My students think Trump is a dictator

[retrofade]

6 hours ago, Nevada Convert said:

FIFY

Trump does need to do better in calling out real hate groups and ideology more often. He could save himself a lot more grief if he did so. 

Yep, the evil news media has the audacity to quote or show Trump's fearmongering as it pertains to ethnic or religious minorities.

[ridgeview2]

8 hours ago, soupslam1 said:

This could all be resolved if our politicians wanted it resolved. As you are aware it’s the legislature that passes the laws we live by, not the executive branch who is responsible for enforcing the laws. It’s the legislature which is failing your students by not reforming the immigration system. I would hope you would point that out to them. It’s like blaming a cop for enforcing the law and giving you a speeding ticket. 

Even with a reformed immigration system, there is still a limit on how many immigrants can be adsorbed by our country. We can’t simply open our borders to everyone that wants to immigrate here. Most countries in the world enforce their borders. 

 

It is a legislative issue, but all they see is Trump's fear mongering on Twitter because they all follow him. Trump is the face of the United States, not Congress. 

[Orange]

44 minutes ago, ridgeview2 said:

It is a legislative issue, but all they see is Trump's fear mongering on Twitter because they all follow him. Trump is the face of the United States, not Congress. 

Not to mention it was Trump's DOJ policy that started the zero-tolerance BS.  It's absolutely unnecessary to be punitive in our immigration enforcement, but that's precisely how Trump is behaving.  That's not the legislature destroying families as a "message", that's Trump.

[Broncomare]

14 hours ago, ridgeview2 said:

I'm not writing this to start a flame war, but to give insight that what the President says does have a ripple effect across our community even if it doesn't necessarily pertain to you or where you live. We started school last week and so far it's been an interesting first few days for me. We did introductions last week with some ice breaker activities of "getting to know you" and getting class schedule conflicts worked out, so today was the first real day of instruction. I work at a medium size high school in a rural town in the central valley teaching 10th grade world history. The school population is 92% Hispanic, 5% Caucasian, 2% African American, 1% Asian/other. The 92% Hispanic population of our students have roughly 60% come from migrant families that work in the fields which is a significant number of our student body. It's safe to say that most of these students either crossed the border when they were infants/toddlers or were born here but their parents came here illegally.

Today I started a lecture about "Absolutism" and the monarchy of King Louis XIV of France. I mentioned that through his consolidation of powers he was able to obtain complete autocratic rule and his only threats were the nobles and bourgeois, but through autocracy it can become a slippery slope into despotism and dictatorships. I then asked the class to name a current dictator and almost unanimously they all said "Trump!". I froze for a second and I asked, "why do you think that? The United States is a constitutional republic, not a monarchy or dictatorship. Trump is not our king, he does not rule by divine right or aristocracy" (although lately it seems you need to be rich in order to become President). A girl finally raised her hand and she said, "he might not be dictator, but he runs the country through fear like a dictator and we are scared of losing our families". I could see all of my students had the same thought in their heads and I felt like I had to calm them down somehow. I told them this is the purpose of our three branches of government, so that Trump or any other President can't consolidate power and rule by themselves. The President is bound to the Constitution whether he likes it or not and that's the beauty of it even though it's not perfect.

Everyone sees immigration as "people need to come in the right way, if not they need to be deported", to be honest that used to be my stance until I got into education and I realized it is not that simple. I look at these kids in my class and it's sad because it's not their fault that they are caught in the middle of all this. The United States is all they know and it's what they call home. I know some of them go to sleep at night wondering if someone is going to knock on their door and take their mom, dad, or somebody else in their family. My biggest fear from all of this is to walk into my classroom one day and see an empty desk or a kid who is distraught knowing his/her family got separated. Quite a few of you guys on here are familiar with me and know I'm not very open about my political stance even though I enjoy talking politics and I intend to keep it that way. I never have and never will tell my students which way I lean politically even if they ask me. I tell them it's my job to give them the materials and resources to research information and form their own opinion. This post is just my thoughts on what I witnessed today and how real this topic is in my community. It sounds cliche coming from teachers, but it's true, these students are my kids and I love all 184 of them even though they make me want to pull my hair out at times.                     

Many kids with family roots very deep in the U.S. lose their families too because their parent(s) made a poor choice and broke the law.  Why do you think there are so many kids in foster care (besides for their own welfare)?  If a single parent chooses to rob a liquor store and kills the store owner, that family is going to be ripped apart when the parent goes to prison. That parent chose to break to the law knowing the consequences.  What about the intercity kids that go to sleep wondering if they or someone they love is going to be killed by a drive by/stray bullet?  Your students' parent(s) chose to break our laws by entering our sovereign country illegally.  If their parents had chosen to enter our country the right way, as your Grandmother did, then they would not have anything to worry about.

I also commend you on not trying to influence your students with your political beliefs.  I don't think any teacher should!  I agree, give them the information, so that they can make their own informed decisions. 

 

[SharkTanked]

13 hours ago, ridgeview2 said:

I'm not writing this to start a flame war, but to give insight that what the President says does have a ripple effect across our community even if it doesn't necessarily pertain to you or where you live. We started school last week and so far it's been an interesting first few days for me. We did introductions last week with some ice breaker activities of "getting to know you" and getting class schedule conflicts worked out, so today was the first real day of instruction. I work at a medium size high school in a rural town in the central valley teaching 10th grade world history. The school population is 92% Hispanic, 5% Caucasian, 2% African American, 1% Asian/other. The 92% Hispanic population of our students have roughly 60% come from migrant families that work in the fields which is a significant number of our student body. It's safe to say that most of these students either crossed the border when they were infants/toddlers or were born here but their parents came here illegally.

Today I started a lecture about "Absolutism" and the monarchy of King Louis XIV of France. I mentioned that through his consolidation of powers he was able to obtain complete autocratic rule and his only threats were the nobles and bourgeois, but through autocracy it can become a slippery slope into despotism and dictatorships. I then asked the class to name a current dictator and almost unanimously they all said "Trump!". I froze for a second and I asked, "why do you think that? The United States is a constitutional republic, not a monarchy or dictatorship. Trump is not our king, he does not rule by divine right or aristocracy" (although lately it seems you need to be rich in order to become President). A girl finally raised her hand and she said, "he might not be dictator, but he runs the country through fear like a dictator and we are scared of losing our families". I could see all of my students had the same thought in their heads and I felt like I had to calm them down somehow. I told them this is the purpose of our three branches of government, so that Trump or any other President can't consolidate power and rule by themselves. The President is bound to the Constitution whether he likes it or not and that's the beauty of it even though it's not perfect.

Everyone sees immigration as "people need to come in the right way, if not they need to be deported", to be honest that used to be my stance until I got into education and I realized it is not that simple. I look at these kids in my class and it's sad because it's not their fault that they are caught in the middle of all this. The United States is all they know and it's what they call home. I know some of them go to sleep at night wondering if someone is going to knock on their door and take their mom, dad, or somebody else in their family. My biggest fear from all of this is to walk into my classroom one day and see an empty desk or a kid who is distraught knowing his/her family got separated. Quite a few of you guys on here are familiar with me and know I'm not very open about my political stance even though I enjoy talking politics and I intend to keep it that way. I never have and never will tell my students which way I lean politically even if they ask me. I tell them it's my job to give them the materials and resources to research information and form their own opinion. This post is just my thoughts on what I witnessed today and how real this topic is in my community. It sounds cliche coming from teachers, but it's true, these students are my kids and I love all 184 of them even though they make me want to pull my hair out at times.                     

The bolded is absolutely key regardless of how you feel about Trump. He may want to be a dictator, but the system will not currently allow it. Which is why it is so important to protect and defend the power of SCOTUS and Congress. Thank you for teaching the next generation the unbiased truth. Only that can help them apply some critical thinking to all of the rhetoric out there. I feel the lack of critical thinking is what is currently plaguing society. People will believe anything that pops up on the twitter feed or that cable news tells them. There is no questioning a bias anymore.

[Orange]

5 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

Many kids with family roots very deep in the U.S. lose their families too because their parent(s) made a poor choice and broke the law.  Why do you think there are so many kids in foster care (besides for their own welfare)?  If a single parent chooses to rob a liquor store and kills the store owner, that family is going to be ripped apart when the parent goes to prison. That parent chose to break to the law knowing the consequences.  What about the intercity kids that go to sleep wondering if they or someone they love is going to be killed by a drive by/stray bullet?  Your students' parent(s) chose to break our laws by entering our sovereign country illegally.  If their parents had chosen to enter our country the right way, as your Mom did, then they would not have anything to worry about.

I also commend you on not trying to influence your students with your political beliefs.  I don't think any teacher should!  I agree, give them the information, so that they can make their own informed decisions. 

 

It takes some SERIOUS obliviousness to your white privilege to equate murder with fleeing violence and poverty in an effort to create a better life for your kids.  Your lack of empathy for other people who are not as lucky as you is ASTOUNDING.

And he said it was his grandmother, not his mom.  Perhaps the issue is you don't read carefully?

[SharkTanked]

3 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

Many kids with family roots very deep in the U.S. lose their families too because their parent(s) made a poor choice and broke the law.  Why do you think there are so many kids in foster care (besides for their own welfare)?  If a single parent chooses to rob a liquor store and kills the store owner, that family is going to be ripped apart when the parent goes to prison. That parent chose to break to the law knowing the consequences.  What about the intercity kids that go to sleep wondering if they or someone they love is going to be killed by a drive by/stray bullet?  Your students' parent(s) chose to break our laws by entering our sovereign country illegally.  If their parents had chosen to enter our country the right way, as your Mom did, then they would not have anything to worry about.

I also commend you on not trying to influence your students with your political beliefs.  I don't think any teacher should!  I agree, give them the information, so that they can make their own informed decisions. 

 

You rightfully point out a system that already seems strained from dealing with kids that are indirectly victims of violent crimes (murder of parent/guardian). Most of the immigration reform is giving an opportunity to rectify a non-violent crime.

It becomes a question of resources in the foster/family services system. It also becomes a question of enough people being willing and able to foster/adopt these children.

[ridgeview2]

1 hour ago, Broncomare said:

Many kids with family roots very deep in the U.S. lose their families too because their parent(s) made a poor choice and broke the law.  Why do you think there are so many kids in foster care (besides for their own welfare)?  If a single parent chooses to rob a liquor store and kills the store owner, that family is going to be ripped apart when the parent goes to prison. That parent chose to break to the law knowing the consequences.  What about the intercity kids that go to sleep wondering if they or someone they love is going to be killed by a drive by/stray bullet?  Your students' parent(s) chose to break our laws by entering our sovereign country illegally.  If their parents had chosen to enter our country the right way, as your Grandmother did, then they would not have anything to worry about.

I also commend you on not trying to influence your students with your political beliefs.  I don't think any teacher should!  I agree, give them the information, so that they can make their own informed decisions. 

 

I can't control what their parents do, but their kids are my responsibility the second they step into my classroom. Teachers wear multiple hats in education. They are teachers, mentors, counselors, and sometimes they have to take up the role as a parent when their own family fails them because a child might not know whose else to turn to. I've worked with intercity kids for 3 years and it was the toughest 3 years of my life. I've taught female students who were homeless and turned to prostitution to make money, boys who were 12 years old and already in gangs as lookouts and messengers. Yes, I agree that their parents put their families in danger to get them here for a better life and broke the law while doing it, but they are here now. I don't see the point in sending them back and wasting resources when we could use those resources to speed up the process for those already in line and move the illegal immigrants that are already here to the back of the line, but at the end of the day they are still in line. There can always be a compromise, but POTUS and Congress think otherwise. 

[Broncomare]

5 minutes ago, ridgeview2 said:

I can't control what their parents do, but their kids are my responsibility the second they step into my classroom. Teachers wear multiple hats in education. They are teachers, mentors, counselors, and sometimes they have to take up the role as a parent when their own family fails them because a child might not know whose else to turn to. I've worked with intercity kids for 3 years and it was the toughest 3 years of my life. I've taught female students who were homeless and turned to prostitution to make money, boys who were 12 years old and already in gangs as lookouts and messengers. Yes, I agree that their parents put their families in danger to get them here for a better life and broke the law while doing it, but they are here now. I don't see the point in sending them back and wasting resources when we could use those resources to speed up the process for those already in line and move the illegal immigrants that are already here to the back of the line, but at the end of the day they are still in line. There can always be a compromise, but POTUS and Congress think otherwise. 

Wow, that would be tough!  I applaud you for being a teacher!!  Not enough credit, time or pay!!!!  I agree with you on the compromise and I can't for the life of me figure out why POTUS and Congress can't work together and it's not just this administration either.  Robbery and murder were not a good example but I know of a single mom who was pulled out of her house in the middle of the night for driving drunk.  Her kids had to spend some time in foster care because there was no other family.  These parents of your students still broke our laws - put them at the end of the line and fine them just like anyone else who breaks the law.  Just like DUI, there needs to be punishment to deter others from doing the crime.  

[Orange]

22 minutes ago, Broncomare said:

Wow, that would be tough!  I applaud you for being a teacher!!  Not enough credit, time or pay!!!!  I agree with you on the compromise and I can't for the life of me figure out why POTUS and Congress can't work together and it's not just this administration either.  Robbery and murder were not a good example but I know of a single mom who was pulled out of her house in the middle of the night for driving drunk.  Her kids had to spend some time in foster care because there was no other family.  These parents of your students still broke our laws - put them at the end of the line and fine them just like anyone else who breaks the law.  Just like DUI, there needs to be punishment to deter others from doing the crime.  

No one's life is put in danger merely because a Mexican family seeks asylum in our country.  Your comparisons are gawdawul, and your theory about deterrents is dead wrong.  It doesn't deter anything.  These people are fleeing gang violence, a narco state that won't crack down, and in some cases, certain death.  They should not be criminally punished for trying to make their family's life better.  Trump is just using immigration to get people like you riled up about brown people, while the rich white guys automate your job away.  And you fall for it. Every time.

[pokerider]

Trump, the Dictator in Chief, decreed all these immigration laws himself and then went about to create ICE and other gov't agencies to specifically go after these people he personally didn't like. 

Its a good thing Obama didn't do any of this huh!  

So talk about Bullshit!  This is how the liberals and media are basically portraying it.  

[Guest #1Stunner]

19 minutes ago, Orange said:

No one's life is put in danger merely because a Mexican family seeks asylum in our country.  Your comparisons are gawdawul, and your theory about deterrents is dead wrong.  It doesn't deter anything.  These people are fleeing gang violence, a narco state that won't crack down, and in some cases, certain death.  They should not be criminally punished for trying to make their family's life better.  Trump is just using immigration to get people like you riled up about brown people, while the rich white guys automate your job away.  And you fall for it. Every time.

a·sy·lum

/əˈsīləm/

the protection granted by a nation to someone who has left their native country as a political refugee.

 

 

Are there that many "political refugees" coming from Mexico?  Seriously, what is the government of Mexico doing to oppress its citizens, that they're "political refugees"?  If Mexico's government is unfairly oppressing it's citizens, then lets put sanctions on Mexico...

And since when is crime a basis for asylum?  That's not even the definition of asylum.

Seems like most of the Latin Americans are not really asylum seekers (a label pushed by Democrats, because it sounds more compelling).  They are mostly just desiring to relocate to US because they are pursuing a higher income / standard of living, and aren't really asylum seekers.  If that's the only qualifier for asylum, let's just open the borders and let everyone in that wants to be here.  

[Guest #1Stunner]

There are lots of countries with corruption and crime....

Let's expand the definition of "asylum" to mean, if you live in a crappy, corrupt country with a lot of crime, then we will let you into the US.   Come on over!

Hell.... I think we could get half of Russia here tomorrow under such a definition.

 

 

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2019/04/04/record-number-of-russians-want-to-emigrate-gallup-a65092

An “unprecedented” 44 percent of young Russians between ages 15 and 29 voiced the desire to leave.

Gallup tracked a direct correlation between changes in Russians’ migratory mood and President Vladimir Putin’s approval ratings, noting that “he may be at least partly to blame” for the latest record.

Russian respondents named Germany or the United States as their most-desired destinations at 15 and 12 percent respectively. Japan, Canada and Spain shared the third spot, with 5 percent of hopeful immigrants each.

[Guest #1Stunner]

More "asylum" seekers who want IN to the United States---they just don't have the benefit of a border they can run across.

Obviously, has nothing to do with race, government oppression.... etc.   Has everything to do with opportunity.  

Let these people in-----they are fleeing a crime filled country!

 

UKRAINE....come on in.  You're next!

https://blogs.elenasmodels.com/en/countries-ukrainians-want-to-immigrate/

The share of Ukrainians who are thinking about immigration is 28%. However, their aspirations will most likely remain unimplemented.

a similar research in 2011 found that 22% of Ukrainians wanted to move to the USA. Germany used to be in the second position with 18%, Canada 15%, Italy 12%.

[thelawlorfaithful]

6 hours ago, retrofade said:

This is why the answer needs to be nothing short of comprehensive immigration reform. I know I mention Beto a lot, but his plan is a pretty damned good one that could probably work.

• Make dreamers citizens
  - They're innocents in all of this and while I guess they "jumped the line" to some, it wasn't their decision to do so, and they're already defacto Americans
• Provide a pathway to citizenship for the parents of the dreamers. 
  - Unlike their children, they had a choice in coming here, so they shouldn't get to jump the line, but there should be a mechanism in place for them.
  - Let them decide on whether they want to stay here permanently or go back to the country that they originally came from.
  - If they choose to leave, don't bar them from re-entry in the future.
• Significantly increase the number of temporary work visas that are issued
  - Allow them to temporarily leave and return during the issued period
  - Streamline re-approval process for the next visa period
• Address the green card backlog 
• Address naturalization backlogs for people who have met all other requirements to be eligible for citizenship and waive citizenship fees for those who are eligible for citizenship
• Invest in Central America to fight the violence and rampant poverty that has led so many residents of the Northern Triangle to flee their countries
• Significantly modernize our border security at ports of entry and elsewhere to fight drug and weapons trafficking
• Deschedule marijuana and allow cultivation and consumption across the nation (not technically immigration related, but certainly border related)
• Modernize our visa tracking system so that the proper authorities are notified when someone breaks our laws by overstaying their visa --- whether it be temporary work, student, or some other status
• Enforce the laws that we have on the books on those who refuse to abide by them moving forward
• Move the immigration court system from the Department of Justice under Article II and make it independent under Article I and drastically increase staffing in the form of family case officers and immigration judges
• Do not decriminalize border crossings. 
  - If we've done our job well to this point, then we need to have enforcement mechanisms to deal with those who continue to ignore and violate our laws. 
• Increase CBP personnel at the border so they can serve in their primary role of stopping drug smuggling and human trafficking.

There are a number of other proposals in there, but I think everyone can get the point. We can work on this issue and do our best to solve it without being cruel. We can protect our borders without building a pointless wall that's destined to be an ecological and humanitarian disaster in the long-term. At the bare minimum, I think those proposals would do a ton to deal with the issue of illegal immigration.

Get off the Beto train. He’s a media creation to try and unseat Ted Cruz that got too big for his britches. There are 200 legislators on the hill that would come up with a similar plan. What we need and do not have is a figure with the political ability and moral clarity to use their power to swing the others on the hill in line. Wish app Robert Kennedy is not it. 

[retrofade]

Just now, thelawlorfaithful said:

Get off the Beto train. He’s a media creation to try and unseat Ted Cruz that got too big for his britches. There are 200 legislators on the hill that would come up with a similar plan. What we need and do not have is a figure with the political ability and moral clarity to use their power to swing the others on the hill in line. Wish app Robert Kennedy is not it. 

I'll support who I feel like supporting. My entire point isn't that this is a marvelous Beto built plan that nobody else could possibly ever come up with.... my point is that it's a framework for something that could work. I also believe that he does have the ability and clarity to swing others in line, he did it on veterans issues during his time in Washington. But I'm not particularly interested in turning this into a Beto debate. 

[halfmanhalfbronco]

Wish app Robert Kennedy, you have to admit Retro, that was pretty funny.

[SleepingGiantFan]

17 hours ago, BSUTOP25 said:

It sucks that we’ve gotten to this point as a society where children have to live in fear of the POTUS. I’m afraid we’ve only experienced the beginning of what is to come. 

I think that depends on whether the reign of Trump is perpetuated for another four years.

1. Those of us who thought esteem of the office and concern about his depiction in the history books would turn the man into a reasonably rational human being now absolutely know that is never going to happen so if he's reelected it's going to be more of the same. Maybe worse because if he's been at all stifled by concern about reelection, that constraint won't exist anymore after November 2020.

2. I continue to be unpleasantly surprised at the opinion of Trump by some folks I respect. For example, we had a softball practice on Saturday and a Jewish guy on my team said that although he thinks Trump is a "buffoon," he plans to vote for him again because Trump has been a big supporter of Israel such as by moving the US embassy to Jerusalem. What I heard from that was essentially that my teammate can't stand the guy but one issue is so important to him that he's willing to put that aside and vote for Trump.

So we could be headed for BOHICA.

[thelawlorfaithful]

12 hours ago, ridgeview2 said:

You're definitely right about people getting screwed over no matter which way you slice it especially those who are already in line doing it the right way. My 93 year old grandmother came here from Mexico on a work Visa in the 1950's and became a U.S. citizen in 1980. She filed her paperwork, paid her fees, took her classes and finally took the pledge. She's been very upset watching people walk across the border and enjoy the fruits without having to deal with the hardships she had to go through which ultimately led her to voting for Trump. Yes, my 93 year old Mexican grandmother voted for Trump.

I think the best thing we can do right now is to reform our immigration policy that would allow people who are already here to get in line without having to go back. It's pointless to waste resources to round everyone up and send them back when another person will just take their place. We need to halt the flow of immigrants into the country before they cross so that we can stabilize and free up our immigration centers. We also need more funding for classes, I wouldn't mind teaching a few citizenship classes at night. It's basically high school government.

This here would be great. You don’t need a teaching degree to teach what it takes to pass the citizenship test. I think a lot of people would be happy to volunteer if it was easy to do.

[Orange]

1 hour ago, pokerider said:

Trump, the Dictator in Chief, decreed all these immigration laws himself and then went about to create ICE and other gov't agencies to specifically go after these people he personally didn't like. 

Its a good thing Obama didn't do any of this huh!  

So talk about Bullshit!  This is how the liberals and media are basically portraying it.  

Obama didn't create ICE, Bush did.  In 2003.  It doesn't have a long and storied tradition, and it's really not a necessary agency.

Trump did, indeed, begin the zero-tolerance policy that has resulted in far more family separations.  That's fact.