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Tulsa Guy

Big 12 Men's Basketball games on ESPN+

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I think the Tier 3 concept as we understood it is no longer valid, at least for B12.  In the past, Tier 3 consisted of those football and basketball games not picked up by the major broadcast outlets.  This is no longer true as ESPN+ is getting B12 conference mens' basketball games.  For example, Oklahoma State will have 4 of 18 conference basketball games on ESPN+. 

TCU will host Texas and Kansas on ESPN+ and Oklahoma State will host Georgetown on ESPN+.  Those are premier games and not Tier 3 roadkill.

This year, five B12 schools are hosting ESPN+ telecasts, Oklahoma State, Iowa State, Baylor, Kansas, and TCU.  Next year, Texas Tech, Kansas State, and West Virginia will also host ESPN+ telecasts.  Texas U with Longhorn Network and Oklahoma U with Sooner Sports Network will not have home games on ESPN+ but their away games will appear on ESPN+.

OKLAHOMA STATE:  Texas, Kansas State, TCU, Georgetown.

TCU:  Texas, Kansas State.

BAYLOR:  Maryland Eastern Shore, Jackson State, Iowa State, Kansas State, West Virginia.

IOWA STATE:  Oklahoma State, Kansas State, Baylor.

KANSAS:  Fort Hays State, Pittsburgh State, Monmouth, East Tennessee State, Colorado, Milwaukee, Kansas City, West Virginia, TCU.

ESPN+ is a big part of AAC's TV contract and it will be interesting to see how MWC officials deal with ESPN+ in the new MWC being negotiated.  It is obvious ESPN+ is going to be a significant part of each conference's broadcasts.

For Big 12, it will really get interesting in the 2020/2021 cycle and I am guessing there will be a LOT MORE premier football and basketballl games shifted to ESPN+.  The Oklahoma State/Kansas State football game was shifted to ESPN+ this year.  Next year, it would not surprise me if those 8 Big 12 schools have one conference football game on ESPN+ and more men's basketball games per school.

 

 

 

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24 minutes ago, Tulsa Guy said:

I think the Tier 3 concept as we understood it is no longer valid, at least for B12. 

 

 

wrong again.  There's always been conference games not chosen for broadcast.  And basketball is not football.

 

 

And TCU does not transfer to ESPN+ until next year.  The 4 schools contracted to ESPN+ this season are Baylor, OSU, and the Kansas schools.  TCU home games on ESPN+ were approved by FSSW (which is booked the night of the Texas and  Tech games) , which has 8 TCU games in its last year.  And the Kansas/TCU and OSU/TCU games are on ESPN/2, not ESPN+.

 

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.

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48 minutes ago, RSF said:

wrong again.  There's always been conference games not chosen for broadcast.  And basketball is not football.

 

 

And TCU does not transfer to ESPN+ until next year.  The 4 schools contracted to ESPN+ this season are Baylor, OSU, and the Kansas schools.  TCU home games on ESPN+ were approved by FSSW (which is booked the night of the Texas and  Tech games) , which has 8 TCU games in its last year.  And the Kansas/TCU and OSU/TCU games are on ESPN/2, not ESPN+.

 

You are correct on Kansas basketball games which has Colorado, West Virginia, TCU and a bunch of nonconference games on ESPN+.

Not sure I follow your first comment but I quickly checked Oklahoma State football games for 2016, 2017, and 2018 and all football games, home and away, were telecast. 

All Oklahoma State men's basketball games are telecast on linear tv with the exception of those designated for ESPN+.  I just now see that the Texas @OSU men's basketball game has been shifted to ESPN+.

I will make the corrections in my initial post.

 

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https://247sports.com/college/west-virginia/Board/105475/Contents/Third-Tier-TV-Rights-and-Specifically-Boren-on-Oklahomas-71284036/

Comment on OU's third tier deal from 2016.  OU was getting $5-6 million per year and then after all the expenses, the school earns $2 million actually from their third tier rights which puts it on par with the P12N payouts.

If Fox Sports can shift the production costs to a school like Oklahoma, what is stopping ESPN from shifting those costs to the ACC & SEC schools, Fox Sports to the B1G, and P12N to the Pac-12?  I think the P12N absorbs the production costs instead of passing them on to the schools but given Larry Scott's free spending ways, it's possible the P12 presidents decide to change course in this case since video media is becoming more relevant in our lives and hence the need to train those in the production side of things.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Jalapeno said:

https://247sports.com/college/west-virginia/Board/105475/Contents/Third-Tier-TV-Rights-and-Specifically-Boren-on-Oklahomas-71284036/

Comment on OU's third tier deal from 2016.  OU was getting $5-6 million per year and then after all the expenses, the school earns $2 million actually from their third tier rights which puts it on par with the P12N payouts.

If Fox Sports can shift the production costs to a school like Oklahoma, what is stopping ESPN from shifting those costs to the ACC & SEC schools, Fox Sports to the B1G, and P12N to the Pac-12?  I think the P12N absorbs the production costs instead of passing them on to the schools but given Larry Scott's free spending ways, it's possible the P12 presidents decide to change course in this case since video media is becoming more relevant in our lives and hence the need to train those in the production side of things.

 

 

The simple answer is 'it hasnt'.  its not a secret that the ACC schools have and will spend big bucks upgrading in preparation for ACCN.  And P12N may 'absorb' production costs, but that means lesser payouts for the individual schools.  The only real difference is who's balance sheet reflects the costs.

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.

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2 hours ago, RSF said:

The simple answer is 'it hasnt'.  its not a secret that the ACC schools have and will spend big bucks upgrading in preparation for ACCN.  And P12N may 'absorb' production costs, but that means lesser payouts for the individual schools.  The only real difference is who's balance sheet reflects the costs.

Balance sheets don't reflect costs.

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4 minutes ago, Pelado said:

Balance sheets don't reflect costs.

Christ....

 

Income statement, then.  Happy?

In the beginning the Universe was created.
This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.

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3 hours ago, RSF said:

The simple answer is 'it hasnt'.  its not a secret that the ACC schools have and will spend big bucks upgrading in preparation for ACCN.  And P12N may 'absorb' production costs, but that means lesser payouts for the individual schools.  The only real difference is who's balance sheet reflects the costs.

The question is are the P12 schools absorbing the production costs or the P12N itself?  If the P12 schools are not doing, the gap between the P12 and the Big 12 isn't as great as thought.

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39 minutes ago, Jalapeno said:

The question is are the P12 schools absorbing the production costs or the P12N itself?  If the P12 schools are not doing, the gap between the P12 and the Big 12 isn't as great as thought.

The article quoted below indicates that the Pac12 Network had FY2018 revenues of $127 million and expenses of $101 million.  The $26 million surplus was divvied out to each member school as part of the total conference distribution listed below (including a comparison of what the other P5 conference distributed to their members for FY2018):

Quote

 

Meanwhile, the Pac-12 Networks reported $127 million in revenue in FY18, a drop of six percent from the initial projection of $135 million...

The networks generated $101 million in expenses, leaving a surplus of approximately $26 million.

 

Quote

Big Ten: $54 million per school (actual)
SEC: $43.7 million per school (actual)
Big 12: $36.5 million per school (actual; excludes local TV rights)
Pac-12: $31.3 million per school (actual)
ACC: not yet reported

https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/05/20/pac-12-releases-financial-data-full-breakdown-of-larry-scotts-salary-campus-distributions-and-conference-expenses/

I didn't see it in my review of this article, but I've previously seen Wilner report that there were also significant media-rights buybacks from local/regional broadcasters that at least some of the Pac12 schools had to do in order to start the Pac12 Network.  My recollection is that UCLA in particular had to pay quite a bit to buy back their Tier 3 rights.  When factoring in those costs, UCLA might actually still not have earned enough from their annual distributions attributable to the Pac12 Networks (approximately $2.2 million in FY2018 - $26 million / 12 schools) to break even on buying back those rights.

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6 hours ago, Jalapeno said:

https://247sports.com/college/west-virginia/Board/105475/Contents/Third-Tier-TV-Rights-and-Specifically-Boren-on-Oklahomas-71284036/

Comment on OU's third tier deal from 2016.  OU was getting $5-6 million per year and then after all the expenses, the school earns $2 million actually from their third tier rights which puts it on par with the P12N payouts.

If Fox Sports can shift the production costs to a school like Oklahoma, what is stopping ESPN from shifting those costs to the ACC & SEC schools, Fox Sports to the B1G, and P12N to the Pac-12?  I think the P12N absorbs the production costs instead of passing them on to the schools but given Larry Scott's free spending ways, it's possible the P12 presidents decide to change course in this case since video media is becoming more relevant in our lives and hence the need to train those in the production side of things.

 

 

Interesting Link!  Thanks for posting.

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I closely follow the AAC and B12 conferences.

For B12, the question is how much and how fast will conference football and basketball games be shifted to streaming via ESPN3?  It appears to me that this might happen within B12 very rapidly.  The B12 plays home and home men's basketball games against each of its 9 conference brethren for a total of 18 conference games.  Each B12 school thus has 9 home conference games.  So, in its first year, 3 B12 schools have 3 home conference games on ESPN+ or 1/3 of their home conference games.  Add one more game and that percentage almost becomes 50%.

Then, too, fans of each B12 school will have games broadcast on the home field/court of their B12 opponent.  So, add both home ESPN+ games with away ESPN+ games....and it creates a strong incentive to subscribe to ESPN+

It is my guess is ESPN is using B12 like the canary in the mine, testing the waters as to how many fans will sign up for ESPN+?

For AAC and now MWC, there are positives in all this ESPN+ business.  ESPN+ is making more space available on linear TV for the nonP5 schools.  The SEC, B1G, ACC, and PAC networks have also created more space on linear TV for NonP5 schools.  I feel this is the primary reason how the AAC doubled its linear TV telecasts for football and basketball on the various ESPN platforms in its new TV contract.  This will also be true for MWC and will provide the additional positive of MWC schools selecting the starting times for the ESPN+ games. 

ESPN+ coming in for B12 and AAC at this time, I feel translates into a huge positive for MWC TV negotiations.  My guess is that MWC games on ESPN+ will be an extremely strong competitor to PAC network.  Heck!  DirecTV doesn't even carry the PAC network.

It appears to me that streaming via ESPN+ is coming in faster and harder than many of us anticipated. .

Just for fun, I am going to predict that in 2020, the 8 B12 schools will have a minimum of one nonconference home football game and one conference football game on ESPN+.  I predict the 8 B12 schools will have 4 conference home men's basketball games on ESPN+.  Under the recent B12 TV contract just negotiated, ESPN has the right to shift any B12 game to ESPN+.

There was that one very interesting article in the Oklahoma media when Oklahoma State/Kansas State football game was shifted to ESPN+.  ESPN developed ESPN2 but the various cable and satellite tv broadcast outlets were not picking up ESPN2 has much as ESPN had hoped.  So what did ESPN do?  They shifted a bunch of good games from ESPN to ESPN2.  The B12 is providing evidence ESPN is following the same strategy for ESPN+.

I am guessing ESPN will also do the same with AAC, that is, shift many of the better games from the various ESPN platforms to ESPN+.  But we will have to wait for 2020 to see how this shakes out.

 

 

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7 hours ago, Pelado said:

The article quoted below indicates that the Pac12 Network had FY2018 revenues of $127 million and expenses of $101 million.  The $26 million surplus was divvied out to each member school as part of the total conference distribution listed below (including a comparison of what the other P5 conference distributed to their members for FY2018):

https://www.mercurynews.com/2019/05/20/pac-12-releases-financial-data-full-breakdown-of-larry-scotts-salary-campus-distributions-and-conference-expenses/

I didn't see it in my review of this article, but I've previously seen Wilner report that there were also significant media-rights buybacks from local/regional broadcasters that at least some of the Pac12 schools had to do in order to start the Pac12 Network.  My recollection is that UCLA in particular had to pay quite a bit to buy back their Tier 3 rights.  When factoring in those costs, UCLA might actually still not have earned enough from their annual distributions attributable to the Pac12 Networks (approximately $2.2 million in FY2018 - $26 million / 12 schools) to break even on buying back those rights.

I'm guessing the P12N takes care of the production costs not the schools individually.  Could change for 2024-25 with the next media rights deal.

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