doesn't work. 

Their FBS wins have not been that impressive from the standpoint of beating great teams.  Just like when a G5 team beats any P5 team it is a good win for that level, but I don't think NDSU has beaten a top 30 team during their run.  

I believe Iowa was ranked #13 in 2016 when NDSU beat them.   I think they finished the season #21.   Interestingly, NDSU received 70+ points in the AP top 25 poll after beating Iowa.  That put them ranked at 27th in the country among FBS.

[Aztec1984]

On 10/21/2021 at 6:57 PM, Wyobraska said:

 

Please, if we are going to bring Dakota, Montana, Idaho schools or anything like that, let us leave first. Nothing personal, just that we don't need more "mountain" in the MWC.

[RSF]

1 hour ago, Professorbum said:

I believe Iowa was ranked #13 in 2016 when NDSU beat them.   I think they finished the season #21.   Interestingly, NDSU received 70+ points in the AP top 25 poll after beating Iowa.  That put them ranked at 27th in the country among FBS.

Iowa finished that year unranked.

[e-zone99]

1 hour ago, Professorbum said:

I believe Iowa was ranked #13 in 2016 when NDSU beat them.   I think they finished the season #21.   Interestingly, NDSU received 70+ points in the AP top 25 poll after beating Iowa.  That put them ranked at 27th in the country among FBS.

It's not that hard to look these things up.  2016 College Football Rankings

NDSU may have got some votes (74) after the win, but the only thing that really matters is how many they had at the end of the year.

 

[SAMO]

2 hours ago, Professorbum said:

I believe Iowa was ranked #13 in 2016 when NDSU beat them.   I think they finished the season #21.   Interestingly, NDSU received 70+ points in the AP top 25 poll after beating Iowa.  That put them ranked at 27th in the country among FBS.

nobody cares fool...lol