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Conference Realignment thread

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14 minutes ago, mugtang said:

So the AAC is interested in the #6 and #10 schools in viewership….ok. 

Weird right? Here's my take. Adding AFA to the AAC creates additional value because the AFA/Navy game becomes a conference matchup. Plus I suspect more cadets come from the places the AAC plays then the MW. Now CSU, that's weirder, but I think they just want to play in a conference that's in Texas and more aligned with the central time zone. I'm guessing the AAC really wants AFA and are willing to bring CSU along as they have the right profile despite the lack of on field success. 

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4 minutes ago, Spaztecs said:

https://medium.com/run-it-back-with-zach/which-college-football-programs-bring-in-the-most-tv-viewers-efc03c689e50

 

I quoted my numbers from Zach Miller which he got from Medium. From 2015 to 2019 SDSU ranked 86 out of 90 in average views.

Zach isn't being particularly fair to teams who play a lot of games on CBS Sports Network:

Quote

Games that do not have available data were counted as zero.

 

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4 minutes ago, Spaztecs said:

https://medium.com/run-it-back-with-zach/which-college-football-programs-bring-in-the-most-tv-viewers-efc03c689e50

 

I quoted my numbers from Zach Miller which he got from Medium. From 2015 to 2019 SDSU ranked 86 out of 90 in average views.

I actually went thru the trouble of looking through all our listed games on sports media watch. Not sure where Zach Miller is getting those numbers...

I even went as far as giving multiple 0 rating games one season that registered as N/A and still got nothing as low as he did for a single season. Only way his numbers make sense is if he somehow has CBSSN figures, which I honestly would take with a grain of salt. 

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3 minutes ago, Pelado said:

Zach isn't being particularly fair to teams who play a lot of games on CBS Sports Network:

 

Quote

Games that do not have available data were counted as zero.

Ahh, so that explains why so many CBSSN regulars are towards the bottom of the list. He basically artificially pulling down schools avg doing that.

 

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, AztecSU said:

Weird right? Here's my take. Adding AFA to a conference creates additional value because the AFA/Navy game becomes a conference matchup. Plus I suspect more cadets come from the places the AAC plays then the MW. Now CSU, that's weirder, but I think they just want to play in a conference that's in Texas and more aligned with the central time zone. I'm guessing the AAC really wants AFA and are willing to bring CSU along as they have the right profile despite the lack of on field success. 

Agree that AF makes sense with Navy there, maybe they go after Army as well but I see CSU simply as a travel partner for all sports if that's the invite they get.  Location is all they have.   Can they afford the $12M or whatever to leave?  Especially given the debt from the stadium that was supposed to lift them to a new level?

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1 hour ago, Aslowhiteguy said:

I don't know.  From what we've heard over the years, it sounds like Hawaii is happy in the BW

If UC Davis ever wanted to move up, I hope we'd listen and at least provide a path for them to join the MW. They would be an easy road trip for NV & SJSU, and fairly easy for Fresno.   I hope it was them.

It's true that UH has been happy in the Big West, for two reasons.  One is obviously reduced travel.  Those trips to the Mountain and Central Time Zones back in the WAC days were expensive and tough on our athletes.  The other is that the Big West sponsors some niche sports important to UH that the MWC doesn't sponsor.

Specifically those sports are men's volleyball, beach volleyball and women's water polo.  Those are a big deal for UH because the Big West is a national powerhouse in all three sports and UH is one of the flagbearers for the conference in all three.  The UH men's volleyball team is the defending national champion; the UH beach volleyball team has won two of the past three Big West titles and made it to the national final four both times; and the UH women's water polo team is the defending Big West champion and a top five team nationally. 

Even so, basketball is the most important non-football sport and UH would love to be in the MWC for basketball.  Our arena (10,300 seats) and fan base (5,717 per game in 2020) are MWC-caliber.  Our performance is admittedly not great, as we haven't won a Big West title since 2016, but recruiting in a low mid-major has been tough.  As a UH basketball fan for almost four decades I would be thrilled to see us playing San Diego State, UNLV, Fresno State, Nevada, New Mexico and Utah State again.

If AFA and CSU are in fact leaving that would alleviate some of the travel concern (on both sides).  I'm not sure if that would be enough to tip the balance but it could.  Ideally the UH niche sports would be allowed to stay in the Big West as affiliate members, but if not there are alternative options (the Mountain Pacific Sports Federation for men's volleyball and women's water polo and the WCC for beach volleyball).

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58 minutes ago, utgrizfan said:

SDSUs stadium seats 19340 and it being an outdoor stadium it's easier to expand. They also have a history of beating P5/FBS teams including beating the crap out of CSU this season. The Dakota Marker is a huge rivalry between NDSU and SDSU and like Montana and Montana State I highly doubt seeing one leave without the other

South Dakota State could absolutely do it but they aren't more ready than NDSU. Their stadium seats exactly 1 more than the Fargodome and they did that as a symbolic move. (or it's just an odd coincidence)

NDSU already pays full cost of attendance to every student athlete in all sports, raises more money, and they fund everything with private donations, including the 38 million dollar indoor practice facility. (South Dakota State had to bond) They haven't really tapped into student fees as it only makes up like 30% of the total budget

NDSU has 13,000 season ticket holders and they all require donations. That's a reason why NDSU has a larger athletic budget. All they really need to do is pay for 22 more scholarships and they could make the move and increase the travel budget. 1 donor would take care of that. Obviously that's the bare minimum. 

But ultimately... adding the 2 Montana schools and NDSU and South Dakota State would be a great long term move

 

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11 minutes ago, AztecSU said:

This is a stretch. We won like 4 conference titles and 2 or 3 regular season titles in BB before those 3 left. Keep in mind 99-00 was the first season of MW basketball iirc. 

Not in FB. 

Prior to the arrivals of Fisch and  Rocky Hoke, we were the doormats of the Conference in both sports. For decades.

As to the tv numbers you posted, i find those numbers surprising. I do recall hearing JD Wicker on the 2019 Hawaii pre-game show explaining why the Divisional Championship game was nit going to be on local tv. He said they had a station that wanted to broadcast rhe game, but they couldn't find an advertiser willing to put up the $12,500 fee to buy the broadcast rights from Hawa'ii's media partner. 

Not a Car Dealership or a bank. Not even SDCCU would pony up. One would think with an average audience of 973k, it would be a slam dunk.

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5 minutes ago, BSUFiend said:

I'm not trying to be a total homer, but the data doesn't make sense to me.  BSU is guaranteed ESPN slots, by default that's pretty high viewership.  How is Hawaii higher than that?  Most of their games are on third tier not available to mainland yeah?

look at the game counts. Boise has 3x whats Hawaii has...then there is what you just said, by default Boise has more games on national tv...the rest of us have much fewer but when we do it tend to be matchups that are favorable for a larger audience...so it actually makes sense a few schools would have a higher avg with such a significant total count discrepancy. The key is when you isolate for specific scenarios, Boise will come out on top. 

 

 

 

 

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Just now, AztecSU said:

look at the game counts. Boise has 3x whats Hawaii has...then there is what you just said, by default Boise has more games on national tv...the rest of us have much fewer but when we do it tend to be matchups that are favorable for a larger audience...so it actually makes sense a few schools would have a high avg. The key is when you isolate for specific scenarios, Boise will come out on top. 

Gotcha, thx for clarifying

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1 minute ago, Spaztecs said:

Not in FB. 

Prior to the arrivals of Fisch and  Rocky Hoke, we were the doormats of the Conference in both sports. For decades.

As to the tv numbers you posted, i find those numbers surprising. I do recall hearing JD Wicker on the 2019 Hawaii pre-game show explaining why the Divisional Championship game was nit going to be on local tv. He said they had a station that wanted to broadcast rhe game, but they couldn't find an advertiser willing to put up the $12,500 fee to buy the broadcast rights from Hawa'ii's media partner. 

Not a Car Dealership or a bank. Not even SDCCU would pony up. One would think with an average audience of 973k, it would be a slam dunk.

We only have that average for national broadcasted games...a local broadcast was guaranteed to lose money...you know since it would only be scene in SoCal/San Diego most likely. 

 

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, jdgaucho said:

 

I highly doubt that any current Big West member is reaching out to the MWC in earnest until all of this is resolved.  If  anything, I'd expect the leftover MWC members (especially Nevada) to be in contact with the Big West.  Because...

 

 

IF the MWC loses all four of Boise, SDSU, Air Force and CSU that makes the MWC much weaker in basketball and volleyball (the sports Hawaii cares about most).  The last thing they'd want - or Cal Poly or UC Davis - is to send every team, every year, to Wyoming and UNM in what's likely now a 1 bid hoops league.  Adding random Texas schools won't entice them either.

 

If the MW is gutted, I believe the Big West will take back at least two of the leftovers amongst Nevada, UNLV, USU, Fresno and SJSU. One of them being Nevada.  

I have zero connections.  This is all just a hunch, my attempt to read the room.

WAC 3.0 Baybee !

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"We don't have evidence but, we have lot's of theories."

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1 minute ago, HawaiiMongoose said:

It's true that UH has been happy in the Big West, for two reasons.  One is obviously reduced travel.  Those trips to the Mountain and Central Time Zones back in the WAC days were expensive and tough on our athletes.  The other is that the Big West sponsors some niche sports important to UH that the MWC doesn't sponsor.

Specifically those sports are men's volleyball, beach volleyball and women's water polo.  Those are a big deal for UH because the Big West is a national powerhouse in all three sports and UH is one of the flagbearers for the conference in all three.  The UH men's volleyball team is the defending national champion; the UH beach volleyball team has won two of the past three Big West titles and made it to the national final four both times; and the UH women's water polo team is the defending Big West champion and a top five team nationally. 

Even so, basketball is the most important non-football sport and UH would love to be in the MWC for basketball.  Our arena (10,300 seats) and fan base (5,717 per game in 2020) are MWC-caliber.  Our performance is admittedly not great, as we haven't won a Big West title since 2016, but recruiting in low mid-major has been tough.  As a UH basketball fan for almost four decades I would be thrilled to see us playing San Diego State, UNLV, Fresno State, Nevada, New Mexico and Utah State again.

If AFA and CSU are in fact leaving that would alleviate some of the travel concern (on both sides).  I'm not sure if that would be enough to tip the balance but it could.  The UH niche sports could either stay in the Big West as affiliate members or move to alternative conferences (the Mountain Pacific Sports Federation sponsors men's volleyball and women's water polo and the WCC sponsors beach volleyball).

 

Would you still want to play those schools again if any of them returned to the Big West? :hmmm: Because if SDSU and Boise also go with the Flyboys, then some of those schools you mentioned will be contacting their old home.

 

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5 minutes ago, Spaztecs said:

WAC 3.0 Baybee !

 

Nothing says FBS like Dixie State (err, Utah Tech), Lamar, Incarnate Word, Southern Utah and company.  Yes, Chicago State is leaving after this year and Southern Utah comes aboard.  But that's a fugly, bloated map.

 

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18 minutes ago, AztecSU said:

Weird right? Here's my take. Adding AFA to the AAC creates additional value because the AFA/Navy game becomes a conference matchup. Plus I suspect more cadets come from the places the AAC plays then the MW. Now CSU, that's weirder, but I think they just want to play in a conference that's in Texas and more aligned with the central time zone. I'm guessing the AAC really wants AFA and are willing to bring CSU along as they have the right profile despite the lack of on field success. 

It's the mythical Denver market.

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"We don't have evidence but, we have lot's of theories."

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4 minutes ago, jdgaucho said:

 

Would you still want to play those schools again if any of them returned to the Big West? :hmmm: Because if SDSU and Boise also go with the Flyboys, then some of those schools you mentioned will be contacting their old home.

 

I sure hope BSU does not.  Memphis/SMU/ECU/USF/Temple/Tulane/Navy/Tulsa..  the only team I could see BSU fans be interested in is Navy.  Compare that to all the teams in MWC, it's a no-brainer as far as what fans would be interested in watching on a Saturday.

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