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Corona Virus - How bad is it going to be?

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So wait a second? If somebody with no medical training finds Internet doctor who agrees with his point, that trumps all others with no medical training who follow the advice of even more medical experts? These are very strange times.

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5 minutes ago, NVGiant said:

So wait a second? If somebody with no medical training finds Internet doctor who agrees with his point, that trumps all others with no medical training who follow the advice of even more medical experts. These are very strange times.

Have they been testing patients? Quote them as a source and lets examine their information. 

A person who actually takes in the information has a superior opinion to someone who simply looks at credentials and then concludes data is accurate or inaccurate. 

I would take information from people who are doing testing, to those who are not, but simply making projections. 

That is how science is done. The scientific method does not stop at hypothesis.

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34 minutes ago, qwelish said:

Not shocking that this has been floating around for nearly a week, yet no one has managed to post it here. Would anyone like to pit their credentials against these two Doctors? These two Doctors are saying EXACTLY THE SAME THING as me and a few others here, who have been trying to get through to some of you thick skulled know-it-all's with doctorates from MSNBC. 

These are their words. Not mine. Also, notice that they are not wearing masks in a room full of reporters and others. 

- The initial projected numbers we're grossly overstated and inaccurate.  

- The mortality rate for covid-19 is very low, around 0.03%, less lethal than the flu, which is 0.02 to 0.13.... "Millions of cases, small amount of deaths."

- Doctors and their colleagues have been pressured to label non-covid deaths, as coronavirus.

- There's a large populace of untested carriers. Actual infections are a multiple of the reported numbers (extrapolated numbers approx 64 million Americans) due to the contagious nature of the virus, lack of testing and FEAR

- Vaccines that do work, work due to herd immunity. If herd immunity works, then people, especially young and healthy people, need to be exposed to the virus as quickly as possible. That is how the immune system works, duh!

- Quarantines are for the sick, not the mass public of healthy people. And that covid is widespread, similar to the flu, and that is a good thing!

- There is more than a 90% chance of full recovery from covid without visiting a hospital.

 

Their conclusions come from their own research and data collection as well as public numbers. Not just 3rd party information.

They call Fauci "a disconnected academic, who operates from an ivory tower". 

They also repeatedly stated that, "this is microbiology and immunology 101, stuff we've been doing for years" and to "follow the science."

 

 

With all due respect...  I don’t believe the claim that Covid has a lower mortality rate than the flu.  The data doesn’t support that.  The flu infects tens of millions each year to get its mortality numbers (37K deaths on average per year over the last 9 years according to the CDC).  Covid has infected far fewer people and has killed 55K over what amounts to a 6-week period of time with economy-busting sheltering in place.  I’m not buying that narrative at all.

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1 minute ago, NorCalCoug said:

With all due respect...  I don’t believe the claim that Covid has a lower fatality rate than the flu.  The data doesn’t support that.  The flu infects tens of millions each year to get it’s mortality numbers (37K average per year over the last 9 years according to the CDC).  Covid has infected far fewer people and has killed 55K over what amounts to a 6-week period of time with economy-busting sheltering in place.  I’m not buying that narrative at all.

4 million people have been tested in the US alone. Have you concluded that only people who have been tested can be carriers? Extrapolations say that the infection rate is in the 10's of millions.

As far as I can see, your opinions are meaningless if you do not post your data and sources. You are also leaving out obvious extrapolations for the mass of the populace that has not been tested. 

Is that intentional, or do you just not know that's how projections are supposed to work?

These guys are testing patients. Are you? Are you quoting numbers from people who are? These Doctors also quote CDC numbers. Your claims are without proof. That is not scientific.

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Just now, qwelish said:

Also, no one posting to date, has watched these Doctors information, because the video is 50 minutes long, and as I type this it has has only been 40 minutes since the original post.

Dogma.

Just so you know, this video is not new.  I watched it last week.

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I wouldn't quote any one doctor and believe them.  Emergency Medicine too? Maybe an ID specialist or Immunologist to a certain degree. 

ER docs are good at stabilizing patients and getting them to the specialists. They aren't known for vast knowledge in specific areas. And don't get me started on DOs...

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2 minutes ago, qwelish said:

4 million people have been tested in the US alone. Have you concluded that only people who have been tested can be carriers? Extrapolations say that the infection rate is in the 10's of millions.

As far as I can see, your opinions are meaningless if you do not post your data and sources. You are also leaving out obvious extrapolations for the mass of the populace that has not been tested. 

Is that intentional, or do you just not know that's how projections are supposed to work?

These guys are testing patients. Are you? Are you quoting numbers from people who are? These Doctors also quote CDC numbers. Your claims are without proof. That is not scientific.

The numbers I talked about with the flu are from the CDC and can be easily verified.  The # of Covid deaths are also easily confirmed.  

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Just now, BYUcougfan said:

Just so you know, this video is not new.  I watched it last week.

You had not posted til now. Funny this video is not new, but failed to make its way into the discussion in any meaningful way. 

I wonder why....:hmmm:

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Just now, NorCalCoug said:

The numbers I talked about with the flu are from the CDC and can be easily verified.  The # of Covid deaths are also easily confirmed.  

Mortality rates with Covid are probably impossible to state with any certainty.  Flu has been around for a long time and they likely have a handle on estimating cases.  Who knows for Covid?

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1 minute ago, NorCalCoug said:

The numbers I talked about with the flu are from the CDC and can be easily verified.  The # of Covid deaths are also easily confirmed.  

Are they? How did you verify them:? By verify do you mean read on their website? 

NEWSFLASH!!!! That is not a verification.

How have you confirmed those deaths?

NEWSFLASH!!!! Reading it on a website is not a confirmation.

Jesus people...... Are you f'ing serious?

 

These guys have confirmed 5,000 tests. I have not, but they have. They are giving you their own findings from their own tests, but you reject their numbers in favor of CDC numbers that cannot be verified in any meaningful way. 

Dogma!

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5 minutes ago, Stealthlobo said:

I wouldn't quote any one doctor and believe them.  Emergency Medicine too? Maybe an ID specialist or Immunologist to a certain degree. 

ER docs are good at stabilizing patients and getting them to the specialists. They aren't known for vast knowledge in specific areas. And don't get me started on DOs...

So you don't believe TWO Doctors who have conducted over 5,000 tests in their own clinics?

Cool story, bro...

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3 minutes ago, qwelish said:

Are they? How did you verify them:? By verify do you mean read on their website? 

NEWSFLASH!!!! That is not a verification.

How have you confirmed those deaths?

NEWSFLASH!!!! Reading it on a website is not a confirmation.

Jesus people...... Are you f'ing serious?

 

These guys have confirmed 5,000 tests. I have not, but they have. They are giving you their own findings from their own tests, but you reject their numbers in favor of CDC numbers that cannot be verified in any meaningful way. 

Dogma!

Now you’re just being a douche.  The numbers are easily verifiable on the CDC website where I found them.  Go look for yourself.  I don’t care if you believe them or not.  You’ve brought nothing verifiable yourself to the discussion and are just being obtuse and disingenuous at this point.  

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9 minutes ago, BYUcougfan said:

Mortality rates with Covid are probably impossible to state with any certainty.  Flu has been around for a long time and they likely have a handle on estimating cases.  Who knows for Covid?

Do you actually think that flu mortality rates are based on testing 100% of all cases of influenza? Do you know how an extrapolation works? I can't believe what I am reading here. Testing 100% of a cases or of a populace is 100% impossible. Wow!

ex·tra·po·la·tion
/ikˌstrapəˈlāSH(ə)n/
 
noun
 
  1. the action of estimating or concluding something by assuming that existing trends will continue or a current method will remain applicable.
    "sizes were estimated by extrapolation"
    • MATHEMATICS
      the extension of a graph, curve, or range of values by inferring unknown values from trends in the known data.
      "extrapolation of the logarithmic curve yielded an estimate of 66 species"
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4 minutes ago, qwelish said:

So you don't believe TWO Doctors who have conducted over 5,000 tests in their own clinics?

Cool story, bro...

I don't. I believe the Infectious disease specialists I talk to. I believe the clinical data in medical journals. I don't believe two random ER doctors. But obviously, some people (who don't know how to do their own research) do believe them and try to convince others of their ignorant "facts".

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Just now, Stealthlobo said:

I don't. I believe the Infectious disease specialists I talk to. I believe the clinical data in medical journals. I don't believe two random ER doctors. But obviously, some people (who don't know how to do their own research) do believe them and try to convince others of their ignorant "facts".

Post their names, credentials and findings for all to see, please. 

These Doctors have done exactly that.

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9 minutes ago, qwelish said:

You had not posted til now. Funny this video is not new, but failed to make its way into the discussion in any meaningful way. 

I wonder why....:hmmm:

There are lots of doctors weighing in on this.  I live in Utah and I think we should start opening up.

People are talking about the experts and we should listen to them.  However, risk experts will always see risk.  You don't let the credit risk experts at a bank have the final say because you would never loan any money.  You don't let the legal risk experts (lawyers) make the final decision in business or you would never do anything new.  I don't think we can let the health risk experts make our final decisions with this.  They will never see a time when there is no Covid risk.....because this thing is not going away.

I do know that we can't shelter in our homes for months on end.  Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny don't pay the bills in America....commerce does.  When we open up, infections will increase.  Too many people feel the sacrifices they have made should result in the virus going away.  That is not the case and never was going to be the case.

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