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Corona Virus - How bad is it going to be?

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23 hours ago, Bob said:

good blog I saw on Ben Shapiro's twitter

https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/scott-grannis-on-the-shutdown-of-the-us-economy-the-most-expensive-self-inflicted-injury-in-the-history-of-mankind/?preview=true&_thumbnail_id=1008563478

"Earlier this year. headlines were screaming that millions would die and hospitals would be overflowing with desperately ill patients. Early estimates (mid-February) pegged the fatality rate at 2-4% (20 times more lethal than the common flu!). More recently, better-informed analysts, including Dr. Fauci, have estimated the lethality rate to be 0.2%, only double that of the common flu. Several other estimates of lethality can be found here, many of which say it is far lower than most have thought, but do read the entirety of this linked page as it will amaze you. Some speculate that covid-19’s lethality could be much less than the flu, based on the (still unproven) theory that it began to spread rapidly through areas such as the California economy beginning in October of last year, and has thus left millions with protective antibodies. One curious fact about this virus is that the majority of people infected never even realize they have it, while for the unlucky few (mainly the elderly and those already besieged by another grave illness) it is quite deadly. We are now learning that only 0.9% of US deaths from coronavirus correspond to people who were younger than 65 and had no pre-existing conditions!"

"Estimates of what is deceptively called fiscal “stimulus” start at $2 trillion and the final tab could easily reach $4 trillion. The problem with all this, of course, is that it is not stimulus, it’s just an attempt to compensate people who lose their jobs and businesses who were forced to shut down."

Far too many death figures have been released which ignored variables like the yuge percentage of residents of Washington state who died in that nursing home because half a dozen of the staff had the virus and infected the elderly people under their care. Or studies that predicted the US would eventually become Italy although their population has an average age of almost ten years older than the US. It was quite stupid with probably a lot of lazy thrown in and I believe it to have been mainly a result of media outlets wanting to entice viewers or add clicks.

From the get-so it was apparent COVID-19 was going to be a lot worse than the average flu but comparisons to 1918 weren't just ludicrous, they were cruel.

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Boom goes the dynamite.

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California Governor Gavin Newsom announced this afternoon the 6 factors he will use to determine when and how the state will loosen its current protocols.

  • Expanding testing
  • Protecting high risk groups, including seniors, the medically vulnerable and people in facilities like nursing homes
  • Ensuring hospitals have enough beds and supplies to care for patients if a new surge occurs
  • Progress in developing treatments
  • Ability of schools and businesses to support physical distancing
  • Ability to decide when to reinstitute stay-at-home orders if needed

https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article242004001.html

https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article242007496.html

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3 hours ago, NorCalCoug said:

Didn’t double check these #’s but interesting....

80F56D71-9278-49EE-AF6A-43B3437E309A.jpeg

Take Germany out of the equation and the remaining three European countries would look even worse.

Boom goes the dynamite.

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19 minutes ago, FresnoFacts said:

California Governor Gavin Newsom announced this afternoon the 6 factors he will use to determine when and how the state will loosen its current protocols.

  • Expanding testing
  • Protecting high risk groups, including seniors, the medically vulnerable and people in facilities like nursing homes
  • Ensuring hospitals have enough beds and supplies to care for patients if a new surge occurs
  • Progress in developing treatments
  • Ability of schools and businesses to support physical distancing
  • Ability to decide when to reinstitute stay-at-home orders if needed

https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article242004001.html

https://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article242007496.html

In other words wait until a vaccine is developed. 

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23 minutes ago, soupslam1 said:

In other words wait until a vaccine is developed. 

What Newsom said per the Sacramento Bee:

Quote

Newsom said it is critical that the state engage with academic and corporate research partners to produce better therapeutics “which are profoundly important as we bridge ultimately toward herd immunity and a vaccine within, we hope, the next year or so.”

“(Therapeutics) are important, especially in the absence of a vaccine, because they allow people if they do get sick to recover more quickly and also not to end up in our care delivery system and put more pressure on (it),” Angell said.

Angell said the state must continue to build a coalition of public and private partners and to identify potential therapeutics that show promise.

 

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3 hours ago, sactowndog said:

I told you why which you seem to want to ignore.  
 

You and BSU can rant about Chinese people and saving face.  That’s fine.  But regardless, the first and most important priority was getting the DNA sequence.   Without it no tests or vaccines could be developed.   If I’m the WHO, I probably do exactly what they did.   Publicly support China, back channel information to global intelligence agencies and push like hell for the DNA sequence.    

As a military guy, I would expect you to recognize what is the strategic objective, the realities on the ground and the best path to get there.   

Nice ! You moved to the race card with a sly move! We aren’t railing against Chinese people. We are railing against their Communist govt. I never expected you to pull the race card, but then again you’re been excusing the WHO/ China coverup since day one. 

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2 hours ago, sactowndog said:

I told you why which you seem to want to ignore.  
 

You and BSU can rant about Chinese people and saving face.  That’s fine.  But regardless, the first and most important priority was getting the DNA sequence.   Without it no tests or vaccines could be developed.   If I’m the WHO, I probably do exactly what they did.   Publicly support China, back channel information to global intelligence agencies and push like hell for the DNA sequence.    

As a military guy, I would expect you to recognize what is the strategic objective, the realities on the ground and the best path to get there.   

The WHO didn’t back channel intel agencies though. They parroted the Chinese line. I started my military career during the Cold War (1984) I was trained to hate Commies and kill them😀😀

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1 minute ago, sean327 said:

Nice ! You moved to the race card with a sly move! We aren’t railing against Chinese people you phucktard! We are railing against their Communist govt. I never expected you to pull the race card, but then again you’re been excusing the WHO/ China coverup since day one. 

Sorry did not intend to “pull the race card”.  
 

Was referring to BSU’s slight to the cultural aspect of saving face when dealing with Chinese citizens and trying to accomplish a goal.   Cultural differences are a fact of life when dealing with any overseas entity.   I don’t think recognizing those cultural differences as a “race thing”.

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4 minutes ago, sean327 said:

The WHO didn’t back channel intel agencies though. They parroted the Chinese line. I started my military career during the Cold War (1984) I was trained to hate Commies and kill them😀😀

You know this how?   Out Intel agencies had pretty accurate Intel in December.  They got their information somehow.....

yep. I appreciate your service and open mind.  I’m no fan of the government either.  But I started disliking them years ago with the economic games they play. 

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1 minute ago, sactowndog said:

You know this how?   Out Intel agencies had pretty accurate Intel in December.  They got their information somehow.....

Taiwan and South Korea would be my best guess as to where they got the intel. It sure as he’ll wasn’t the WHO.

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6 minutes ago, sean327 said:

Taiwan and South Korea would be my best guess as to where they got the intel. It sure as he’ll wasn’t the WHO.

I’m sure they used multiple sources, none of us know but it was clear our intelligence had a clear picture regardless what the WHO said.   
 

and in military terms the “high ground”, “strategic objective“ had to be getting the DNA sequence.   Days mattered.   If you are running a military op, you would never have the WHO do anything to distract from that objective.  

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2 minutes ago, sactowndog said:

I’m sure they used multiple sources, none of us know but it was clear our intelligence had a clear picture regardless what the WHO said.   
 

and in military terms the “high ground”, “strategic objective“ had to be getting the DNA sequence.   Days mattered.   

You don’t think the Chinese would’ve caved if the WHO had gone public sooner and let the rest of the world apply pressure? I think they would’ve. We will never know though.

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12 minutes ago, sean327 said:

You don’t think the Chinese would’ve caved if the WHO had gone public sooner and let the rest of the world apply pressure? I think they would’ve. We will never know though.

I agree we will never know but I think they would have dug their heels in and taken a week or two longer to get the DNA sequence.   

The CCP is a bit like Trump and compare the results of Cuomo and Newsom in dealing with him.   Cuomo took your approach and Newsom took the WHO’s.   For people who believe they are always right shoving a mirror in front of their face rarely gets immediate results.   We just dig our heels in... 

added the we to preempt BSU’s next comment. Lol

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3 hours ago, NorCalCoug said:

Higher smoking rates and aging population are my best guesses.  We’ll see...

Also, what's the overall density? Just makes sense that it's an important factor.

edit: I looked it up and was surprised how much more land mass, not including water, the US has. I knew it was bigger than those 5 combined but I didn't realize how much bigger.

US: 3,531,925 sq mi. 

F, S, G, I, UK: 781,533 sq mi.

Even if we remove Alaska, 570,641 sq mi, still a huge difference in density.

 

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1 hour ago, sactowndog said:

I agree we will never know but I think they would have dug their heels in and taken a week or two longer to get the DNA sequence.   

The CCP is a bit like Trump and compare the results of Cuomo and Newsom in dealing with him.   Cuomo took your approach and Newsom took the WHO’s.   For people who believe they are always right shoving a mirror in front of their face rarely gets immediate results.   We just dig our heels in... 

added the we to preempt BSU’s next comment. Lol

It wasn’t the WHO that shared the DNA sequence, it was researchers at a university in Shanghai. There is not even a bit of evidence that the WHO being a puppet for the CCP did anything positive for us, and a whole mountain that they actively contributed to a global catastrophe. The lab that released the sequence was closed the next day for “rectification” by the way, so I think we can rule out the WHO having anything to do with the information being passed to researchers. Stop defending this heinous lapdog of an organization.

We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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1 minute ago, thelawlorfaithful said:

It wasn’t the WHO that shared the DNA sequence, it was researchers at a university in Shanghai. There is not even a bit of evidence that the WHO being a puppet for the CCP did anything positive for us, and a whole mountain that they actively contributed to a global catastrophe. The lab that released the sequence was closed the next day for “rectification” by the way, so I think we can rule out the WHO having anything to do with the information being passed to researchers. Stop defending this heinous lapdog of an organization.

So post it and I will be happy to view your mountains of evidence.  The WHO got a first pass test out rather quickly and we choose not to use it.  

Certainly some criticism of the relationship between the WHO President and China is warranted.   But to say the WHO played no role is Trump propaganda.

“U.S. personnel got key early epidemiological data from China only because the WHO brokered access.”

Remember Trump was praising China in February but now he is being blamed he is looking for a scapegoat.   

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/13/who-needs-us-funding-weakening-it-will-undermine-global-response/%3foutputType=amp

Meanwhile, why don’t you go back to arguing why the trade deficit and moving manufacturing to China is no big deal as you were a leading proponent of that position.   The CCP is a problem and you are the leading enabler on this board.   

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9 minutes ago, sactowndog said:

The WHO is pathetic but I put the blame on China. 

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bsu_retro_bsu_logo_helmet.b_1.jpg

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39 minutes ago, sactowndog said:

So post it and I will be happy to view your mountains of evidence.  The WHO got a first pass test out rather quickly and we choose not to use it.  

Certainly some criticism of the relationship between the WHO President and China is warranted.   But to say the WHO played no role is Trump propaganda.

“U.S. personnel got key early epidemiological data from China only because the WHO brokered access.”

Remember Trump was praising China in February but now he is being blamed he is looking for a scapegoat.   

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/13/who-needs-us-funding-weakening-it-will-undermine-global-response/%3foutputType=amp

Meanwhile, why don’t you go back to arguing why the trade deficit and moving manufacturing to China is no big deal as you were a leading proponent of that position.   The CCP is a problem and you are the leading enabler on this board.   

I’ve said I was wrong about our relationship with China since the beginning of this emergency. Not because it wasn’t a good economic situation until it wasn’t, but because you can’t trust an authoritarian police state that lies about everything and uses their economic influence to corrupt global organizations meant to protect the world from exactly what is happening right now. A trade deficit and moving manufacturing elsewhere is still no big deal when the country isn’t a communist paradise, you’re still clueless on the economics. Where I was wrong, and you continue to be a useful idiot, is in defending a tool of a corrupt government that needlessly killed tens of thousands though repression and the use of pliant mouthpieces like the WHO.

Taiwan warned the WHO in December that it suspected human to human transmission of the virus. They ignored them, instead parroting the CCP party line until 3 weeks into January when they both finally admitted what doctors in Wuhan had known for a month. 

We did not choose not to use the WHO test, it was never even offered to us.

GUPTA: Dr. Ryan, a pleasure to speak to you. I'm sure you've been following some of the events here in the United States. At a White House presser earlier this week, President Trump said that the United States was not offered the test for coronavirus. And also said it was, quote, "a bad test." I wonder if you can clarify these points. Did the WHO ever offer a test to the United States?

RYAN: The WHO developed the test mainly to support countries with weaker health systems. The United States is a fabulous scientific system, a wonderful capacity to develop tests, and whilst developing those tests under the leadership of the CDC. So, no, we did not offer the tests to the U.S., which would be standard practice.

We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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