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bornontheblue

What do we do to get the Bobs & Rebels 18 vaccinated.

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10 minutes ago, Rebels18 said:

Wrong. If that was true there wouldn't be vaccinated people who weren't previous infected with COVID showing symptoms of the monocytes passing through the blood brain barrier and entering the body causing increased size of blood vessels (vasodilation), inflammation of blood cells, and blood clots. The chances of these side effects are small, but enough for me personally to pursue other options. 

 

The T cell response to produce an unusual monocyte from the innate immune system after a mrna vaccine is not the same as the innate immune system response after an infection.  The immune system response is simply not exactly the same when comparing a real infection and the vaccine.

"First identified in a recent vaccine study led by Pulendran, these cells — a small subset of generally abundant cells called monocytes that express high levels of antiviral genes — barely budge in response to an actual COVID-19 infection. But the Pfizer vaccine induced them. 

This special group of monocytes, which are part of the innate museum, constituted only 0.01% of all circulating blood cells prior to vaccination. But after the second Pfizer-vaccine shot, their numbers expanded 100-fold to account for a full 1% of all blood cells. In addition, their disposition became less inflammatory but more intensely antiviral. They seem uniquely capable of providing broad protection against diverse viral infections, Pulendran said."

 

https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/07/immune-system-second-covid-19-vaccine-dose.html

 

I hope the novovax vaccine works well for you

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36 minutes ago, Rebels18 said:

The spike proteins diffuse, the non-classical monocyte build-up that the spike proteins produced DOES NOT. That's the problem......... for the 10th time. @Stealthlobo I literally posted a link to the study in this thread two times and suggested you look at the independent studies done by Dr. Bruce Patterson as well as mRNA vaccine researcher Dr. Robert Malone. Your reading comprehension is bad or you're just being willfully ignorant. 

You also were fully convinced that Antifa was starting fires last year. Only on the internet can pretend physicians make an argument for pausing to take a vaccination that REAL physician’s promote!

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11 minutes ago, Billings said:

 

The T cell response to produce an unusual monocyte from the innate immune system after a mrna vaccine is not the same as the innate immune system response after an infection.  The response is simply not exactly the same at the immune system level to a real infection and the vaccine.

"First identified in a recent vaccine study led by Pulendran, these cells — a small subset of generally abundant cells called monocytes that express high levels of antiviral genes — barely budge in response to an actual COVID-19 infection. But the Pfizer vaccine induced them. 

This special group of monocytes, which are part of the innate museum, constituted only 0.01% of all circulating blood cells prior to vaccination. But after the second Pfizer-vaccine shot, their numbers expanded 100-fold to account for a full 1% of all blood cells. In addition, their disposition became less inflammatory but more intensely antiviral. They seem uniquely capable of providing broad protection against diverse viral infections, Pulendran said."

 

https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2021/07/immune-system-second-covid-19-vaccine-dose.html

Maybe for the S2 protein, but not the S1. The S1 protein is eaten by the classical monocyte, but it making the monocyte change into intermediate and non-classical monocyte which are refusing to go through apoptosis. If the S1 presenting non-classical monocytes undergoes apoptosis, the S1 protein is destroyed and the clotting, inflammation, etc go away. However, in certain cases in vaccinated and non-vaccinated--this just isn't the case. 

Rebel18_zps27699187.gif

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5 minutes ago, NevadaFan said:

You also were fully convinced that Antifa was starting fires last year. Only on the internet can pretend physicians make an argument for pausing to take a vaccination that REAL physician’s promote!

If you want to go back to that thread, I also posted 15+ articles of reports of people arrested for arson in forests in California, and the pacific NW. Many of which were also arrested for inciting violence in Antifa and BLM protests. I never said they were the root of the fires, just contributing to it to pursue the political narrative the media was using the fires for. 

Rebel18_zps27699187.gif

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Just now, Rebels18 said:

If you want to go back to that thread, I also posted 15+ articles of reports of people arrested for arson in forests in California, and the pacific NW. I never said they were the root of the problem, just contributing to it to pursue the narrative. 

Ok fine. You are not a cop. You are not a physician. So you can organize a good argument on a message board. If you get sick your ass is going straight to a real one. 

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45 minutes ago, Rebels18 said:

Maybe for the S2 protein, but not the S1. The S1 protein is eaten by the classical monocyte, but it making the monocyte change into intermediate and non-classical monocyte which are refusing to go through apoptosis. If the S1 presenting non-classical monocytes undergoes apoptosis, the S1 protein is destroyed and the clotting, inflammation, etc go away. However, in certain cases in vaccinated and non-vaccinated--this just isn't the case. 

Well I have not dived into this as deeply as I am sure you have, but just did a few google searches for studies based on the info you posted. I believe what you say is supported by much of what is known today. That being the both vax and nonvax patients can receive, as a side effect, what the study linked below calls "Multi-symptom Inflammatory Syndrome." If what are you discussing is unrelated to this, my apologies, but this seems to be the medical condition you are citing.

The question, which I cannot find a clear answer to, is how common or rare this side effect is as a result of vaccination. Maybe I will be able to find more out there, but the fact that very little of this syndrome has been reported as a result of vaccination, and that the majority of the medical community is still recommending vaccination despite this potential side effect, makes me think this side effect is extremely rare... from the study... plus it seems you still actually have to get infected for it to appear... (bold and underline below are my own)....

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/7/21-0594_article

Abstract

We report 3 patients in California, USA, who experienced multisystem inflammatory syndrome (MIS) after immunization and severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 infection. During the same period, 3 adults who were not vaccinated had MIS develop at a time when ≈7% of the adult patient population had received >1 vaccine.

...

 some scientists are concerned that vaccination against SARS-CoV-2 can trigger MIS-C/A. We report 6 cases of MIS from a large integrated health system in Southern California, USA; 3 of those patients received SARS-CoV-2 vaccination shortly before seeking care for MIS. 

...
 

Conclusions

At the time of our study, our medical group was only vaccinating healthcare workers and patients >75 years of age. The 3 patients that were immunized qualified for early vaccination because they either worked or volunteered in a healthcare setting. These cases occurred ≈1 month after the peak surge of COVID-19 cases in Southern California. At the time these patients sought care, only ≈7% of the adult (>18 years of age) population who were members of the Kaiser Permanente patient group (≈3,776,000 members) had received >1 SARS-CoV-2 vaccine, whereas 3 of the 6 patients in this study who had MIS were vaccinated. These 6 patients were hospitalized at 5 of the 15 Kaiser Permanente medical centers across Southern California. We believe the temporal association after SARS-CoV-2 immunization is worth noting, given the theoretical concern of MIS-C/A after vaccination (3). We did not identify any patients with MIS after vaccination who did not have recent SARS-CoV-2 infection. It is possible that other case-patients in our member population were hospitalized outside of our 15 medical centers and thus were not captured for this case series.

Overall, MIS is rare in adults. In comparison we treated >50 children with MIS-C during January 2021–February 2021 and >100 since May 2020 among a pediatric population of 960,000.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) allows for vaccination after a SARS-CoV-2 infection after recovery from the acute illness and after the isolation period, with no recommended minimal interval between infection and vaccination (4). Most cases of MIS-C/A occur 2–6 weeks after an exposure or infection (13), although we have seen several children brought for care as late as 8–10 weeks after a confirmed infection or exposure. We need to continue to monitor for MIS-C/A after SARS-CoV-2 infection and immunization as more of the population are vaccinated, especially as vaccines are administered to children who are at higher risk for MIS. CDC and the US Food and Drug Administration co-manage VAERS (the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System), which is being used to monitor for adverse events after COVID-19 vaccines. MIS-C/A is listed as a postvaccination adverse event of special interest (5) and should be reported to VAERS (6).

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And another study...

https://casereports.bmj.com/content/14/4/e242060

Abstract

Multisystem inflammatory syndrome in children has become a recognised syndrome, whereas a parallel syndrome in adults, multisystem inflammatory syndrome in adults (MIS-A), has not been well defined. Most cases occur several weeks following confirmed or suspected SARS-CoV-2 infection, but none have been reported in association with SARS-CoV-2 vaccines. Here we describe the case of a 22-year-old man, who received the inactivated SARS-CoV-2 vaccine 6 weeks following a mild COVID-19 infection. He presented after his second dose of the vaccine with a clinical picture of a multisystem inflammatory syndrome-like illness. Additionally, there was laboratory evidence of acute inflammation. The patient’s condition markedly improved after initiation of steroids. Whether the vaccine augmented an already-primed immunity from the infection and contributed to the occurrence of MIS-A is difficult to prove. Understanding the pathogenesis of this condition will shed light on this question and entail major implications on treatment and prevention.

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49 minutes ago, NevadaFan said:

You also were fully convinced that Antifa was starting fires last year. Only on the internet can pretend physicians make an argument for pausing to take a vaccination that REAL physician’s promote!

I’ve been enjoying the flak 18 is taking, but this is the dumbest thing that will be written on the board today. Competition is over, come back tomorrow fellas.

We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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3 minutes ago, thelawlorfaithful said:

I’ve been enjoying the flak 18 is taking, but this is the dumbest thing that will be written on the board today. Competition is over, come back tomorrow fellas.

I dunno about that. He posted studies, I posted studies. I think he has hit on a genuine syndrome, but so far it only seems to get triggered in people who get vaccinated after a recent Covid infection. I don't see anything that says people who have not been exposed to the virus and get vaccinated need to worry about the issues he has presented. Maybe we are talking about different things though?

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1 minute ago, SharkTanked said:

I dunno about that. He posted studies, I posted studies. I think he has hit on a genuine syndrome, but so far it only seems to get triggered in people who get vaccinated after a recent Covid infection. I don't see anything that says people who have not been exposed to the virus and get vaccinated need to worry about the issues he has presented. Maybe we are talking about different things though?

Yeah we’re definitely talking about different things. Go toe to toe with 18 all day. Trying to pin something else on him as false which we all witnessed for months last year, as not being real in order to prove a medical science point...just wave the white flag at that point. Gaslighting will not work. Stick to the numbers and studies like you have been doing.

We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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I took my 15 year old into get his first shot yesterday after quite a bit of deliberation with my wife.  We specifically chose the phizer, and tbh am not sure I would have done the moderna for my son if that was all that was available. (based on my wife's reaction to it)

He has a sore arm and light headache, that's all, so I'm grateful.

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2 hours ago, Rebels18 said:

Wow, you said the word ignorant 4 times. Good argument. What did I say specifically that was "anti-science"? Your brain is too squishy and smooth to to illicit any future responses from me. 

I was hoping @bornontheblue would tag in someone like you. Since Trump got voted out, it's been awhile since we've had internet beef!

The vaccine has barely been released long enough to extrapolate that kind of information yet.--and let's face it: the media/bigpharma/government agenda is clearly taking the stance of everyone get vaxxed and we'll kick the can down the road of any possible consequences of that later. For the record, The mRNA vaccine works as intended and isn't part of the problem, I'm just not convinced it's the safest solution yet. I said multiple times the vaccine is effective in immunizing against COVID. But, it still introduces your body to the S1 spike proteins that produce the build-up of non-classical monocytes that knockdown your immune system and making you susceptible to other problems I listed above (nano-clotting, vasodilation, etc) and may even require future booster shots to keep your immune to future variants. This is rare, but enough for me to want to explore other options. You can get these S1 Spike proteins from either getting COVID or taking the vaccine. The possible long-term effects (15 month+) of these proteins are in the study I posted above.

By the way, I never said "I don't want to be part of an experiment" -- I just said I don't want to take an experimental mRNA vaccination when I have the freedom (atleast for now) to pursue other options. 

For the record, I agree with you on the bolded. The good news, from what I have seen, is that the inflammatory syndromes are rare and perfectly treatable. OTOH, this Delta variant seems to be a legit killer, spreading like wildfire at present. Playing the odds, waiting for a safer, bullet-proof treatment, or waiting for the studies to be performed on the current ones, seems like a very poor decision.

The treatment to prevent dying from Covid is here now. People who do not take it are dying from Covid now. If the world ends up coming down with an inflammatory syndrome, then better buy stock in the makers of the treatment steroids.

But going off the data so far, it seems that the multi-symptom inflammation syndrome only presents within 2 months after vax or infection. So we should know in the next month how common it really is.

As to the vaccine nRNA potentially putting the body on long-term overdrive, again there seems to be treatment for this (steroids to treat the inflammation) and we will see how often it happens. At least those of us who got vaxxed will for sure be around to see it.

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7 minutes ago, CPslograd said:

I took my 15 year old into get his first shot yesterday after quite a bit of deliberation with my wife.  We specifically chose the phizer, and tbh am not sure I would have done the moderna for my son if that was all that was available. (based on my wife's reaction to it)

He has a sore arm and light headache, that's all, so I'm grateful.

I had Moderna with 0 reactions. It's been 5 months vaccinated for me. It just seems to be so specific to the individual person. I've heard horror stories about the Pfizer reaction. I really see them both as essentially the same thing.

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9 minutes ago, SharkTanked said:

I had Moderna with 0 reactions. It's been 5 months vaccinated for me. It just seems to be so specific to the individual person. I've heard horror stories about the Pfizer reaction. I really see them both as essentially the same thing.

I'd have to see data on it.  Anecdotally the moderna a has been worse, the lady giving the shot yesterday said as much, and has given at least hundredS and probably thousands of covid shots.

Women and youth are more likely to have side effects to vaccines in general than adult males.

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Just now, CPslograd said:

I'd have to see data on it.  Anecdotally the moderna a has been worse, the lady giving c the yesterday said as much, and has given at least hundred and probably thousands of covid shots.

Women and youth are more likely to have side effects to vaccines in general than adult males.

I know my whole work got Moderna and I heard of very little side effects with it. But that was back on Jan-Feb so I am sure more studies have been done since then. My wife got Moderna, no problem as well. My daughter got Pfizer and no issues too.

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8 minutes ago, CPslograd said:

I'd have to see data on it.  Anecdotally the moderna a has been worse, the lady giving the shot yesterday said as much, and has given at least hundredS and probably thousands of covid shots.

Women and youth are more likely to have side effects to vaccines in general than adult males.

When it's all said and done, in the grand scheme, they have pretty similar efficacy and adverse event profile. I've administered about 2000 Pfizer immunizations, and 1000 moderna.

Anecdotally, I had Moderna in Jan, my gf had Pfizer last Dec. She had a much worse reaction than I did.

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5 hours ago, TheSanDiegan said:

See, it is utter tripe bullshit like this remark that unfortunately serve to invalidate the wealth of information you've shared in this discussion from your own admittedly impressive deep dive on the subject.

Please post one - just one - link to a peer reviewed, published study that shows 1 in a 1,000 people who receive one of the mRNA vaccines has died. What f*cking nonsense man. :waiting:

And news flash: you say you don't want to be part of an experiment? Well, guess what? You're part of the control group. :facepalm:

@TheSanDiegan. What is your career /academic background? You seem knowledgeable about this here and on the main Covid thread? 

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2 hours ago, CPslograd said:

I'd have to see data on it.  Anecdotally the moderna a has been worse, the lady giving the shot yesterday said as much, and has given at least hundredS and probably thousands of covid shots.

Women and youth are more likely to have side effects to vaccines in general than adult males.

Seems like younger people actually have more of a reaction than older people as well.

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4 minutes ago, toonkee said:

Seems like younger people actually have more of a reaction than older people as well.

Apparently that is normal with vaccines, that young people are more likely to have adverse reactions because of their more robust immune system, or at least that’s what I’ve read in multiple places

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2 hours ago, thelawlorfaithful said:

Yeah we’re definitely talking about different things. Go toe to toe with 18 all day. Trying to pin something else on him as false which we all witnessed for months last year, as not being real in order to prove a medical science point...just wave the white flag at that point. Gaslighting will not work. Stick to the numbers and studies like you have been doing.

I’m getting called out for mentioning his bizarre behavior on this board last year?  😂😂 When you don’t have a degree or background science, don’t work in medical science? This board is primarily a bunch of dudes on their phones/browsers?! It’s fun to argue about sports and other nonsense but to claim you understand a complex science because you read a few articles on the internet? That is the root of the problem. 😂😂

Like I said… the nanosecond that he needs REAL medical attention? Straight to an MD at a hospital.  

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