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Del Scorcho

Both Gach to USU?

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Guest #1Stunner
2 hours ago, Del Scorcho said:

Utah basketball is dying.  I wish it weren’t true but here we are.  Years ago, I would have defended the criticism of Larry on here, but I no longer have the heart or strength. 

Some of it is simple bad luck. Larry was battling cancer the year after he took Utah to the sweet sixteen.  That zapped the program of recruiting, energy and passion for a period of time.  Recruiting has recovered nicely, but he still has trouble retaining quality players. 

A former basketball donor loved Larry and influenced the AD to sign him to a long-term contract.  That along with having a new AD has prevented the program from making any changes.

The best and worst thing that happened to Utah basketball was Rick Majerus. The ‘best’ reference is a obvious (4 sweet sixteens).  The ‘worst’ is the expectations he gave to a generation of Utah fans.  Utah had a good program pre-Majerus, but Rick took it to a once in a lifetime level. 

It may have to get a lot worse before it regains any life again.

Here is some perspective from a BYU fan (take it for what its worth---not much!)

A head coach is HUGE in college athletics.  You hire the right guy, and he can turn around a program overnight.  BYU has learned that with football.  Kalani is a nice guy, and actually an OK recruiter, but he is disorganized and a terrible schemer.  His Defensive Coordinator friend is bad.   So under his watch, BYU beats teams like USC and Wisconsin, and then loses to teams like UMass and East Carolina.  It's because he is a bad head coach.  Almost a Ron McBride situation at BYU right now.

For basketball, Mark Pope seems like he is a great coach, and is injecting much needed energy into BYU basketball.   We'll see if it lasts.  He has to recruit.

In comparison, Utah has a great head football coach.   And a poor head basketball coach.  Whittingham is great.  When he retires, it will be interesting to see if they can sustain his success.  For basketball, I actually think Larry K is a very good Xs and Os coach, but he just runs the players off the team every year.  He's a jerk.   Utah could change that overnight if they hired the right guy.  Maybe Alex Jensen?   The State of Utah is actually a good basketball State and Marjerus had a lot of success with Utah High School players.

 

Final thought.   The PAC12 is a low energy basketball conference.   Mediocre to dying fan support.   Lest someone accuse me of being biased, BYU has the same problem in the WCC  with the California members.  Poor fan support.   The MWC actually has very good fan support, and will be better once UNLV and UNM improve.  

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Guest #1Stunner

Utah State is another example of how big a head coach is.  

Their basketball program took off once they hired their new coach. 

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18 minutes ago, #1Stunner said:

Here is some perspective from a BYU fan (take it for what its worth---not much!)

A head coach is HUGE in college athletics.  You hire the right guy, and he can turn around a program overnight.  BYU has learned that with football.  Kalani is a nice guy, and actually an OK recruiter, but he is disorganized and a terrible schemer.  His Defensive Coordinator friend is bad.   So under his watch, BYU beats teams like USC and Wisconsin, and then loses to teams like UMass and East Carolina.  It's because he is a bad head coach.  Almost a Ron McBride situation at BYU right now.

For basketball, Mark Pope seems like he is a great coach, and is injecting much needed energy into BYU basketball.   We'll see if it lasts.  He has to recruit.

In comparison, Utah has a great head football coach.   And a poor head basketball coach.  Whittingham is great.  When he retires, it will be interesting to see if they can sustain his success.  For basketball, I actually think Larry K is a very good Xs and Os coach, but he just runs the players off the team every year.  He's a jerk.   Utah could change that overnight if they hired the right guy.  Maybe Alex Jensen?   The State of Utah is actually a good basketball State and Marjerus had a lot of success with Utah High School players.

 

Final thought.   The PAC12 is a low energy basketball conference.   Mediocre to dying fan support.   Lest someone accuse me of being biased, BYU has the same problem in the WCC  with the California members.  Poor fan support.   The MWC actually has very good fan support, and will be better once UNLV and UNM improve.  

I agree.

I'd also argue that an extended period of success raises fans expectations beyond what is reasonable. Utah basketball fans got used to a sweet sixteen run every couple of years under Majerus, but if you look at the history of Utah basketball that far exceeds the norm, on average it made it to the sweet sixteen about once/twice a decade (at about the same rate as Larry has taken them). There is a generation of Utah fans that grew up in the 90's who's expectations are skewed.  I see the exact same thing with UNLV fans with Tark and BYU Football fans with Lavell.   

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This is karma for Utah tampering with and poaching David Collette. You always get paid for what you do, you just don't know when. 

There are only two things I can't stand in this world: people who are intolerant of other people's cultures and the Dutch. 

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On 5/19/2020 at 4:34 PM, BSC said:

I think Pope is a really good coach and recruiter.  USU best be on their toes because ybu  will try to and possibly steal this guy

ZERO chance Mark Pope leaves BYU for Utah State!

Utah is a real possibility though.

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On 5/15/2020 at 6:26 PM, ph90702 said:

Been saying for about a year now that Utah men’s basketball needs a new head coach.

I would make the call to Mark Pope.  They could’ve had him last year.

Utah would have to pay close to $10M if they wanted to buyout Larry's contract at the moment.

The next couple years should be telling. Utah has their highest rated recruiting class coming in this year. Losing Boths experience will hurt, but they have more talented freshman coming in that would likely have been cutting into his minutes. Both has some talent, but has not developed the consistent outside shot he needs to really excel. I wish him luck wherever he goes, but Utah's program will be alright without him.

I'm a desperate man
Send lawyers, guns, and money
The shit has hit the fan

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10 hours ago, ph90702 said:

ZERO chance Mark Pope leaves BYU for Utah State!

Utah is a real possibility though.

He was talking about Both Gach being stolen away to BYU instead of USU.

There are only two things I can't stand in this world: people who are intolerant of other people's cultures and the Dutch. 

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On 6/2/2020 at 8:00 AM, Del Scorcho said:

Gach didn't have USU in his final 5, so it looks like this rumor was shheett

Might be good news. If Gach and his people is really asking to run point he’s going to struggle. His handle is subpar. Should accept himself as a wing

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