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Bob

Time to clean up elections?

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I was listening to Rush, Mark Steyn was filling in, and a caller from South Africa chimed in and was talking about South African elections. They are issued a government-issued voting ID number with a government-issued photo ID. One MUST have these to vote. One MUST be registered and have an attached address. There are other very, very strict laws in place to ensure a fair election. wide spread mail-in voting is NOT part of their program. Again, this is south africa. The caller couldn't believe what was going on in the USA.

 

Canada counts every damn vote by hand in the presense of many witnesses. +++++ computers. I don't want computers counting votes anymore.

 

Everyone all around the world, except for American Democrats (save your very own Jimmy Carter), recognize that widespread mail-in voting is a recipe for fraud. US elections are a +++++ing joke. Get IDs. Get better laws for witnesses. Get computers out of the equation. Period. Get rid of ballot harvesting.

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It would be real easy to detect fraud using financial auditing techniques. Cheap to do too.

Get a batch of random ballots and tie them back to the voter who cast it. Confirm with them that how their vote was recorded was how they indeed voted. 

Then do it in reverse. Grab a random sample of voters and tie it back to a recorded ballot. Repeat the confirming process. You could find out real quick if there was fraud significant enough to throw out election results. 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

It would be real easy to detect fraud using financial auditing techniques. Cheap to do too.

Get a batch of random ballots and tie them back to the voter who cast it. Confirm with them that how their vote was recorded was how they indeed voted. 

Then do it in reverse. Grab a random sample of voters and tie it back to a recorded ballot. Repeat the confirming process. You could find out real quick if there was fraud significant enough to throw out election results. 

bill barr already said there's little evidence for widespread voter fraud

https://apnews.com/article/barr-no-widespread-election-fraud-b1f1488796c9a98c4b1a9061a6c7f49d

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Just now, AndroidAggie said:

south africa is sort of the kings of disenfranchisement.  i'd prefer not to take cues from them on how to conduct voting that's equitable and fair.

Especially when that person calls into a hyper-bias medium.  It's self-affirming.

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3 minutes ago, AndroidAggie said:

bill barr already said there's little evidence for widespread voter fraud

https://apnews.com/article/barr-no-widespread-election-fraud-b1f1488796c9a98c4b1a9061a6c7f49d

I am not saying there was voter fraud. I don't believe there was enough on a large enough scale to overturn the election. I am saying it wouldn't be hard to find it if there was. 

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17 minutes ago, Bob said:

I was listening to Rush, Mark Steyn was filling in, and a caller from South Africa chimed in and was talking about South African elections. They are issued a government-issued voting ID number with a government-issued photo ID. One MUST have these to vote. One MUST be registered and have an attached address. There are other very, very strict laws in place to ensure a fair election. wide spread mail-in voting is NOT part of their program. Again, this is south africa. The caller couldn't believe what was going on in the USA.

 

Canada counts every damn vote by hand in the presense of many witnesses. +++++ computers. I don't want computers counting votes anymore.

 

Everyone all around the world, except for American Democrats (except your very own Jimmy Carter), recognize that widespread mail-in voting is a recipe for fraud. US elections are a +++++ing joke. Get IDs. Get better laws for witnesses. Get computers out of the equation. Period. Get rid of ballot harvesting.

People wouldn't have an issue with voter IDs if the government would provide them to the population for FREE and easy. The problem is that isn't the case. So I'm for your first part. There is no issues with computers counting votes as long as there is a paper backup like there is most places now. The last 4 years most states have gone to more paper ballots. In Georgia, in 2016 they had no paper ballots and that is a recipe for disaster(especially when they wipe the machines before they can look at the data in an audit) now they can hand recount(which they did this year). The in person counting here is done in front of many witnesses like in Canada(apparently). Mail in voting leaves a paper trail which makes it extremely hard for fraud from what I understand. The states with all mail in voting don't have many issues that I have seen. So I don't think anyone will disagree with most of your points except for mail in voting because that is what we do here(plus FREE IDs provided to all citizens)

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4 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

I am not saying there was voter fraud. I don't believe there was enough on a large enough scale to overturn the election. I am saying it wouldn't be hard to find it if there was. 

well, there already are techniques for detecting fraud and they are, by and large, working.  there was massive interest in finding fraud on a scale large enough to tip the scales in trump's favor and none were found.  but the auditing techniques you suggest are good ones, all the same.

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5 minutes ago, tspoke said:

People wouldn't have an issue with voter IDs if the government would provide them to the population for FREE and easy. The problem is that isn't the case. So I'm for your first part. There is no issues with computers counting votes as long as there is a paper backup like there is most places now. The last 4 years most states have gone to more paper ballots. In Georgia, in 2016 they had no paper ballots and that is a recipe for disaster(especially when they wipe the machines before they can look at the data in an audit) now they can hand recount(which they did this year). The in person counting here is done in front of many witnesses like in Canada(apparently). Mail in voting leaves a paper trail which makes it extremely hard for fraud from what I understand. The states with all mail in voting don't have many issues that I have seen. So I don't think anyone will disagree with most of your points except for mail in voting because that is what we do here(plus FREE IDs provided to all citizens)

very correct.  Make it easier and free to get an ID, quit +++++ing closing polling stations and drop boxes in minority-majority areas.

 

The fever dreams about mail-in voting fraud are insane...do you know how seriously USPS takes any form of mail? They will nail your dick to the wall if you +++++ with that and they catch you. Doubly so if you're a USPS employee...there was one in NY this year who was skating on his job and hiding mail so he didn't have to deliver it. Turned out that included a couple absentee ballots (literally just single digits).  He's looking at federal prison.

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17 minutes ago, AndroidAggie said:

bill barr already said there's little evidence for widespread voter fraud

https://apnews.com/article/barr-no-widespread-election-fraud-b1f1488796c9a98c4b1a9061a6c7f49d

But, but The Donald says it is not true !

Barr, the DoJ and FBI are covering it up.

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2 minutes ago, AndroidAggie said:

well, there already are techniques for detecting fraud and they are, by and large, working.  there was massive interest in finding fraud on a scale large enough to tip the scales in trump's favor and none were found.  but the auditing techniques you suggest are good ones, all the same.

voter fraud always happens in very small amounts but with the exception of i think two house races this year that are actually going to come down to single digits (one in iowa and one in new york) it almost never matters for federal elections.    They've caught like two people in the entire state of PA so far and both were R's so of course that hasn't meandered into the fever swamps.

 

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43 minutes ago, Bob said:

I was listening to Rush, Mark Steyn was filling in, and a caller from South Africa chimed in and was talking about South African elections. They are issued a government-issued voting ID number with a government-issued photo ID. One MUST have these to vote. One MUST be registered and have an attached address. There are other very, very strict laws in place to ensure a fair election. wide spread mail-in voting is NOT part of their program. Again, this is south africa. The caller couldn't believe what was going on in the USA.

 

Canada counts every damn vote by hand in the presense of many witnesses. +++++ computers. I don't want computers counting votes anymore.

 

Everyone all around the world, except for American Democrats (save your very own Jimmy Carter), recognize that widespread mail-in voting is a recipe for fraud. US elections are a +++++ing joke. Get IDs. Get better laws for witnesses. Get computers out of the equation. Period. Get rid of ballot harvesting.

Computers aren't going away Bob. Ever.

Far to many ballots need counting in Urban districts to do it for every race and proposition on the ballot. My last election in Columbus Ohio, before moving to Utah, was over three pages long.

If you're impatient with getting results before you go to bed on Election night, Just Wait. It will take a week to get results on races that aren't close.

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28 minutes ago, AndroidAggie said:

south africa is sort of the kings of disenfranchisement.  i'd prefer not to take cues from them on how to conduct voting that's equitable and fair.

That's the point! South +++++ing Africa, formerly the kings of disenfranchisement are terrified of mail-in voting, but we've embraced it?

How do stricter voting laws disenfranchise anyone, but illegal immigrants and dead people?

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2 minutes ago, Stealthlobo said:

I don't understand the fear of computers. If we can't trust them in our elections how are we trusting them with our banking? Our investments/retirement? Our international travel documents? Our healthcare records?

Accounts get hacked sometimes with dire consequences. 

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