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Whats Up Doc

Customers Shouldn't Be Responsible For Subsidizing Restaurants Server Wages

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Anyone else fed up with restaurants getting a free ride in skirting paying minimum wage to servers?  Minimum wage is called minimum wage for a reason.  Having a tier lower than that is a subsidy that hurts both the customer and the server. 

Servers are twice as likely to live in poverty than minimum wage employees.  Gratuities are not mandatory.  Many, many people under tip or don't tip at all. 

I don't buy into the argument that paying higher wages to anyone affects a company's ability to stay in business.  It's horseshit.  If fast food restaurants like McDonald's can pay minimum wage to their entire staff and earn big profits, so can any restaurant.  If you can't you need to rethink your business model. 

Ever notice how many tip jars appear in so many restaurants (and other businesses!) that don't have servers?  The responsibility of subsidizing a worker's wage keeps getting passed to the customer.  Tips used to be 15%.  Now if you tip less than 20% you're an asshole.  This wouldn't be an issue if restaurants would put their big boy pants on and pay their employees minimum wage or higher. 

Discuss...

https://www.consumerreports.org/tipping/is-it-time-to-rethink-the-rules-of-tipping-etiquette/

 

 

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Technically all servers are guaranteed at least minimum wage... if their tips + base wage don't add up to minimum wage then the employer is required to cover the difference. I still tip at least 15%, but the whole pay structure and tip culture is really annoying.

A little nugget my wife taught me from her waitress days: If you decide to tip, try and leave a cash tip instead of adding it to the credit card. That way the restaurant staff get the full tip amount and can share it easier with the kitchen staff.

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In Good higher end restaurants servers usually make a killing on tips. 
 

As a pizza delivery guy in HS, here’s what I got in 1982. Let’s say I worked from 12 to 8 on a Sunday. I’d usually make 25 to 30 deliveries. I’d take out 4 orders at a time to deliver near the others.

Minimum Wage  $3.35 x 8 = $26.80
Delivery Wage (used own car and gas) $1.50 per deliver time 30 = $45.00
Tips usually added to about 75 cents to $2, but average about $1. So $1 x 30 deliveries = $30.00.

26.80 + 45 + 30 = $101.80

Current Value  = $275.91

$3.35 MW in 1982 = $9.08 today

That comes to $34 an hour (now) and $72,700 annually.  It was a great job and I come home for summers and some weekends when I was in school. I was able to pay my tuition and living expenses every year. 

 

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4 hours ago, Whats Up Doc said:

Anyone else fed up with restaurants getting a free ride in skirting paying minimum wage to servers?  Minimum wage is called minimum wage for a reason.  Having a tier lower than that is a subsidy that hurts both the customer and the server. 

Servers are twice as likely to live in poverty than minimum wage employees.  Gratuities are not mandatory.  Many, many people under tip or don't tip at all. 

I don't buy into the argument that paying higher wages to anyone affects a company's ability to stay in business.  It's horseshit.  If fast food restaurants like McDonald's can pay minimum wage to their entire staff and earn big profits, so can any restaurant.  If you can't you need to rethink your business model. 

Ever notice how many tip jars appear in so many restaurants (and other businesses!) that don't have servers?  Passing the responsibility of subsidizing a worker's wage keeps getting passed to the customer.  Tips used to be 15%.  Now if you tip less than 20% you're an asshole.  This wouldn't be an issue if restaurants would put their big boy pants on and pay their employees minimum wage or higher. 

Discuss...

https://www.consumerreports.org/tipping/is-it-time-to-rethink-the-rules-of-tipping-etiquette/

 

 

Most restaurants operate on a margin of 3%-6%. If you think that raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour won't affect a restaurant's ability to stay in business. especially mom-and-pop restaurants (which make up 90% of restaurants) and in the post-COVID times, then you're sadly mistaken. McDonald's and other fast food restaurants have already begun automating order taker's jobs with apps and kiosks and reduced its workforce 50% from 2013 to 2018. When minimum wage goes to $15, you'll see a ton of jobs that most would consider part-time, second jobs go away, so while they may be making more at their original job (assuming it's minimum wage), they won't have the ability to work a second job and there will be fewer of those available.

Maybe stepping out of the 1980's and tipping 20% instead of 15% would help those servers even more. 

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4 hours ago, Nevada Convert said:

In Good higher end restaurants servers usually make a killing on tips. 
 

As a pizza delivery guy in HS, here’s what I got in 1982. Let’s say I worked from 12 to 8 on a Sunday. I’d usually make 25 to 30 deliveries. I’d take out 4 orders at a time to deliver near the others.

Minimum Wage  $3.35 x 8 = $26.80
Delivery Wage (used own car and gas) $1.50 per deliver time 30 = $45.00
Tips usually added to about 75 cents to $2, but average about $1. So $1 x 30 deliveries = $30.00.

26.80 + 45 + 30 = $101.80

Current Value  = $275.91

$3.35 MW in 1982 = $9.08 today

That comes to $34 an hour (now) and $72,700 annually.  It was a great job and I come home for summers and some weekends when I was in school. I was able to pay my tuition and living expenses every year. 

 

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The problem for pizza delivery drivers is that their wages haven't increased at the same pace of inflation. Your numbers also prove this. I also delivered pizza as a Senior in High School with Dominos and as a part time job while in undergrad. Like you, these monies covered my living costs (I had scholarships for school).

 

In 2001 and when gasoline prices were about $1.20/gallon for me, I was paid $5.50/hr wage, 20 cents per mile and averaged between 3 and 4 deliveries per hour averaging $2.25 per run tip. I made roughly $13-$15 per hour after subtracting gas costs and general car maintenance costs. In today's dollars, my wage then would be roughly between $38,000 and $44,000 per year. At the time, I was making more money than any of my high school friends by quite a bit.

 

I've talked with a general manager friend in 2021 for Dominos in the same area I worked many years ago. In fact, both the current general manager and I worked together as drivers in 2001. He stated, that drivers today average roughly the same amount of deliveries and about $3.50 per run tip but are paid only between $6/hr and $7/hr wage. In addition, they only get between 30 and 35 cents per mile while gasoline prices are $2.40/gallon. Roughly, they make between $14-$17 per hour after subtracting gas costs and general car maintenance costs. This equates to a wage of roughly between $27,000 and $33,000 per year. Still decent money for a high school kid but hardly a wage that could pay for the average person's living costs.

 

If I took into account inflation, my $13-$15 per hour in 2001 would equal $20-$23 per hour in 2021. No delivery drivers in my area are making that today. Now I am all for capitalism and believe those drivers should look for a different job because that wage doesn't justify car wear and tear costs and odd hours IMO. But it is simply not true that a delivery driver can make a wage anywhere close to $70,000 per year in most areas.

 

Very interesting in today's dollars accepting the numbers as relatively accurate (knowing that it varies by location and living costs are different in different locations):

1982: Pizza Delivery paid $72,000 per year

2001 Pizza Delivery paid $41,000 per year

2021 Pizza Delivery paid $30,000 per year

 

My advice - Kids learn a skill and look for a better career. Go to college, learn a trade such as plumbing/electrician, learn to operate heavy machinery...but don't look at pizza or food delivery as an actual career potential.

 

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7 hours ago, misplacedcowboy said:

 

A little nugget my wife taught me from her waitress days: If you decide to tip, try and leave a cash tip instead of adding it to the credit card. That way the restaurant staff get the full tip amount and can share it easier with the kitchen staff.

That nugget your wife taught you has little to do with sharing the tips and everything to do with not claiming the tips as gross income for tax purposes. Restaurants that do tip sharing with kitchen staff can do that with credit cards and their computers very easily (they just apportion the tips). 

 

The 'big secret' which isn't a secret at all is that servers and other tipped workers are almost always taking home more money than they are claiming and being taxed on. But in the days of credit card purchasing versus cash, that is quickly ending.

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8 hours ago, misplacedcowboy said:

Technically all servers are guaranteed at least minimum wage... if their tips + base wage don't add up to minimum wage then the employer is required to cover the difference. I still tip at least 15%, but the whole pay structure and tip culture is really annoying.

A little nugget my wife taught me from her waitress days: If you decide to tip, try and leave a cash tip instead of adding it to the credit card. That way the restaurant staff get the full tip amount and can share it easier with the kitchen staff.

That doesn't change the fact that the responsibility to subsidize a server's wages falls directly on the customer.  Gratuities are not wages, they are a bonus the customer offers for service. 

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6 hours ago, soupslam1 said:

My stepmother was a waitress. I guarantee she made a helluva lot more than mimimum wage. 

No, she was subsidized more than whatever your state saddled servers with that was below minimum wage.  Why the hell is it called minimum wage if there's a tier below it?

 

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6 hours ago, Slapdad said:

Most restaurants operate on a margin of 3%-6%. If you think that raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour won't affect a restaurant's ability to stay in business. especially mom-and-pop restaurants (which make up 90% of restaurants) and in the post-COVID times, then you're sadly mistaken. McDonald's and other fast food restaurants have already begun automating order taker's jobs with apps and kiosks and reduced its workforce 50% from 2013 to 2018. When minimum wage goes to $15, you'll see a ton of jobs that most would consider part-time, second jobs go away, so while they may be making more at their original job (assuming it's minimum wage), they won't have the ability to work a second job and there will be fewer of those available.

Maybe stepping out of the 1980's and tipping 20% instead of 15% would help those servers even more. 

 

Jesus H Christ.  Where did I mention raising the minimum wage?!?  Not that your argument holds any merit, it's been debunked more times than Trump lied.

The argument was that servers should start at MINIMUM WAGE, not the tier below it that has saddled them forever and a day.

And for the others here jumping on the bandwagon - did any of you read the freaking attached article?  Servers are TWICE AS LIKELY TO LIVE IN POVERTY THAN REGULAR WORKERS ON MINIMUM WAGE.

People here can be such morons.

 

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2 minutes ago, Whats Up Doc said:

 

People here can such morons.

 

Is “can” meant to be an action verb in this sentence?

bsu_retro_bsu_logo_helmet.b_1.jpg

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5 minutes ago, BSUTOP25 said:

Is “can” meant to be an action verb in this sentence?

For you, a "can" is that space you're trapped in promoting stupid shit like Libertarianism. 

And I fixed the sentence by adding the word "be".  Must be those rich line workers in Southeast Asia shirking their jobs that caused my laptop keys to fail typing the word in the first time.

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6 hours ago, Slapdad said:

Most restaurants operate on a margin of 3%-6%. If you think that raising the minimum wage to $15 an hour won't affect a restaurant's ability to stay in business. especially mom-and-pop restaurants (which make up 90% of restaurants) and in the post-COVID times, then you're sadly mistaken. McDonald's and other fast food restaurants have already begun automating order taker's jobs with apps and kiosks and reduced its workforce 50% from 2013 to 2018. When minimum wage goes to $15, you'll see a ton of jobs that most would consider part-time, second jobs go away, so while they may be making more at their original job (assuming it's minimum wage), they won't have the ability to work a second job and there will be fewer of those available.

Maybe stepping out of the 1980's and tipping 20% instead of 15% would help those servers even more. 

How do all the restaurants in the dozen or so states that require minimum wage, or higher, manage to stay in business?

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1 minute ago, Whats Up Doc said:

 

Jesus H Christ.  Where did I mention raising the minimum wage?!?  Not that your argument holds any merit, it's been debunked more times than Trump lied.

The argument was that servers should start at MINIMUM WAGE, not the tier below it that has saddled them forever and a day.

And for the others here jumping on the bandwagon - did any of you read the freaking attached article?  Servers are TWICE AS LIKELY TO LIVE IN POVERTY THAN REGULAR WORKERS ON MINIMUM WAGE.

People here can such morons.

 

Did YOU read the article? It talks about raising the minimum wage to $15/hour in there (as well as 20% being the customary tipping percentage, so you should brush up on that). Even if it hadn't been mentioned in the article, the two topics nearly always go hand in hand and are related, so save the tantrum. And since we're fleshing out moronic statements, a subsidy is something paid by the government, which tipping is not, it's paid by the customer. And if the servers are going to be paid a higher wage, the customer will ultimately pay that in higher menu prices, which means that cheapskates who tip 15% will be forced to pay what the rest of us have been paying for years. So the crux of the article is that 13% of food servers are below the poverty line. It's not like the U.S. has a disparate percentage of people living below the poverty line when compared to other countries. The U.S. is at about the same percentage (15%) as most developed nations (lower than Japan, Germany, Spain, but higher than Switzerland, Austria ) and according to this salary survey, the average salary for a food server is $14.23/an hour. The problem is that roughly 50% of food servers work no more than 29 hours per week and if that's they're only job, they'll be below the poverty line. Anyone who has any sort of work ethic (working two jobs to get close to 40 hours a week) will far exceed the poverty level. That all being said, food server is a job that takes no college or even a high school diploma, yet still affords someone to the opportunity to make a decent living. 

 

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1 hour ago, Whats Up Doc said:

That doesn't change the fact that the responsibility to subsidize a server's wages falls directly on the customer.  Gratuities are not wages, they are a bonus the customer offers for service. 

OK, but people could stop paying all tips tomorrow and servers would still be guaranteed at least minimum wage by their employer. 

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