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BSUTOP25

Genocide in China

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What can we as regular people do? Write our Congressmen/women and tell them we won't support doing business with China? I really don't trust the government to do anything worthwhile on their own.

"BYU is like a 4-year-long church dance with 20,000 chaperones all waiting for you to forget to shave one morning so they can throw you out." -GeoAg

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AP article not behind a pay wall.

https://apnews.com/269b3de1af34e17c1941a514f78d764c

This graph goes until 2018  but shows the 60% drop in birth rates.  Reports that birth rates fell another 24% between 2018 and 2019.  Over one million ethnic minorities in camps.  @bsu_alum9 how is state sanctioned militant force in organized depopulation of an ethnic/religious group not genocide?

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21 minutes ago, Naggsty Butler said:

What can we as regular people do? Write our Congressmen/women and tell them we won't support doing business with China? I really don't trust the government to do anything worthwhile on their own.

That and pressure retailers. There needs to be more grassroots efforts to put pressure on China. Consumers have a lot of power once they have a cause.

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1 hour ago, sean327 said:

Not going to ever happen. There isn’t a single govt in the Muslim world that cares about human rights. They all talk a good game, but when it comes down to it they’d don’t really give a shit.

They seem to care about imperialistic powers punishing muslim groups. Palestine? Iraq? Afghanistan (both us and USSR occupied)? When is the jihad against china gonna happen?

Planning is an exercise of power, and in a modern state much real power is suffused with boredom. The agents of planning are usually boring; the planning process is boring; the implementation of plans is always boring. In a democracy boredom works for bureaucracies and corporations as smell works for skunk. It keeps danger away. Power does not have to be exercised behind the scenes. It can be open. The audience is asleep. The modern world is forged amidst our inattention.

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38 minutes ago, halfmanhalfbronco said:

@bsu_alum9 how is state sanctioned militant force in organized depopulation of an ethnic/religious group not genocide?

The birth rate of Uygurs in Xinjiang from that same Zenz (not exactly unbiased) report that all the articles cite, is still higher than Han in the same province. I’m not saying the concentration camps are ethical or just by any means - I just think these numbers are fudged (percent change vs. actual rates) to make things worse tgan they appear.

It seems like “Hussein has  WMD’s” kind of propaganda to make things worse than they actually are.

What’s America’s minority vs. majority lock-up rates? Why do we have 3x as high an abortion rate among minorities? Extra state funding for abortions in inner cities? I’ve heard that argument from conservatives here before.

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1 hour ago, BSUTOP25 said:

Maybe not attack but sanction the +++++ out of them for this type of shit. 

They should be sanctioned for their duplicitous actions during the COVID pandemic in addition to their ongoing human rights violations.

I think the world will stand up to China some day. It will be WW3.

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20 minutes ago, bsu_alum9 said:

The birth rate of Uygurs in Xinjiang from that same Zenz (not exactly unbiased) report that all the articles cite, is still higher than Han in the same province. I’m not saying the concentration camps are ethical or just by any means - I just think these numbers are fudged (percent change vs. actual rates) to make things worse tgan they appear.

It seems like “Hussein has  WMD’s” kind of propaganda to make things worse than they actually are.

What’s America’s minority vs. majority lock-up rates? Why do we have 3x as high an abortion rate among minorities? Extra state funding for abortions in inner cities? I’ve heard that argument from conservatives here before.

Lots of whataboutism in your post. What China is doing to these people is +++++ing disgusting and the global community needs to make them feel the heat for it. They have been and still currently are forcing an ethic and religious minority to live in goddamn concentration camps and those who don’t comply are eradicated. 

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28 minutes ago, bsu_alum9 said:

The birth rate of Uygurs in Xinjiang from that same Zenz (not exactly unbiased) report that all the articles cite, is still higher than Han in the same province. I’m not saying the concentration camps are ethical or just by any means - I just think these numbers are fudged (percent change vs. actual rates) to make things worse tgan they appear.

It seems like “Hussein has  WMD’s” kind of propaganda to make things worse than they actually are.

What’s America’s minority vs. majority lock-up rates? Why do we have 3x as high an abortion rate among minorities? Extra state funding for abortions in inner cities? I’ve heard that argument from conservatives here before.

Sounds like somebody's company has chinese investors. 

Planning is an exercise of power, and in a modern state much real power is suffused with boredom. The agents of planning are usually boring; the planning process is boring; the implementation of plans is always boring. In a democracy boredom works for bureaucracies and corporations as smell works for skunk. It keeps danger away. Power does not have to be exercised behind the scenes. It can be open. The audience is asleep. The modern world is forged amidst our inattention.

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1 hour ago, smltwnrckr said:

Sounds like somebody's company has chinese investors. 

Nah, I’d just like to see verifiable proof that this is happening rather than trusting the word of one or two anti-communist think-tanks. And trying to not see the world through such a good vs. evil lens.
 

To bring back the whataboutism (and to take bluerules’ side) the US War-on-Terror has killed 750,000 plus. And we are claiming moral superiority over the Chinese in their alleged re-education camps for 1 million due to their own terrorism and radicalism issues.

To be honest though I fear the WW3 option mentioned above because that cure would be worse than the problem now.

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1 minute ago, bsu_alum9 said:

Nah, I’d just like to see verifiable proof that this is happening rather than trusting the word of one or two anti-communist think-tanks. And trying to not see the world through such a good vs. evil lens.
 

To bring back the whataboutism (and to take bluerules’ side) the US War-on-Terror has killed 750,000 plus. And we are claiming moral superiority over the Chinese in their alleged re-education camps for 1 million due to their own terrorism and radicalism issues.

To be honest though I fear the WW3 option mentioned above because that cure would be worse than the problem now.

The truth's been put there for years. I've talked to people who have seen it first hand. Just cuz the Iraq invasion was stupid doesn't mean that the Uighurs aren't being completely oppressed and persecuted by a brutal and soulless totalitarian regime, which us using 'terrorism' as cover. You dont need to be an anti-communist think tank (whatever that is... I hope they all are anti communist) to see that. 

Im someone who agrees that neither a military solution nor total economic  isolation is the answer. But jesus, I'm not gonna apologize for China... especially ad they actively work to stifle dissent on this and other issues in the +++++ing united states.  

I dunno tho... maybe I drank the China hawk kool aid. 

Planning is an exercise of power, and in a modern state much real power is suffused with boredom. The agents of planning are usually boring; the planning process is boring; the implementation of plans is always boring. In a democracy boredom works for bureaucracies and corporations as smell works for skunk. It keeps danger away. Power does not have to be exercised behind the scenes. It can be open. The audience is asleep. The modern world is forged amidst our inattention.

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2 hours ago, soupslam1 said:

Sanctions are like a slap on the wrist, but anyone beating the war drums on China is crazy. I’d hope we learned our lesson in Vietnam and Iraq. And China would be a much tougher military adversary. 

I don’t think the world can continue to sit by and let China do whatever the +++++ they please because we’re afraid of the economic fallout. If there is a unilateral stance by the world’s largest economies, I believe they would course correct. 

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2 hours ago, BSUTOP25 said:

I don’t think the world can continue to sit by and let China do whatever the +++++ they please because we’re afraid of the economic fallout. If there is a unilateral stance by the world’s largest economies, I believe they would course correct. 

Course correct into what? Liberalism? Will they not hide a pandemic that wrecks the world economy by not literally silencing doctors and removing journalists? Will they stop using their economic might to bend the will of multinational groups and American corporations?

We are the two largest economies on earth, us and them. Why would any of the others side with us? 

We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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2 hours ago, thelawlorfaithful said:

Course correct into what? Liberalism? Will they not hide a pandemic that wrecks the world economy by not literally silencing doctors and removing journalists? Will they stop using their economic might to bend the will of multinational groups and American corporations?

We are the two largest economies on earth, us and them. Why would any of the others side with us? 

Haha — yep, course correcting to liberalism. The modern industrialized countries have enough economic power to penalize bad players from doing shit like ethnic cleansing, human rights violations, halfassed biological practice, and aggressive imperialism. Economic sanctions and recognizing Taiwan’s independence would be two warning shots for them to knock their shit off.

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12 hours ago, smltwnrckr said:

Should we attack china? 

I agree that China is a bad actor, and I also think we need to find a way to prevent the chinese govt from influencing the policies within American companies. But neither invasion nor total isolation are reasonable answers.

No. We should only fight defensive wars, with a formal declaration from Congress.

I'm only saying that what's happening to Muslims in China is on the same level as in Bosnia. It's ethnic cleansing.

 

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15 hours ago, BSUTOP25 said:

It’s time we finally be +++++ing honest about China. They’re a bad player on the world stage, an evil totalitarian government.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/whats-happening-in-xinjiang-is-genocide/2020/07/06/cde3f9da-bfaa-11ea-9fdd-b7ac6b051dc8_story.html

Wow, had no idea. 😂😂 Um, I think the only person that doesn’t already know this is Biden. 

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12 hours ago, Jack Bauer said:

They should be sanctioned for their duplicitous actions during the COVID pandemic in addition to their ongoing human rights violations.

I think the world will stand up to China some day. It will be WW3.

It would be WWIII with you in charge.

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14 hours ago, smltwnrckr said:

I agree. Maybe we need a strong and coherent policy from a strong and coherent leader.


LOL! 😂😂😂 You think an American president of your wet dreams could bring everything to a head and get the free world to stand up to China right now? That is mega delusional. As the stupid euro nations usually do (and even we have been doing this under Obama and Bush to some degree) they stick their heads in the sand regarding long term danger and just take the short term benefit because it’s easy. In this case, the short term benefit of low prices on many goods and not wanting to pay the higher cost of manufacturing at home is the cause of the China leverage. Now China has most countries by the balls regarding many essential goods and these nations couldn’t afford to get cut off. We saw this with essentials needed for covid. 

So unless a US President has an immediate solution to the essential goods crisis with China, these countries will continue to kiss China ass and toe their political line. The ONLY way to solve this problem is to slowly chip away at moving essential manufacturing to places like Vietnam, US, etc. Our prez could meet privately with other nations and probably get their support longer term, but we would have to do all the heavy lifting, as usual, with no or very little public ally support from other nations. And so many of you guys here want the US to become a typical euro nation as was Obama’s vision. Scary.

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