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Trump fires John Bolton

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13 minutes ago, pokerider said:

I don't even think most liberals dislike the results of Trumps foreign policies (besides his stance on illegal immigration).  But the way Trump does things seems to set them off more than anything. 
Trump has put the hurt on Iran and Venezuela with sanctions.  N.Korea hasn't gotten anything except some publicity.  Trumps tough stance on China is making a difference.  No doubt tariffs costs consumers and businesses $ but the long term gains are worth some short term pain here.  Trump got Mexico and Canada to bend on the new trade.  Certainly not a perfect deal but an improvement.  Regardless though the liberals hate Trump so much that nothing else seems to matter at all.  

North Korea building more testing arenas, Duterte and Bolsonaro being emboldened, losing access to Chinese markets, pulling out of the TPP so we have less leverage in trying to get fair trade with China and then trying to get fair trade with China, alienating liberal democracies? 

No, I dislike the results of Trump's foreign policies. 

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36 minutes ago, Jackrabbit said:

You need to stop making so much sense...it takes only seconds to post another standard lefty falsehood...and then it takes 15 minutes to correct them.

By then they have moved their bullshit somewhere else....like cockroaches.

Says the guy who always claims we're haters.

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Just now, Jackrabbit said:

Bingo

Jack you just called other people cockroaches. Do you ever think maybe you're the hater?

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Just now, Jackrabbit said:

You said yourself you hate conservatives.  I never said i hate anyone.  Roaches do what roaches do.

@mugtang I thought you banned Bruin 70?

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2 hours ago, Jackrabbit said:

You said yourself you hate conservatives.  I never said i hate anyone.  Roaches do what roaches do.

 

6 minutes ago, Old_SD_Dude said:

Nope. I said I hated Trump.

This begs the question:

Do conservatives consider Trump "conservative"? Why?

 

 

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On 9/10/2019 at 2:00 PM, SleepingGiantFan said:

It's part of Mr. Grumpy's overall plan. As Trump said four years ago, only "I" can save Murica.

Yes. Also, this whole Taliban to camp David thing was a self serving show for the Nobel committee. If anything good comes to America from his "foreign policy" it's just collateral damage en route to that peace prize.

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1 hour ago, toonkee said:

Yes. Also, this whole Taliban to camp David thing was a self serving show for the Nobel committee. If anything good comes to America from his "foreign policy" it's just collateral damage en route to that peace prize.

Hell will freeze before Trump ever gets that prize. It takes international votes and the world loathes him. 

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23 hours ago, pokerider said:

I don't even think most liberals dislike the results of Trumps foreign policies (besides his stance on illegal immigration).  But the way Trump does things seems to set them off more than anything. 
Trump has put the hurt on Iran and Venezuela with sanctions.  N.Korea hasn't gotten anything except some publicity.  Trumps tough stance on China is making a difference.  No doubt tariffs costs consumers and businesses $ but the long term gains are worth some short term pain here.  Trump got Mexico and Canada to bend on the new trade.  Certainly not a perfect deal but an improvement.  Regardless though the liberals hate Trump so much that nothing else seems to matter at all.  

As a liberal (but not a progressive), I'll say this.

The only thing that comes to mind that Trump has done favorably is try to limit immigration to a country which I believe is already overpopulated. As such, I was pleased to see SCOTUS vote 7-2 to uphold the constitutionality of limitation on asylum seekers. That said, however, I firmly believe our country needs to adopt Marshall Plan analogues with strings attached to the money in order to help people in El Salvador, Guatemala and Honduras get out from under the horrific conditions so many of them face. Will Trump try to do anything of the sort? SURE he will. :rotflmfao:

Boom goes the dynamite.

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34 minutes ago, SleepingGiantFan said:

As a liberal (but not a progressive), I'll say this.

The only thing that comes to mind that Trump has done favorably is try to limit immigration to a country which I believe is already overpopulated. As such, I was pleased to see SCOTUS vote 7-2 to uphold the constitutionality of limitation on asylum seekers. That said, however, I firmly believe our country needs to adopt Marshall Plan analogues with strings attached to the money in order to help people in El Salvador, Guatemala and Honduras get out from under the horrific conditions so many of them face. Will Trump try to do anything of the sort? SURE he will. :rotflmfao:

FWIW, the US does not have a dense population by global standards per UN and World Bank stats. We are 177th in density out of 235 countries. We are far more sparsely populated than the countries that are providing the asylum seekers/unauthorized immigrants. Our population density is 35.97 persons per square mile. The comparable numbers are 311.5, 164.1, and 87.1 persons per square mile for El Salvador, Guatemala, and Honduras respectively. Even Mexico, which isn't so relevant now as we are experiencing net outmigration of Mexicans, has a density of 65.63 persons per square mile.

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On 9/11/2019 at 12:59 PM, happycamper said:

North Korea building more testing arenas, Duterte and Bolsonaro being emboldened, losing access to Chinese markets, pulling out of the TPP so we have less leverage in trying to get fair trade with China and then trying to get fair trade with China, alienating liberal democracies? 

No, I dislike the results of Trump's foreign policies. 

Duterte and Bolsonaro being emboldened - somehow that is bad for the US and making things worse?  Yeah you would rather do like Obama and be friends with Cuba and Venezuela huh. 

Losing access to Chinese markets? THE WHOLE FKNG PROBLEM IS WE DON'T HAVE FAIR ACCESS!  

TPP - Bernie was way against this as well.  But Trump's stance is he wants bilateral deals, and does not want the US having to abide by these multilateral deals that make it difficult to manage. 
The USMC deal is a replacement of an existing one.  That one should go thru but who knows.  

This one is the best  "alienating liberal democracies" yeah-  by making them pay the fk up!   If I had someone buying me drinks all the time, I would be upset if they stopped too! 

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On 9/12/2019 at 11:54 AM, Old_SD_Dude said:

FWIW, the US does not have a dense population by global standards per UN and World Bank stats. We are 177th in density out of 235 countries. We are far more sparsely populated than the countries that are providing the asylum seekers/unauthorized immigrants. Our population density is 35.97 persons per square mile. The comparable numbers are 311.5, 164.1, and 87.1 persons per square mile for El Salvador, Guatemala, and Honduras respectively. Even Mexico, which isn't so relevant now as we are experiencing net outmigration of Mexicans, has a density of 65.63 persons per square mile.

The countries you mention are doubly overpopulated and how are the living conditions for the average resident?

Boom goes the dynamite.

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20 hours ago, pokerider said:

Duterte and Bolsonaro being emboldened - somehow that is bad for the US and making things worse?  Yeah you would rather do like Obama and be friends with Cuba and Venezuela huh. 

Yes,  proto fascist leaders are bad. So are communists.  Where was Obama friends with "THE US IS GOING TO INVADE SOON" Maduro? Where do you get that nonsense? For that matter,  how is opening trade with Cuba being friends with Castro? It's the worst thing we could do to long term Castro control of the island.  

20 hours ago, pokerider said:

Losing access to Chinese markets? THE WHOLE FKNG PROBLEM IS WE DON'T HAVE FAIR ACCESS!  

We don't? Huh. Then where was all that soy going? 

20 hours ago, pokerider said:

TPP - Bernie was way against this as well.  But Trump's stance is he wants bilateral deals, and does not want the US having to abide by these multilateral deals that make it difficult to manage. 
The USMC deal is a replacement of an existing one.  That one should go thru but who knows.  

Yes, and Bernie is also am economic idiot.  "Bernie likes it too!" Is not an argument that is going to fly. 

Multilateral deals mean that we're the straw that stirs a global drink.  Bilateral means nearly no leverage.  Think for a second. 

20 hours ago, pokerider said:

This one is the best  "alienating liberal democracies" yeah-  by making them pay the fk up!   If I had someone buying me drinks all the time, I would be upset if they stopped too! 

Pay what up? Do you think that NATO is the Delian League?

Remember that every argument you have with someone on MWCboard is actually the continuation of a different argument they had with someone else also on MWCboard. 

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