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Conference Realignment thread

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46 minutes ago, East Coast Aztec said:

So CUSA will essentially be an FBS conference that is unequivocally worse than FCS conferences?  At some point, Big Sky and MVC have to be like "just give us the CUSA money".

Frankly I feel that if both conferences moved up right now, moreso the MVC then the Big Sky, they could compete with a lot of the current G5 schools.

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1 hour ago, East Coast Aztec said:

So CUSA will essentially be an FBS conference that is unequivocally worse than FCS conferences?  At some point, Big Sky and MVC have to be like "just give us the CUSA money".

Yup that was kind of what was talking about earlier. I mean you will have FIU, W Kentucky, MTSU, UTEP and Louisiana tech probably at the top of the conference for a while, while the others schools may possibly be bottom feeders for a while. Well I guess it leads to more scheduling chances for SEC and Big 12 schools

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7 hours ago, HawaiiMongoose said:

The WAC is bringing in Southern Utah next season to replace Chicago State.  That will keep them at 13 members for Olympic sports and push them up to 7 members playing FCS football, unless any choose to jump to CUSA.

I can see NMSU wanting to put their football team in CUSA but they should try to keep Olympic sports in the WAC if at all possible.  The basketball will be better in the WAC and the travel will be much easier and cheaper.

If they go to CUSA, it needs to be football only for NMSU because think it would be a mistake to move all their sports from WAC

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2 hours ago, Denton County said:

Quite a few.  This is a little disparaging, but it's like Texas A&M and the seven dwarfs.  Beyond the College Station campus, the rest of the system universities are small.  Some of them have long, even venerable histories (Prairie View, Tarleton, Commerce, for instance), but they are small.  I am glad Tarleton hung on to its historic name. 

I didn't know they had that many but keep seeing more and more coming up. Texas A&M Corpus Christi, Texas A&M Commerce, but I didn't know Prairie View was part of the system though.

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NDSU AD/PRESIDENT under some serious HEAT by the fanbase to not sit idle during all of this realignment.   

I keep coming back to MWC, if it'd Football Invite only that's 1 flight every 2 years to Fargo.  NOT A BIG DEAL.

NDSU would like all sports  which is a tougher sell to the MWC.

 

but at end of the days MWC is the peer group for NDSU.

 

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16 minutes ago, lakesbison said:

NDSU AD/PRESIDENT under some serious HEAT by the fanbase to not sit idle during all of this realignment.   

I keep coming back to MWC, if it'd Football Invite only that's 1 flight every 2 years to Fargo.  NOT A BIG DEAL.

NDSU would like all sports  which is a tougher sell to the MWC.

 

but at end of the days MWC is the peer group for NDSU.

 

The MWC isn't calling, so if NDSU really wants to prove it's worth there is a conference that is desperate for FBS teams down south.  Make the call to go football only to CUSA and prove that you can win consistently.  Otherwise,  continue to win at the FCS level and be happy.  It should be clear by now that no amount of winning at the FCS level is getting an MWC invite.  If it isn't then maybe the AD/president do deserve some criticism.  As far as this latest round of musical chairs,  MWC/Sun Belt/AAC are pretty much done.  CUSA is probably going to sending out invites very soon to get back to 8, and then whoever didn't make the jump is going to be left waiting again for a few years.  If NDSU was really serious about going FBS,  now would be the time to get their foot in the door.  

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37 minutes ago, lakesbison said:

NDSU AD/PRESIDENT under some serious HEAT by the fanbase to not sit idle during all of this realignment.   

I keep coming back to MWC, if it'd Football Invite only that's 1 flight every 2 years to Fargo.  NOT A BIG DEAL.

NDSU would like all sports  which is a tougher sell to the MWC.

 

but at end of the days MWC is the peer group for NDSU.

 

It is not just about travel..Hawaii pays subsidies to be football only.  They have a long history with all the members and they play in paradise.  It is a special case..You are just some school that wants to get a free ride.  The MW does not need another football school.  They could use an olympic sports only school, preferably on the west coast..

No school in the MW is afraid to play you. You can lie to yourself that that is the reason you haven't been invited.  You can convince yourself all day that ESPN loves you and that makes all the difference to a conference that is not aligned with ESPN.

You enjoy describing the FBS schools, who have been D1 for decades as a peer group to you because you have had a nice run the last few years in a lower division.

You think you are proven because you have some wins against FBS schools.  The MW is full of schools who have defeated multiple FBS schools every year.

You have a fine program and much to be proud of but you are not in a peer group with most of FBS.  

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, lakesbison said:

NDSU AD/PRESIDENT under some serious HEAT by the fanbase to not sit idle during all of this realignment.   

I keep coming back to MWC, if it'd Football Invite only that's 1 flight every 2 years to Fargo.  NOT A BIG DEAL.

NDSU would like all sports  which is a tougher sell to the MWC.

 

but at end of the days MWC is the peer group for NDSU.

 

And then what happens when NDSU moves up and turns into the next NMSU or UTEP because it's too hard to recruit FBS-caliber players to Fargo? The arrogance of Bison fans is really something.

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1 hour ago, lakesbison said:

NDSU AD/PRESIDENT under some serious HEAT by the fanbase to not sit idle during all of this realignment.   

I keep coming back to MWC, if it'd Football Invite only that's 1 flight every 2 years to Fargo.  NOT A BIG DEAL.

NDSU would like all sports  which is a tougher sell to the MWC.

 

but at end of the days MWC is the peer group for NDSU.

 

I know you believe so, but, you're not on par with the MW. The rotten bottom four, certainly. Fortunately for the Bison they would get to play those schools in a Division with NM, CSU, and Why-O-Why. Add in UNLV, Sparty, and it's a throw of the dice on whether you get great Fresno or woeful Fresno two out of four years and you have a shot at 5 Conference wins.

 

Your team literally lacks the size, speed, overall talent level, and quality depth to compete at this level

 

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I don't favor adding NDSU to the MWC, but let's also give credit where credit is due. Sagarin ranked NDSU among the top 30 teams nationwide basically every year from the early 2010's up to 2019 (including FBS schools). They would have been the #1-ranked team in the MWC according to Sagarin many of those years. They have not lost to an FBS opponent in a long time and they beat several ranked FBS schools during that time period. (Indeed, most FBS schools won't even play them any more because they are too afraid of losing. NDSU was supposed to play Oregon in 2020. I'm really sad that the pandemic canceled that game, because it probably would have been one of the best OOC games of the year.) I have very little doubt that these teams would have been competitive in the MWC. NDSU has built a true football powerhouse. 

Do I think they should be invited to the MWC? No. They would have the lowest budget in the MWC by far. They play in a very small market. And even very strong FCS programs are not always successful after jumping to FBS. (I don't know about NDSU, but I know many FCS powerhouses take advantage of the fact that FBS players can transfer to them without sitting out a year. That recruiting benefit disappears when you make the jump to FBS.) But I'm also not going to say that they wouldn't be competitive in the MWC. If they are capable of beating schools like Minnesota, Kansas State, Iowa State, and Iowa (who was ranked #13 at the time), they would definitely hold their own in the MWC.

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4 hours ago, lakesbison said:

NDSU AD/PRESIDENT under some serious HEAT by the fanbase to not sit idle during all of this realignment.   

I keep coming back to MWC, if it'd Football Invite only that's 1 flight every 2 years to Fargo.  NOT A BIG DEAL.

NDSU would like all sports  which is a tougher sell to the MWC.

 

but at end of the days MWC is the peer group for NDSU.

 

There really isn't anywhere for them to go though unless they want to try CUSA or if MAC comes calling that is about it. 

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6 hours ago, lakesbison said:

NDSU AD/PRESIDENT under some serious HEAT by the fanbase to not sit idle during all of this realignment.   

I keep coming back to MWC, if it'd Football Invite only that's 1 flight every 2 years to Fargo.  NOT A BIG DEAL.

NDSU would like all sports  which is a tougher sell to the MWC.

 

but at end of the days MWC is the peer group for NDSU.

 

No, NDSU is not a peer of any MWC school.  There's tiers to CFB:

  1. P5 (yes there's tiers within this but is not relevant atm)
  2. MWC, AAC
  3. MAC, CUSA, SB
  4. FCS

Conferences raid from those below them.  MWC won't reach down to FCS level to add a school.  Historically they raided from the WAC, but killed it off.  My understanding is the WAC is reforming and is good enough for Sam Houston State and Stephen F. Austin (but not NDSU?).  NDSU could also talk to MAC/CUSA/SB.  Either NDSU is happy where they're at or they don't want to put in the hard work necessary to keep moving up the tiers, like everyone else has had to do.  But MWC will not be extending an invite to anyone in football.  They've publicly stated as much.  Definitely not down to the FCS level, they'll invite NMSU and UTEP before that happens.  Probably even look at WAC schools again...

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2 hours ago, StanfordAggie said:

I don't favor adding NDSU to the MWC, but let's also give credit where credit is due. Sagarin ranked NDSU among the top 30 teams nationwide basically every year from the early 2010's up to 2019 (including FBS schools). They would have been the #1-ranked team in the MWC according to Sagarin many of those years. They have not lost to an FBS opponent in a long time and they beat several ranked FBS schools during that time period. (Indeed, most FBS schools won't even play them any more because they are too afraid of losing. NDSU was supposed to play Oregon in 2020. I'm really sad that the pandemic canceled that game, because it probably would have been one of the best OOC games of the year.) I have very little doubt that these teams would have been competitive in the MWC. NDSU has built a true football powerhouse. 

Do I think they should be invited to the MWC? No. They would have the lowest budget in the MWC by far. They play in a very small market. And even very strong FCS programs are not always successful after jumping to FBS. (I don't know about NDSU, but I know many FCS powerhouses take advantage of the fact that FBS players can transfer to them without sitting out a year. That recruiting benefit disappears when you make the jump to FBS.) But I'm also not going to say that they wouldn't be competitive in the MWC. If they are capable of beating schools like Minnesota, Kansas State, Iowa State, and Iowa (who was ranked #13 at the time), they would definitely hold their own in the MWC.

How do you compare FBS to FCS teams though using something like Sagarin?  I know he includes them but I just don't really see how you can draw much from it.

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I feel with the constantly changing landscape of FBS football that the top FCS schools could compete with the majority of G5 and in some rare cases be comparable on par with some of the Best G5 schools available. NDSU has history and a record of beating G5 and P5 teams, SDSU to a smaller degree. 

That being said I think the best bet for NDSU and SDSU along with the Montana schools would be to wait for the WAC to jump to FBS. Don't get me wrong though I would love to see all four in the Mountain West, but realistically that's probably not going to happen unless the Mountain West gets raided bad enough.

A future WAC which I think would be a good Conference for example:

NORTH

Montana, MSU, NDSU, SDSU, Missouri State, UNI

SOUTH

Tarleton State, SHSU, NMSU, UTEP, SFA, Lamar/LT

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10 minutes ago, utgrizfan said:

I feel with the constantly changing landscape of FBS football that the top FCS schools could compete with the majority of G5 and in some rare cases be comparable on par with some of the Best G5 schools available. NDSU has history and a record of beating G5 and P5 teams, SDSU to a smaller degree. 

That being said I think the best bet for NDSU and SDSU along with the Montana schools would be to wait for the WAC to jump to FBS. Don't get me wrong though I would love to see all four in the Mountain West, but realistically that's probably not going to happen unless the Mountain West gets raided bad enough.

A future WAC which I think would be a good Conference for example:

NORTH

Montana, MSU, NDSU, SDSU, Missouri State, UNI

SOUTH

Tarleton State, SHSU, NMSU, UTEP, SFA, Lamar/LT

Which would thrill Dixie State, Southern Utah, Abilene Christian, UTRGV...

 

Fact is, if the WAC ever does go 1A, they wouldnt need a northern division.

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.

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4 minutes ago, RSF said:

Which would thrill Dixie State, Southern Utah, Abilene Christian, UTRGV...

 

Fact is, if the WAC ever does go 1A, they wouldnt need a northern division.

They potentially wouldn't need one, I merely pointed out that WAC would be a better option to go FBS then for them wait and hope for the MWC to lose teams. And it would be smart for the WAC to get the biggest/best supported, best overall history and competitive FCS teams to make the Conference successful.

Dixie State and SUU have apparently shown resistance to moving up Which goes against alot of the schools who joined the WAC eventually want. Going to be interesting to see how that unfolds down the road.

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10 minutes ago, utgrizfan said:

I feel with the constantly changing landscape of FBS football that the top FCS schools could compete with the majority of G5 and in some rare cases be comparable on par with some of the Best G5 schools available. NDSU has history and a record of beating G5 and P5 teams, SDSU to a smaller degree. 

That being said I think the best bet for NDSU and SDSU along with the Montana schools would be to wait for the WAC to jump to FBS. Don't get me wrong though I would love to see all four in the Mountain West, but realistically that's probably not going to happen unless the Mountain West gets raided bad enough.

A future WAC which I think would be a good Conference for example:

NORTH

Montana, MSU, NDSU, SDSU, Missouri State, UNI

SOUTH

Tarleton State, SHSU, NMSU, UTEP, SFA, Lamar/LT

It is extremely unlikely that the MW would get raided to the extent they would look to add any schools, particularly ones from FCS.  The original MW had 8 schools..The best version had 9.  

One of the things that helps a bit with the TV contracts is the PST slots to fill the broadcasting day.  They are it at the moment because the Pac 12 has their own network.  CBS/Fox and their secondary stations has been great for MWC basketball as far as exposure.  Football means night games which isn't as helpful.  It is a trade off..

MST schools also benefit..However, there are a jillion CST schools and there is a lot of schools who compete for those "tee times". 

The FCS schools that you claim are just as good as the current MW schools don't help with tv..They don't add anything the MW doesn't already have..

I wouldn't get your hopes up too high..

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