Conference Realignment thread

[OzzyOzz]

On 9/17/2023 at 1:18 PM, Headbutt said:

Careful what you wish for.  Play a few games against AFA before you start wanting to add academies.  Not that all the academies have a douchebag for a coach at the howdy doody level, but they do all leave you with damaged knees.

ok, but..the pac is a blood bath in its own right..but in any case they arent my knees to speak for, but iron sharpens iron..

to be the best you have to beat the best..idk in cougar football literally anything can happen..it means Coug football never plays scared. Or maybe, they always do idk...once you've seen losses to Eastern Washington, 40 point collapses, almost beating any ranked team one week and then almost losing to non competitive teams the next..

Idk you keep on telling me to worry about people's knees, I still don't know if you are being serious or not..

But bring those knees. I want all the knees! I get to say this because they aren't my knees lol

[wolfpack1]

On 9/17/2023 at 12:56 PM, OzzyOzz said:

Why not Army+Navy fb only MWC?

If it happens while the MWC just watches, well that's pathetic..

Navy isn't leaving AAC to come to the MWC unless MWC let's them do the same deal they have with AAC, pays them more money and pays their exit fee. 

Not happening not even in the same neighborhood of happening

[wolfpack1]

On 9/17/2023 at 1:25 PM, OzzyOzz said:

That's fair, and also, there is also way more urgency for wsu/osu to act now..they don't get to wait for Army+Navy anyway because the onus is on them, they'll have to jump eventually and hope the parachute works. 

I'm not too familiar with Mr. Aresco but he's smart to pursue expansion now, especially with army and AF, because it's his best chance at it. Once teams start joining, they do so in blocks, and it's a buyers market for all of them right now..it isn't time to sit back and wait and see for any of them. The markets won't open up again really for 6 years? after this. Now is the time for sure..if WSU/OSU do jump to the MWC, momentum is to go to the MWC. Asking now mitigates that as best he can.

The problem being, if Army has been put to a decision in a month, as was alluded to by someone here, it's really hard to reverse either a yes or no from them. So, should the pac-2 just continue stalling, then? Or jump, to incentivize a decision one way by them?

I just want a natty jeez, y'all are making this way harder than it needs to be for real..

 

If you want a natty I think should look for another sport for Wash St or start cheering for another school , now not trying to be mean but that is one of the drawbacks of Washington St in the eyes of the other power conferences their athletic program is lackluster. However the Pac-12 situation is at a standstill right now as they play in the courts, so until that is lifted no one will be able to pull the trigger Pac-12 matters

[thedude15]

On 9/17/2023 at 1:01 PM, SteedLaw said:

Call me crazy, but I have said it all month that the reason Army is not jumping to the American is because they are waiting on seeing what happens with the PAC/MWC first. 

Aresco is the one trying to force them to play their hand before all the cards are dealt. 

I mean is the clear #1 choice for the AAC so they don't have to rush.

I highly doubt any Sun Belt teams would jump to the AAC at this point, same goes for the MAC (I mean the AAC probably won't want any MAC teams anyways). MW teams will prefer the Pac-14 (or whatever it ends up being) instead. So that leaves independents in Army (football only), UMASS, UCONN (football only) and the CUSA as the only schools the AAC could actually grab. 

[SteedLaw]

On 9/17/2023 at 2:25 PM, OzzyOzz said:

That's fair, and also, there is also way more urgency for wsu/osu to act now..they don't get to wait for Army+Navy anyway because the onus is on them, they'll have to jump eventually and hope the parachute works. 

I'm not too familiar with Mr. Aresco but he's smart to pursue expansion now, especially with army and AF, because it's his best chance at it. Once teams start joining, they do so in blocks, and it's a buyers market for all of them right now..it isn't time to sit back and wait and see for any of them. The markets won't open up again really for 6 years? after this. Now is the time for sure..if WSU/OSU do jump to the MWC, momentum is to go to the MWC. Asking now mitigates that as best he can.

The problem being, if Army has been put to a decision in a month, as was alluded to by someone here, it's really hard to reverse either a yes or no from them. So, should the pac-2 just continue stalling, then? Or jump, to incentivize a decision one way by them?

I just want a natty jeez, y'all are making this way harder than it needs to be for real..

 

We tend to think alike it appears…

My belief is this is the reason why W/OSU will want to merge and merge sooner than later. If they can complete a merger with the MWC quickly, then that can create more momentum to add 1-4 more teams.

My guess right now is that would be the independents who don’t already have exit fees (i.e., Army, UConn, and Umass) and then use that momentum to sweet-talk Navy.

And, yes, my belief is that this new PAC would be a “power conference” with that lineup.  

Apparently, Aresco knows this too, which is why he is pushing so hard to add Army. Army, in turn, is trying to drag their feet to see what happens first with the PAC/MWC, but Aresco seems to be getting impatient and is putting in the screws there. 

But, yes, my opinion would be for W/OSU to complete the reverse merger, and quickly to capitalize on the momentum before others try to block the new league off at the pass. 

[utgrizfan]

On 9/17/2023 at 1:17 PM, wolfpack1 said:

They have had three different meetings with student athletes where they gave them a blank piece of paper asking them to write their concerns or questions about what is going on. He said #1 on the list from them is they want to play in a Power 5 conference and their #2 concern was communication from the top on whatever happens how will they find out and will they find out before announced to media.

I bet that it's not just the Student athletes who feel this way, why I could see happening what was mentioned earlier, finding enough $$ to get both of them into the Big12. Granted I don't think it's the most likely outcome, seems like legally OSU + Wazzu have everyone else by the balls.

[UofMTigers]

On 9/17/2023 at 3:51 PM, thedude15 said:

I mean is the clear #1 choice for the AAC so they don't have to rush.

I highly doubt any Sun Belt teams would jump to the AAC at this point, same goes for the MAC (I mean the AAC probably won't want any MAC teams anyways). MW teams will prefer the Pac-14 (or whatever it ends up being) instead. So that leaves independents in Army (football only), UMASS, UCONN (football only) and the CUSA as the only schools the AAC could actually grab. 

also, ESPN doesn't want us to raid a fellow ESPN conf. That's why we go after CUSA teams and Army as they have CBS contracts.

[sactowndog]

On 9/17/2023 at 12:33 PM, renoskier said:

thank you once again...I believe you've posted this previously

@sactowndog is always bitching about this but never acknowledges that it's not how the system was created...

and why does the state need more schools doing the same thing?

Yes the Master Plan is the state law but that doesn’t mean the master plan at this point is at all aligned with the intent of the Act establishing Land Grant Universities.  And are you CA residents?  If not why do you care? 

[jdgaucho]

Reddit has the right idea.

 

 

[CowboyFriar]

On 9/17/2023 at 4:41 PM, OzzyOzz said:

ok, but..the pac is a blood bath in its own right..but in any case they arent my knees to speak for, but iron sharpens iron..

to be the best you have to beat the best..idk in cougar football literally anything can happen..it means Coug football never plays scared. Or maybe, they always do idk...once you've seen losses to Eastern Washington, 40 point collapses, almost beating any ranked team one week and then almost losing to non competitive teams the next..

Idk you keep on telling me to worry about people's knees, I still don't know if you are being serious or not..

But bring those knees. I want all the knees! I get to say this because they aren't my knees lol

The talk about "knees" is referring to Air Force's reputation for employing cut blocking on the regular.  He is being serious.......

[HawaiiMongoose]

On 9/17/2023 at 7:55 AM, SteedLaw said:

I read somewhere recently that they were saying a new contract with the “PAC 14” (PAC/MWC merger) would be around no less than $12MM PPS and no greater than $16MM PPS.

While that is a temporary big loss for W/OSU, it is a pretty decent-sized permanent bump for the MWC schools and does not include the more indirect benefits of merging with the PAC — sharing of the TV assists, the PAC network, better conference branding and name recognition, etc. 

Based on this, I could totally see a commitment from university presidents to increase athletic budgets by an additional minimum $25 million a year per school over the next 3 seasons or so.

This, in turn, would put the whole league — i.e., including the Spartans — to being just under the Big XII in total league athletic spending per school and MUCH higher than the new American conference and what their school averages would be — especially after losing Cinci, Houston, UCF, and SMU. 

 

Happy to hear it, but frankly I think that's wildly optimistic.

I'm expecting a deal that comes in between $8 million and $10 million per school, best case.

And while that would be a killer pay cut for WSU and OSU, I don't think they're going to do any better regardless of which option (join the MWC, join the AAC, rebuild Pac with some combo of MWC and AAC schools) they choose.  The media companies are retrenching to cut their losses and aren't interested in giving a big pay increase to anyone outside the P4.

[OzzyOzz]

On 9/17/2023 at 4:51 PM, CowboyFriar said:

The talk about "knees" is referring to Air Force's reputation for employing cut blocking on the regular.  He is being serious.......

Cut blocks is losing football..

Tackling is grab, wrap, hold...cut blocks will make you look silly, I'd hurdle you so fast, it's instinctual to not let anything hit your feet and..if not, if I just dead stop or matador you, you also look silly..

Tackling is swipe then grab, twist and wrap, then hold and dont let go. Chop blocks look good but if they don't work they are automatic touchdowns and easy wins..just screen plays and bait you into not making proper tackles lol..

Cut blocking would be punished so badly in today's pac 12, there's a reason teams don't do it...

I guess WSU/OSU will show why cut blocks died off in the 90s if they play AF regularly...

I've screamed at the tv enough times to know enough to wrap the ball handler up always, WSU used to have butter arms for so long it was ridiculous lol

[renoskier]

On 9/17/2023 at 4:16 PM, sactowndog said:

Yes the Master Plan is the state law but that doesn’t mean the master plan at this point is at all aligned with the intent of the Act establishing Land Grant Universities.  And are you CA residents?  If not why do you care? 

are you still a student?

why do you care?

and why can't someone just apply to the many UC schools which have advanced degrees?

[UNLV2001]

On 9/17/2023 at 12:17 PM, wolfpack1 said:

Washington St President did an interview this last Friday up in the northwest he said recently had a meeting with Board of Regents on what was going on with the athletic programs and what direction they were going. Here are some tidbits from the interview:

They have had three different meetings with student athletes where they gave them a blank piece of paper asking them to write their concerns or questions about what is going on. He said #1 on the list from them is they want to play in a Power 5 conference and their #2 concern was communication from the top on whatever happens how will they find out and will they find out before announced to media.

This is why I see a decent hit to WSU & OSU to the transfer portal if they are left joining the MWC or AAC or combo thereof, because those won't get "power" consideration or nothing other than an olive branch from the powers of CFB.......the olive branch being perhaps access to the CFB playoffs for a limited time (determined by the P4) 

[sactowndog]

On 9/17/2023 at 5:17 PM, OzzyOzz said:

Cut blocks is losing football..

Tackling is grab, wrap, hold...cut blocks will make you look silly, I'd hurdle you so fast, it's instinctual to not let anything hit your feet and..if not, if I just dead stop or matador you, you also look silly..

Tackling is swipe then grab, twist and wrap, then hold and dont let go. Chop blocks look good but if they don't work they are automatic touchdowns and easy wins..just screen plays and bait you into not making proper tackles lol..

Cut blocking would be punished so badly in today's pac 12, there's a reason teams don't do it...

I guess WSU/OSU will show why cut blocks died off in the 90s if they play AF regularly...

I've screamed at the tv enough times to know enough to wrap the ball handler up always, WSU used to have butter arms for so long it was ridiculous lol

You haven’t played the Academies where the lineman give up 30-60 lbs but make up for it with grit and precision.  Yes cut blocking isn’t preferred when your lineman are equal size.  Their linemen will be a C4 pilot when they graduate.  

AF has never won the MWC but they are always a tough out.  Playing in the MWC is a lot tougher than some in the PAC get.  

Folsom Field is 5,360 but would be 3rd in the MWC.  Wyoming War Memorial is at 7,220 and hope you don’t play there in Nov.  Luckily, they don’t usually schedule Hawaii back to back as games on the rock with 5 hour flights at least are always tough. 

[wolfpack1]

On 9/17/2023 at 2:48 PM, utgrizfan said:

I bet that it's not just the Student athletes who feel this way, why I could see happening what was mentioned earlier, finding enough $$ to get both of them into the Big12. Granted I don't think it's the most likely outcome, seems like legally OSU + Wazzu have everyone else by the balls.

Just like the other schools in MWC, OSU and WSU have the same issue, if someone wanted them they would already be with another conference.  WSU President kind of accepted that fate a while ago but OSU seems to still believe there is something out there. 

[sactowndog]

On 9/17/2023 at 5:58 PM, renoskier said:

are you still a student?

why do you care?

and why can't someone just apply to the many UC schools which have advanced degrees?

No I’m near retirement and I care because I want to see the counties in the Valley grow from being the poorest in the nation to at least middle class.  

I care because I took masters level econ classes at Sacramento State and I know UC Davis has never taken a single SAC State econ student into their Doctoral program.  I personally know a Sac State Econ student with a passion for water quality in poor communities.  Communities she grew up in.  Communities that would actually be represented if the UC’s actually fulfilled their mission of the Land Grant schools. UC Davis wouldn’t let her into their Doctoral Program so instead she went to Penn State, a true land grant, on a full scholarship.  It was a loss for our state.

so again are you a resident? Do you have a +++++ing clue about our system? 

[utgrizfan]

On 9/17/2023 at 10:10 PM, wolfpack1 said:

Just like the other schools in MWC, OSU and WSU have the same issue, if someone wanted them they would already be with another conference.  WSU President kind of accepted that fate a while ago but OSU seems to still believe there is something out there. 

The only reason I think there is a slight (VERY SLIGHT) possibility things could change is due to the $$ and other programs involved. If enough of those departing teams were depending on that money for their transitions to other Conferences or other needs they might have to pressure/appeal to the TV networks somehow. 

However, as I said, it is very unlikely, just seems that this would be the best chance for OSU and Wazzu to try and remain P5: hold alot/years worth of $$ hostage and use it as a bargaining tool to find a new P5 home.

[wolfpack1]

On 9/17/2023 at 3:06 PM, UofMTigers said:

also, ESPN doesn't want us to raid a fellow ESPN conf. That's why we go after CUSA teams and Army as they have CBS contracts.

They have gone after Army before, but C-USA signed a contract with CBS and ESPN which started this year. Right now I believe Mountain West is the only conference that doesn't have a deal with ESPN

[wolfpack1]

On 9/17/2023 at 5:12 PM, HawaiiMongoose said:

Happy to hear it, but frankly I think that's wildly optimistic.

I'm expecting a deal that comes in between $8 million and $10 million per school, best case.

And while that would be a killer pay cut for WSU and OSU, I don't think they're going to do any better regardless of which option (join the MWC, join the AAC, rebuild Pac with some combo of MWC and AAC schools) they choose.  The media companies are retrenching to cut their losses and aren't interested in giving a big pay increase to anyone outside the P4.

Especially since we are getting $4 million now, last time the conference got a raise was about $3 million per team so that again would be that 8-10 window. I don't see the networks tripling our payout with WSU and OSU joining