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Warbow

Should they rename military bases/installations?

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54 minutes ago, Warbow said:

You live in a sheltered world if you think that now. Knowledge is power, the government has kept this hidden in a dark closet, someone opened the door. The people are now viewing racial issues with their eyes open. This by no means over with. 

Im willing to bet their are monuments of those confederate leaders on those installations somewhere. I wonder what the bio’s of those bases read? Most bases have a historical bio from the start.

Or my some of fellow black Veterans that I converse with have said that they don't really care.  It has been known about for a long time.  It's not really a battle they care to fight about, it's mocked and people move on.  Perhaps you are in some vacuum of PC, but not everyone is looking for every little thing to be upset about.  

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1 hour ago, East Coast Aztec said:

Or my some of fellow black Veterans that I converse with have said that they don't really care.  It has been known about for a long time.  It's not really a battle they care to fight about, it's mocked and people move on.  Perhaps you are in some vacuum of PC, but not everyone is looking for every little thing to be upset about.  

I’m not really upset about it but it is currently an issue that will eventually have to be resolved. Is this going to drag on like the redskins dilemma. 
 

Trump is missing an opportunity to make things right in that regard but he chooses to play his 2016 campaign game. 

Disclaimer: Any views or opinions presented by this poster (Warbow) are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the Univesity of Hawaii or it's loyal fans. All quotes and opinions from Warbow are valid for 30 days following the date of post transmission and are subject to change at any time. All information published herein by Warbow is gathered from his own opinions or sources which are thought to be reliable, but the reader should not assume that the information is official or fact.

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3 minutes ago, Warbow said:

I’m not really upset about it but it is currently an issue that will eventually have to be resolved. Is this going to drag on like the redskins dilemma. 
 

Trump is missing an opportunity to make things right in that regard but he chooses to play his 2016 campaign game. 

Fair enough.  And Trump isn't missing an opportunity, it just isn't the one that you like, it's the one the confederate flag and pearl hugging crew want.

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Trump’s coalition is cracking (Lots of overlap but if there is one section of the Brain that become open for mind change, aka Wokeness; there is possible to sway some undecided and maybe a few solidly decided voters to vote 3rd party):

- military: vulnerable to generals speaking out; Brain now open to hearing criticism like VoteVet; a clear delineation since 2016 with the Kaepernick backlash from the Flag/Military coalition is a more muted and confused electorate.  Simply, in 2020, people are F’ing tired of culture wars.  And within the Flag loving group, this Confederate thing is just confusing shit up.  Hell yeah I’m patriotic to America but you Southern boys are patriots to our enemy (say what).  I admire military folks for their appreciation of history; the folks who are the momentum players who cling to the flag without appreciation for history are getting a history lesson.  Some may see the light.  A debate about the early stages of Facism is a bit over their heads.

- White Evangelicals: new poll among Christians says more think he’s not a Christian; only 25% of general population thinks he’s Christian (his St Joes stunt blew up in a bad way, see also Military); don’t underestimate impact of Romney and Mormons (some on this board can confirm this or deny) on some splintering of the Church bloc (major ramifications in swing state Arizona esp around Gilbert/Chandler/Mesa). 

- undereducated white males: #BunkerBitch is bad for the macho, tough guy Aura; there is a tipping point where even they believe things are getting F’d up; also high unemployment even if it is caused by virus response should get push back.  Watching the world burn is fun for a little while.  There’s limits. Some of these guys voted for Obama then Trump.  They could go Biden or  get less enthused and not show up at the ballots.  

- rural white dwellers: culture wars of “Chicago is burning”; these people are a bed rock and the echo chamber is strong (OAN and Fox); however, I saw a glimmer of hope in Bodega Bay (yes liberal Marin County) last weekend; I was driving through this small town and then I saw a protest ahead and my wife said Ho Shit avoid them, but they were peaceful white people marching for BLM( all of them white, stretching out several blocks, pretty much the entire town).  I thought to myself that we live in a great country. I think there is clear sympathy against uneven law enforcement and police brutality, even in small towns.  Made me proud.  

- older racist-leaning people: I say racist leaning because they grew up when norms were different than today so they may be of good character and I love them, but they are stuck in the past and hard to change, so I love them anyways.  They may be less impacted by the above; fixed income, thinks the stock market is the economy, some macho (so #BunkerBitch might have some erosion and then tying into the Bone Spurs talk goes further down), Church maybe, military maybe but they don’t care about some stupid old fart generals (or maybe they do as they see themselves like the Cialas /Viagra commercials).  What they are afraid of is CoronaVirus.  They will vote by mail as they have done for years.  Very dependable voters; however, early onset dementia means a limited number of times the can vote in the future.  I love them anyways.  If they are in rural areas, their rural hospitals are at risk of being overrun by Corona. 

5 months until Election Day.  Anything can happen.  Be vigilant about election cheating.  Garanz there will be accusations on both sides.

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22 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

1200px-2018-10-31_15_25_21_The_west_side_of_the_Marine_Corps_War_Memorial_in_Arlington_County%2C_Virginia.jpg

Should they tear down all of the Iwo Jima monuments too?

...huh? What does the Iwo Jima memorial have to do with a bunch of traitors who led armies against the United States and killed American soldiers and were slave owners?

"BYU is like a 4-year-long church dance with 20,000 chaperones all waiting for you to forget to shave one morning so they can throw you out." -GeoAg

l.jpg

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21 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

1200px-2018-10-31_15_25_21_The_west_side_of_the_Marine_Corps_War_Memorial_in_Arlington_County%2C_Virginia.jpg

Should they tear down all of the Iwo Jima monuments too?

Can't say there is anything that would be comparable to a statue of American servicemembers raising a flag during a foreign conflict on foreign soil, and secessionists killing Americans on American soil.

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24 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

1200px-2018-10-31_15_25_21_The_west_side_of_the_Marine_Corps_War_Memorial_in_Arlington_County%2C_Virginia.jpg

Should they tear down all of the Iwo Jima monuments too?

Are there statues of Japanese kamikaze pilots in Hawaii? Because that would be the equivalent.

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2 hours ago, Broncomare said:

1200px-2018-10-31_15_25_21_The_west_side_of_the_Marine_Corps_War_Memorial_in_Arlington_County%2C_Virginia.jpg

Should they tear down all of the Iwo Jima monuments too?

Unless it’s a confederate flag they are hoisting, no!

 

Disclaimer: Any views or opinions presented by this poster (Warbow) are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the Univesity of Hawaii or it's loyal fans. All quotes and opinions from Warbow are valid for 30 days following the date of post transmission and are subject to change at any time. All information published herein by Warbow is gathered from his own opinions or sources which are thought to be reliable, but the reader should not assume that the information is official or fact.

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3 hours ago, SalinasSpartan said:

I’ve never understood why our bases aren’t just named after whatever city or area they are in.

There are some places where there are more than 1 base in an area. Honolulu would have about 5 bases named Honolulu.

Disclaimer: Any views or opinions presented by this poster (Warbow) are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the Univesity of Hawaii or it's loyal fans. All quotes and opinions from Warbow are valid for 30 days following the date of post transmission and are subject to change at any time. All information published herein by Warbow is gathered from his own opinions or sources which are thought to be reliable, but the reader should not assume that the information is official or fact.

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16 hours ago, Naggsty Butler said:

...huh? What does the Iwo Jima memorial have to do with a bunch of traitors who led armies against the United States and killed American soldiers and were slave owners?

Might insult Japanese Americans....  

 

 

 

 

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44 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

Might insult Japanese Americans....  

Hasn't been a problem to the English, German, Italian, Djiboutian(sp), Somalian, and Vietnamese Americans.  We don't memorialize Japan by having a Yamamoto statue at Pearl Harbor or on a naval base.  And that would be closer to the symbolism than USMC Memorial.

And, if one were up, would the dialogue change?

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3 hours ago, Broncomare said:

Might insult Japanese Americans....  

Then you aren't familiar with the history of Japanese Americans. They were as patriotic to America as anyone else, even as they were caged up in the internment camps. They sent their sons to fight for the United States. If anything, we should put up memorials honoring the people who were unjustly imprisoned in the camps.

"BYU is like a 4-year-long church dance with 20,000 chaperones all waiting for you to forget to shave one morning so they can throw you out." -GeoAg

l.jpg

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3 hours ago, East Coast Aztec said:

Hasn't been a problem to the English, German, Italian, Djiboutian(sp), Somalian, and Vietnamese Americans.  We don't memorialize Japan by having a Yamamoto statue at Pearl Harbor or on a naval base.  And that would be closer to the symbolism than USMC Memorial.

And, if one were up, would the dialogue change?

I went overboard....  there was some talk running through the Marine community yesterday that antifa or others, were going to deface that statue, like they have some of the other statues (from the Revolutionary war even).  My daughter has been to one of the ceremonies on Iwo Jima and met about 12 of the survivors.  So, this got her really riled up, which in turn, riled me up.  As a pretty female Marine, all of the survivors wanted to talk to her and she got to hear all of their stories and what is was like to fight on that rock and how their best buddy died right over there, etc. As a good Marine, she held it all in until she was alone and then cried, as she was standing on hallowed ground and imaging all of the Marines that gave their life for our Country.  She could see how going up that mountain was pure suicide.  On the day of the ceremony, she was in her dress blues, wearing a skirt, stockings and heals, they were down on the beach and one of the survivors had wandered away a little bit and then fell down.  She ran to him and ended up slipping on that black volcanic gritty beach, and fell herself, tearing her knee up and still got up and beat the men to the survivor.  She had to finish the ceremony with torn stockings, scuffed up heals, a torn skirt and a bandage on her knee. All of the survivors respected the fact that as a woman, she chose to be a Marine knowing how active duty males felt about females in the Marines.  Some of the survivors even overheard the active duty male Marines disparaging her... that she shouldn't be at Iwo Jima because she was a female, even though she was meritoriously chosen by the Master Sergeant.  I understand, those Marines got a real tongue lashing from the survivors that heard it.  After helping the gentleman up (literally picked him up - all 5'6" and 110 lbs of her) that fell down, everyone respected her then and most of the active duty Marines said they would go into battle with her any day.  The General over seeing the ceremony said that to a man, all of the survivors wanted to reup after meeting her and seeing her in action.  After that experience, she is very fierce when it comes to that statue and I'm fierce about her.  

 

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

I went overboard....  there was some talk running through the Marine community yesterday that antifa or others, were going to deface that statue, like they have some of the other statues (from the Revolutionary war even).  My daughter has been to one of the ceremonies on Iwo Jima and met about 12 of the survivors.  So, this got her really riled up, which in turn, riled me up.  As a pretty female Marine, all of the survivors wanted to talk to her and she got to hear all of their stories and what is was like to fight on that rock and how their best buddy died right over there, etc. As a good Marine, she held it all in until she was alone and then cried, as she was standing on hallowed ground and imaging all of the Marines that gave their life for our Country.  She could see how going up that mountain was pure suicide.  On the day of the ceremony, she was in her dress blues, wearing a skirt, stockings and heals, they were down on the beach and one of the survivors had wandered away a little bit and then fell down.  She ran to him and ended up slipping on that black volcanic gritty beach, and fell herself, tearing her knee up and still got up and beat the men to the survivor.  She had to finish the ceremony with torn stockings, scuffed up heals, a torn skirt and a bandage on her knee. All of the survivors respected the fact that as a woman, she chose to be a Marine knowing how active duty males felt about females in the Marines.  Some of the survivors even overheard the active duty male Marines disparaging her... that she shouldn't be at Iwo Jima because she was a female, even though she was meritoriously chosen by the Master Sergeant.  I understand, those Marines got a real tongue lashing from the survivors that heard it.  After helping the gentleman up (literally picked him up - all 5'6" and 110 lbs of her) that fell down, everyone respected her then and most of the active duty Marines said they would go into battle with her any day.  The General over seeing the ceremony said that to a man, all of the survivors wanted to reup after meeting her and seeing her in action.  After that experience, she is very fierce when it comes to that statue and I'm fierce about her.  

Fantastic story.  And we all are proud about that statue, and will be more than livid if people mess with it.  I just don't see the similarity and that was my comment on that.

Fun fact:  I never got the chance to go to Iwo Jima, but Las Pulgas in Camp Pendleton was the site where they practiced the assault up Suribachi, and that was the hills that we went up at least three times a week for my 3 years stationed there.  Can only imagine doing it with a very formidable and entrenched foe like the Japanese waiting for you.

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