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16 hours ago, Someone said:

       Year    Ticket Sales    Contributions  Attendance
Kansas 2019    $19,391,708    $39,878,924    33,875

WVU    2019    $19,226,587    $19,017,866     55,907

ISU    2019     $16,474,938    $18,206,649    59,794

OkState 2019    $13,911,211    $24,736,163     54,817

KSU    2019    $15,903,614    $20,560,128     48,818

TTU    2019    $14,269,267    $24,187,872     53,418

CSU    2019    $5,784,735    $9,482,232      23,338

AF     2019    $3,579,247    $4,294,586      27,084

SDSU   2019    $6,596,027    $6,673,651    29,896

UNLV   2019    $4,726,304    $7,320,082      19,864

Boise  2019    $7,016,928    $12,662,391    32,070

Fresno 2019    $6,429,309    $9,768,812      31,552

WY     2019    $3,971,849    $10,844,094     23,007

Nevada 2019    $9,683,290    $6,914,931      16,180

USU    2019    $2,023,744    $6,469,402      19,609

NMU    2019    $5,042,302    $4,385,068      15,747

SJSU   2019    $623,166    $1,831,978      15,396

UH     2019    $4,882,307    $9,602,299      25,518

UCF    2019    $5,984,236    $10,868,415     43,788

Cincy  2019    $7,736,020    $6,912,701      35,985

ECU    2019    $6,190,857    $7,940,669      33,134

Memphis 2019    $10,755,844    $13,063,202     38,816

USF    2019    $4,600,251    $5,153,552      31,823

 

 

I suppose you are going to try and make the argument that fan support, donor support, and attendance is really not reflective on any value of a program and that really media companies want to spend money on programs that no one shows up live to see, no one buys tickets to see and no one gives donations to support

I'm actually surprised how well our numbers compare to say ISU or WVU for instance.

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While attendance is a good measuring stick of fan support, if a few programs in the MWC and AAC had years of Big 12 money to expand their stadiums and sell season ticket packages with homes games against Oklahoma and Texas I am sure there attendance would be higher.  It's not apples to apples.

 

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2 hours ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

While attendance is a good measuring stick of fan support, if a few programs in the MWC and AAC had years of Big 12 money to expand their stadiums and sell season ticket packages with homes games against Oklahoma and Texas I am sure there attendance would be higher.  It's not apples to apples.

 

one game a year is not going to make a massive difference on ticket sales and in a 12 team (or more) conference you would not even be getting a home game every year with either Texas or OU

plus you have to ask if any of those programs are consistently selling out their stajium now and if not why not......it is a stretch to say that a program would have a large expansion of their stajium based on a single home game at most once a year and probably less often than that

then there are the donor dollars.....the same old "let us in and we will show you".......how about having those donors show a conference NOW so it is actually convincing instead of "hope"

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2 hours ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

While attendance is a good measuring stick of fan support, if a few programs in the MWC and AAC had years of Big 12 money to expand their stadiums and sell season ticket packages with homes games against Oklahoma and Texas I am sure there attendance would be higher.  It's not apples to apples.

 

Ground already covered.

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1 minute ago, RSF said:

Ground already covered.

 

Still waiting for your Fiesta Bowl attendance response.  Boise fans eclipsed TCU fans.  The announcers commented on it, journalists mentioned it.  Boise fans gave us a home field advantage compared to the TCU fans.

 

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1 minute ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

 

Still waiting for your Fiesta Bowl attendance response.  Boise fans eclipsed TCU fans.  The announcers commented on it, journalists mentioned it.  Boise fans gave us a home field advantage compared to the TCU fans.

 

I mean if we are going off BCS bowl game attendance, Boise cock slaps the ever living shit out of TCU.

 A major story line in the 2010 Fiest Bowl was how many more Boise fans there were than TCU fans.  

 

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4 minutes ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

 

Still waiting for your Fiesta Bowl attendance response.  Boise fans eclipsed TCU fans.  The announcers commented on it, journalists mentioned it.  Boise fans gave us a home field advantage compared to the TCU fans.

 

It wasnt 2 to 1.  That you eclipsed us is nice, considering how much bigger of a school it is.  You were 3x bigger than us at the time.   You SHOULD have had more people. But we sold our allotment and then some, which is good enough to impress people.  Wisconsin eclipsed us, too, but we did OK with 35K, considering we only have about 90,000 living alumni.  Which impressed a LOT of people.

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1 minute ago, RSF said:

It wasnt 2 to 1.  That you eclipsed us is nice, considering how much bigger of a school it is.  You were 3x bigger than us at the time.   You SHOULD have had more people. Wisconsin eclipsed us, too, but we did OK with 35K, considering we only have about 90,000 living alumni.

Sure seemed like it.  We had home field over you.  The announcers mentioned it several times.  Bragging about Fiesta Bowl attendance in an argument for how much TCU is worth more than MWC schools...yeah I am going to call that out.

TCU has a lot of value, especially compared to the the AAC and MWC teams...You do not have more value than Boise based on that singular argument, not even close.  You have more value than Boise for other reasons.  But that Fiesta Bowl, the Boise fans out numbered TCU fans by a shit ton.  

 

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1 hour ago, Someone said:

one game a year is not going to make a massive difference on ticket sales and in a 12 team (or more) conference you would not even be getting a home game every year with either Texas or OU

plus you have to ask if any of those programs are consistently selling out their stajium now and if not why not......it is a stretch to say that a program would have a large expansion of their stajium based on a single home game at most once a year and probably less often than that

then there are the donor dollars.....the same old "let us in and we will show you".......how about having those donors show a conference NOW so it is actually convincing instead of "hope"

Disagree completely.  If a MWC team had the home schedule of Big 12 teams you would see an explosive growth in ticket sells.

Don't be dumb.

 

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3 hours ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

While attendance is a good measuring stick of fan support, if a few programs in the MWC and AAC had years of Big 12 money to expand their stadiums and sell season ticket packages with homes games against Oklahoma and Texas I am sure there attendance would be higher.  It's not apples to apples.

 

I agree.  However I was curious how much UT and OU mattered to ISU's attendance.  Going back over the past several years, ISU's home games against UT and OU was in line or lower than their season average.  Perhaps it's different for the Texas and OK schools.

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1 hour ago, Someone said:

one game a year is not going to make a massive difference on ticket sales and in a 12 team (or more) conference you would not even be getting a home game every year with either Texas or OU

plus you have to ask if any of those programs are consistently selling out their stajium now and if not why not......it is a stretch to say that a program would have a large expansion of their stajium based on a single home game at most once a year and probably less often than that

then there are the donor dollars.....the same old "let us in and we will show you".......how about having those donors show a conference NOW so it is actually convincing instead of "hope"

It's not a single home game.  Although yeah, a single home game for Boise State where OU or Texas was there, would make our season ticket package worth explode.  There would be a waiting list.

 

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27 minutes ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

It's not a single home game.  Although yeah, a single home game for Boise State where OU or Texas was there, would make our season ticket package worth explode.  There would be a waiting list.

 

if you are in a conference with Texas and OU even if you are in the same division with Texas and OU you would play one at home one year and one on the road one year and then rotate

or you could have both at home one year and then neither at home the next year

if you were not in the same division with them then you would play them even less often than that

so at best you are going to get one home game a year (on average) because even if you have both at home for one year you would have neither at home the next year

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3 minutes ago, Someone said:

if you are in a conference with Texas and OU even if you are in the same division with Texas and OU you would play one at home one year and one on the road one year and then rotate

or you could have both at home one year and then neither at home the next year

if you were not in the same division with them then you would play them even less often than that

so at best you are going to get one home game a year (on average) because even if you have both at home for one year you would have neither at home the next year

 

Dude our home games against Oregon State had single ticket prices double.

One home game a year against Texas or OU would double our demand for season tickets.

 

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Even a game against TT or Baylor would drive Boise ticket sales.  Shit our one home game against TCU had scalpers selling tickets for 3 times purchase value....

 

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55 minutes ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

Disagree completely.  If a MWC team had the home schedule of Big 12 teams you would see an explosive growth in ticket sells.

Don't be dumb.

 

and making that claim is not impressive or persuasive any program cam CLAIM that and more importantly a conference is looking for ADDITIVE members they are not looking for members that will come into the conference and mainly get a benefit for themselves

they want a program that BENEFITS THE CONFERENCE because pretty much any program out there can say "it would be better for us to be in your conference"

you do not benefit YOUR CONFERENCE by adding members that would still be at the bottom of your conference in most metrics and when compared to other P5 programs in other conferences

I made this chart before with the 2018-19 revenues

what is shows is revenues - subsidies from the academic side (because it is not at all impressive to take money off the backs of students)

then what it shows is the minus $4 million to cover a full share of AAC or MWC conference revenues (probably a bit low for the AAC and a bit high for the MWC) because if you are not in the AAC or MWC you are no longer getting a share of their revneues and then ot adds in a $32 million dollar share of "P5" money

so right there you can see that pretty much all but a couple of G5 programs even with a full share on "P5" money would be at the very very very bottom of P5 revenues when academic side subsidies are removed

then I allowed in a massively ridiculous $22 million academic side subsidy for the G5 programs only (while all the P5 have no academic side subsidy still) and doing that all the G5 programs would still be in the bottom 25% of total revenues compared to the P5.......and that is with a massively ridiculous $22 million academic side subsidy added in for those G5 programs

but of course some will argue "well we would have that massive increase in ticket sales and donations" (they wouldn't) and the answer to that is "well start proving it NOW stop making conferences have to "trust you"

so what it comes down to is even with a full share of $32 million in P5 money all of the G5 programs would be at the very very very bottom of total revenues as compared to the current P5 and no conference is excited about adding that because those P5 programs at the very bottom are already struggling

and even adding in a stupid high academic side subsidy still leaves programs at or near the bottom and no conference is excited about those prospects especially combined with "well but if only ticket sales and donations" especially when there is nothing preventing those programs from telling THEIR OWN FANS AND DONORS to to start proving it NOW instead of asking a conference to make a 25 to 50 year decision on blind faith....and all the more so for a program that is looking at being at the very lowest of P5 budgets 

 

mega.png.4b4621d4fed51571d3cb04c0ce2d38ea.png

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5 minutes ago, Someone said:

and making that claim is not impressive or persuasive any program cam CLAIM that and more importantly a conference is looking for ADDITIVE members they are not looking for members that will come into the conference and mainly get a benefit for themselves

they want a program that BENEFITS THE CONFERENCE because pretty much any program out there can say "it would be better for us to be in your conference"

you do not benefit YOUR CONFERENCE by adding members that would still be at the bottom of your conference in most metrics and when compared to other P5 programs in other conferences

I made this chart before with the 2018-19 revenues

what is shows is revenues - subsidies from the academic side (because it is not at all impressive to take money off the backs of students)

then what it shows is the minus $4 million to cover a full share of AAC or MWC conference revenues (probably a bit low for the AAC and a bit high for the MWC) because if you are not in the AAC or MWC you are no longer getting a share of their revneues and then ot adds in a $32 million dollar share of "P5" money

so right there you can see that pretty much all bout a couple of G5 programs even with a full share on "P5" money would be at the very very very bottom of P5 revenues when academic side subsidies are removed

then I allowed in a massively ridiculous $22 million academic side subsidy for the G5 programs only (while all the P5 have no academic side subsidy still) and doing that all the G5 programs would still be in the bottom 25% of total revenues compared to the P5.......and that is with a massively ridiculous $22 million academic side subsidy added in for those G5 programs

but of course some will argue "well we would have that massive increase in ticket sales and donations" (they wouldn't) and the answer to that is "well start proving it NOW stop making conferences have to "trust you"

so what it comes down to is even with a full share of $32 million in P5 money all of the G5 programs would be at the very very very bottom of total revenues as compared to the current P5 and no conference is excited about adding that because those P5 programs at the very bottom are already struggling

and even adding in a stupid high academic side subsidy still leaves programs at or near the bottom and no conference is excited about those prospects especially combined with "well but if only ticket sales and donations" especially when there is nothing preventing those programs from telling THEIR OWN FANS AND DONORS to to start proving it NOW instead of asking a conference to make a 25 to 50 year decision on blind faith....and all the more so for a program that is looking at being at the very lowest of P5 budgets 

 

mega.png.4b4621d4fed51571d3cb04c0ce2d38ea.png

 

TLDR most of this...

But yeah, comparing home game attendance from top teams in the MWC and AAC with Big 12 teams is stupid as shit.  If MWC and AAC teams had Big 12 money and home games several of our teams would be right there with the Big 12 teams.

 

Arguing otherwise is retarded.

 

 

 

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Shit just look at Boise over running TCU fans in the Fiesta Bowl.  There was one dominant fan base, so much so it made news.  Boise fans cock slapped TCU fans, 2-1.

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If you do not think a Boise State, CSU, Houston, etc... would have shown way, balls  to the walls higher attendance if they had years and years of Big 12 revenue to expand seating and sold season packages that included home games against B12 schools you are too stupid to continue a conversation with.  

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Anybody who thinks a single home game against UT or OU would not drastically increase season ticket sells at a Nevada, CSU or Boise is too retarded to continue to talk to.  Let alone the fact even the TTU and Baylors of the world would sell out....

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