Conference Realignment thread

[ShoichiKUN808]

Not sure if it's been posted. But the full legal papers regarding the Washington St & Oregon St vs PAC12 and Kliavkoff is here. It goes into pretty deep in details with all the PAC membership changes

https://leadership.oregonstate.edu/sites/leadership.oregonstate.edu/files/2023-09/complaint_for_breach_of_bylaws_declaratory_judgment_and_injunctive_relief_1.pdf

[Packfan11.1]

On 9/8/2023 at 4:45 PM, ShoichiKUN808 said:

Not sure if it's been posted. But the full legal papers regarding the Washington St & Oregon St vs PAC12 and Kliavkoff is here. It goes into pretty deep in details with all the PAC membership changes

https://leadership.oregonstate.edu/sites/leadership.oregonstate.edu/files/2023-09/complaint_for_breach_of_bylaws_declaratory_judgment_and_injunctive_relief_1.pdf

Andrew Luck's father should be responsible for the Cal/Stanford defection since he was consulting the Pac-12 at the time they left...  What a waste if money he turned out to be.

[wolfpack1]

On 9/8/2023 at 2:36 PM, Ram1554 said:

I’m not advocating for anyone to get left out. I am asking what are the potential holdups for OSU/WSU not being able to simply invite all 12 MWC members to join the PAC next summer? Thus negating exit fees. 
 

It just seems simpler and more beneficial for us all to carry on under the PAC banner as soon as possible. And I’m not talking about legally merging the two conference entities, which may take awhile to sort out. Instead, I’m referring to us all jumping over to the PAC after this year and leaving the MWC for dead. The only downside I see is potentially getting sued by our current TV partners. 

Pac 2 would have to do a hell of a lot work, get through the courts, find a TV partner, get a pay package together, and all that mess before even moving to the next step because schools aren't going to leave one conference for another unless that is all worked out. Now, if that is the situation Pac 2 gets a two waiver they could wait out the TV contract running out with MWC then people from MWC move but again that would take agreements to make sure things are in place.

Any situations will take time to figure out with many different sides because unless have an agreement in place with Pac before doing that, there is that risk they would not take all the schools and if that it they case you aren't going to get enough to dissolve.

[wolfpack1]

On 9/8/2023 at 3:19 PM, Ram1554 said:

I realize that. But it sounds optimistic that the voting rights issue should be a relatively quick decision - "The filings include a request for a hearing on the temporary restraining order on Monday, which could give clarity before the scheduled meeting two days later." So this may be concluded by early next week.

After that, OSU/WSU should be able to control the destiny of the PAC and they would be the sole decision makers in the CEO Group. As I said before, they should start with inviting all 12 MWC members to begin PAC conference play in fall 2024. No merging conference entities, just a straight invitation for all of us.  

The hearing is on Monday morning but the decision may not come on Monday. Then the other schools could appeal it. Then with a temporary injunction they could have another hearing later on about keeping it in place or not. The hearing on Monday is just the first step of the legal process now

[wolfpack1]

On 9/8/2023 at 4:11 PM, Headbutt said:

I'm not disagreeing with anything your saying other than the assumption that the situation is as it's presented in the media.  Before we dissolve the MWC, I want to see a legal ruling that confirms all of that.  Too big of a step without guarantees.

And would like to see an agreement from Pac-12 saying all the schools are coming in if MWC dissolves

[wolfpack1]

On 9/8/2023 at 4:22 PM, SteedLaw said:

Agreed that "willy nilly" expansion is a bad idea.

But, there are teams and schools out there right now that, in my opinion, make sense. 

I mean, UTEP looks pretty solid this year -- for like the first time in forever. I mean, they are a Carnegie R1 school and the natural rival of New Mexico. They, plus say Texas State, could add a lot of long-term value to the conference. And, given our momentum, they could very well be willing to join at a significantly reduced payout for a few years.

Likewise, Memphis, Tulane, and UTSA can't be too happy about how Aresco handled the whole SMU affair. There could be an opportunity to grab two of them as well. 

I am not saying Willy Nilly expansion. But if others are going to 18 teams, our going to 16 should not seems too crazy of an idea. 

They don't turn heads for the networks, don't add more body's to eat at the trough that is already low enough and no those teams aren't going to come to MWC for less than AAC is paying out for them.

[jdgaucho]

Real realignment news.  West Georgia is going D1 with the Atlantic Sun

 

[wolfpack1]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:10 PM, jdgaucho said:

Real realignment news.  West Georgia is going D1 with the Atlantic Sun

 

Yeah forgot to post that earlier

[wolfpack1]

WSU President and AD did another interview up in Seattle before they filed for the injunction.

They talked about the Pac-4 approached ACC together then ACC came back saying they were only interested in Stanford and Cal.

They also went back to the B 10 and given his response almost like laughed in their faces.

Said they needed to figure out all the assets and liabilities before moving forward but keeping Pac around still #1 option.

Said joining with MWC is an option but they are looking at many different options, which also included going independent. 

https://komonews.com/news/local/washington-state-university-wsu-oregon-state-university-osu-pac-12-athletic-director-president-assets-acc-apple-cup-scheduling-pullman-conference-realignment-big-ten-college-football-athletics-sports#

[wolfpack1]

With regards to Oregon/Oregon St look at Oregon's schedule if B10 keeps their 9 game conference schedule looks like the earliest opening Oregon has is 2029 unless something changes it up.

Washington has quite a bit more openings on their schedule in the coming years.

[Brew_Poke]

On 9/8/2023 at 4:31 PM, sactowndog said:

UW and UO need to be your backup plan.  You need them to promise to vote with you to keep them from aligning with CalFurd to dissolve the conference.  It’s pretty clear the conference assets are what they plan to use to fund their shortfall from the ACC bribe.  

They don't have voting rights

[Headbutt]

On 9/8/2023 at 6:24 PM, Brew_Poke said:

They don't have voting rights

Courts love precedents.  If the courts find in favor of the departing 10 Pac members, then the MWC bylaws become meaningless, along with everyone else's.  I don't see it happening, but it would have huge ripples.  Exit rules and fees, could it affect GOR's(?), etc.

[sactowndog]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:24 PM, Brew_Poke said:

They don't have voting rights

The whole point of the lawsuit is whether they do or do not.  

[Brew_Poke]

On 9/8/2023 at 4:55 PM, SteedLaw said:

Agreed. 

The PAC imploded because it failed to expand when the opportunities were there. Likewise, the MWC was the clear "BOR" conference less than a few short years ago. By failing to expand, we allowed the AAC to jump back on top.

Now, we are getting a "second chance" to do the right thing. With Cinci, Houston, UCF and SMU leaving, the AAC is more or less in shambles. And, fate has also apparently allowed us (or will allow us) to gain WSU and OSU as full members.

Time to not make the same mistakes twice. Time to use that momentum to add 2-4 additional schools that make the most sense and put the AAC once and for all in "checkmate".

There's no more money for 2-4 additional schools. We already have two more coming in (Wazzu $ ORST) that we have to split revenue with. You guys are so eager to destroy the cash flow of the members here it's insane. Army for Christ's Sake. Gonzaga, M-Fing North Texas. Laughable, man!

[sactowndog]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:10 PM, wolfpack1 said:

They don't turn heads for the networks, don't add more body's to eat at the trough that is already low enough and no those teams aren't going to come to MWC for less than AAC is paying out for them.

What part of securing the 5th place bid wasn’t clear?  

[Brew_Poke]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:43 PM, RebelRobert said:

It is fun for all of you to play pretend that the PAC-2 will want you and invite you all.

That is not what is going to happen. You would be wise to come to that realization and start planning for your true futures.

Sharing a conference with Wyoming in perpetuity is UNLV's true future. You've reached your ceiling.

[wolfpack1]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:27 PM, Headbutt said:

Courts love precedents.  If the courts find in favor of the departing 10 Pac members, then the MWC bylaws become meaningless, along with everyone else's.  I don't see it happening, but it would have huge ripples.  Exit rules and fees, could it affect GOR's(?), etc.

It will be a whole new ballgame however courts also many times like to have rules as narrow as possible as well. In the injunction request could simply say you did this with USC/UCLA and Colorado so you have to do same with the others and simply not touch anything by bylaws or anything as well.

[wolfpack1]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:30 PM, sactowndog said:

What part of securing the 5th place bid wasn’t clear?  

You don't expand for the sake of expanding, you need a guarantee of more money for the conference to have schools go along with it. You add more schools but told you won't be seeing any change in TV money for the contract, you aren't going to get any votes for expansion.

[Brew_Poke]

On 9/8/2023 at 6:27 PM, sactowndog said:

The whole point of the lawsuit is whether they do or do not.  

Right, with the departing schools' legal argument based up the well known legal doctrine of take-backsies.

[OzzyOzz]

The word "automatically" in the bylaws make it a cut and dry case. BUT..

..there are problems still. It says that with independence or re-allegiance assets are forfeited. Scheduling ooc games with the MWC will be deemed to be a merger in all but name, and it will underline the need for considerations to those bylaws as necessary, in such extreme extenuating circumstances as this has turned out to be.. 

And independence is not an option either, it says it right there. 

And if that is the rebuff, the counter suit is still a claim for the ongoing damages in proportion to payouts as justified by the agreed upon bylaws. What might that look like will probably just be mediated, and will be with consideration to the then situation. It might be a lot just because of how the words were written.

Official notices are impossible with automatic qualifiers. The king is dead..long live the king etc..that's hard to get around. 

I won't outlay the departing members' counter suit as it will end with the same conclusion; a grant of extenuating circumstances...but it could result in 4 schools squeezing out 8 and making out like bandits lol..

But they won't agree to it, so mediation it is. And the scales are set. $ .