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BSUTOP25

A report sure to disappoint all the authoritarian Trump zombies

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8 minutes ago, BSUTOP25 said:

Well, the threat of tariffs wasn't done to increase steel production, was it?  I'm against the tariffs and of course they'll hurt US business.  That was always understood.  

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4 minutes ago, pokebball said:

Well, the threat of tariffs wasn't done to increase steel production, was it?  I'm against the tariffs and of course they'll hurt US business.  That was always understood.  

Wasn’t the approach to put the fear of Donald into China so that they would relent? Therefore helping American manufacturing and production?

Large scale manufacturing and production isn’t going to skyrocket. All these tariffs are going to do is force American consumers to pay more for goods. China is basically telling us to go fuuk ourselves. 

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12 minutes ago, BSUTOP25 said:

Wasn’t the approach to put the fear of Donald into China so that they would relent? Therefore helping American manufacturing and production?

Large scale manufacturing and production isn’t going to skyrocket. All these tariffs are going to do is force American consumers to pay more for goods. China is basically telling us to go fuuk ourselves. 

Yeah, but not immediately.  The strategy was to hurt China.  They're hurting because of them.  It's hard to argue they aren't. 

We're all hurting because of it, in the short term.  I'm doubtful it helps us in the LT but it's too early to conclude that yet.  

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Yes we hurt in a tariff war, however China hurts much more than we do. They have much more to lose than we do. 

You need to realize that China started the trade war 25 years ago, we just refused to fight back until the current administration assumed power. 

Short term we all lose, long term China will buckle, They have to, their economy depends on our consumers. 

China is holding out for one of the regressive's to win and stupidly reverse our policy. If DJT wins reelection China will buckle. They have to.

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41 minutes ago, BSUTOP25 said:

Wasn’t the approach to put the fear of Donald into China so that they would relent? Therefore helping American manufacturing and production?

Large scale manufacturing and production isn’t going to skyrocket. All these tariffs are going to do is force American consumers to pay more for goods. China is basically telling us to go fuuk ourselves. 

China will wait until they see who will win in 2020, the advantage Xi has is he doesn't have to worry about democracy so I imagine he thinks he can hold out a while and see if Biden is elected and the U.S. folds its cards.

I am certainly against tariffs in 99% of situations and they are no doubt hurting us.  I am against Trump's Tariffs on Europe, Mexico and Canada.

 

China though is a different story.  They are cheating on trade in so many ways we need to get them under control now while we can.   From stealing our tech and intellectual property to holding our companies ransom, spying on everything from our businesses, financial systems to stealing military secrets.   China is a problem and we do have the hammer, they need our trade more than we need theirs.  If Xi knew we wouldn't back down he would have already folded.

Xi knows if the economy turns turtle Trump will announce a trade deal with China to win the next election.   Failing that if Trump loses the election the next president will fold like a house of cards.

So i am even against the China tariffs because we as a country are too weak to negotiate this out they way we should.    If Trump wins this though it will be the greatest foreign policy achievement since Nixon divided China from Russia and opened them up to trade.

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27 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

Yes we hurt in a tariff war, however China hurts much more than we do. They have much more to lose than we do. 

You need to realize that China started the trade war 25 years ago, we just refused to fight back until the current administration assumed power. 

Short term we all lose, long term China will buckle, They have to, their economy depends on our consumers. 

China is holding out for one of the regressive's to win and stupidly reverse our policy. If DJT wins reelection China will buckle. They have to.

China isn't ever going to back down from their protectionism... their hybrid economy works in large part due to the fact that a ton of their industries are state backed/owned. 

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29 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

Yes we hurt in a tariff war, however China hurts much more than we do. They have much more to lose than we do. 

You need to realize that China started the trade war 25 years ago, we just refused to fight back until the current administration assumed power. 

Short term we all lose, long term China will buckle, They have to, their economy depends on our consumers. 

China is holding out for one of the regressive's to win and stupidly reverse our policy. If DJT wins reelection China will buckle. They have to.

They won't buckle , nor do they have to.

They are a one party state, the leaders face no consequences.

And the vast majority of the population can easily remember far worse times than an extended trade war with the US will create. Also due to globalization, although the US is easily China's largest market, we aren't their only market. Even if the GOP could remain in power uninterrupted for 20+ years, it wouldn't be enough to "break" the Chinese people. They play the long game.

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3 minutes ago, retrofade said:

China isn't ever going to back down from their protectionism... their hybrid economy works in large part due to the fact that a ton of their industries are state backed/owned. 

China exports much , much more to us than we do to them. Their industries may be reinforced , or outright owned by the state, but they do not have their own internal market to sustain those industries. They HAVE to export. We have been taking it in the shorts for their benefit for way too long. In a trade war for every 1 unit of pain we feel, they feel 5. If DJT wins reelection and doubles down they will buckle, they have no choice. We have a much larger advantage in the long term. 

 

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3 minutes ago, renoskier said:

They won't buckle , nor do they have to.

They are a one party state, the leaders face no consequences.

And the vast majority of the population can easily remember far worse times than an extended trade war with the US will create. Also due to globalization, although the US is easily China's largest market, we aren't their only market. Even if the GOP could remain in power uninterrupted for 20+ years, it wouldn't be enough to "break" the Chinese people. They play the long game.

We may not be the only market, but we are THE market. We have the largest economy in the world, and 70% of that is driven by consumer spending which China is very dependent on. 

Long term we win the trade war, China cannot win it. I we elect one of the regressive Democrats and show we have no fight in us China will win in the short term.  

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I am a proponent of free trade. 

There are only two things I can't stand in this world: people who are intolerant of other people's cultures and the Dutch. 

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43 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

We may not be the only market, but we are THE market. We have the largest economy in the world, and 70% of that is driven by consumer spending which China is very dependent on. 

Long term we win the trade war, China cannot win it. I we elect one of the regressive Democrats and show we have no fight in us China will win in the short term.  

No one "wins" a trade war. It won't happen. China can and will go on for a hundred years if necessary.

You don't seem to have a clue about their culture, so I'll give you a clue, it's very different than ours.

You cannot consider this issue only from an American perspective.

What do you think will happen in China if they never give in?

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20 minutes ago, renoskier said:

No one "wins" a trade war. It won't happen. China can and will go on for a hundred years if necessary.

You don't seem to have a clue about their culture, so I'll give you a clue, it's very different than ours.\

You cannot consider this issue only from an American perspective.

What do you think will happen in China if they never give in?

We won’t be able to buy their cheap Chinese shit anymore? Zion Williamson won’t miss it. 

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37 minutes ago, madmartigan said:

I am a proponent of free trade. 

Good, hopefully the Tariffs can bring China to the bargaining table and they make some concessions and we can get to a free trade relationship. We haven't had free trade with China ever. 

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36 minutes ago, renoskier said:

No one "wins" a trade war. It won't happen. China can and will go on for a hundred years if necessary.

You don't seem to have a clue about their culture, so I'll give you a clue, it's very different than ours.\

You cannot consider this issue only from an American perspective.

What do you think will happen in China if they never give in?

$$ is cross cultural. If they have more $$ at stake than we do they will come to the table. That is if we have the intestinal fortitude to stick with it.  

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39 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

China exports much , much more to us than we do to them. Their industries may be reinforced , or outright owned by the state, but they do not have their own internal market to sustain those industries. They HAVE to export. We have been taking it in the shorts for their benefit for way too long. In a trade war for every 1 unit of pain we feel, they feel 5. If DJT wins reelection and doubles down they will buckle, they have no choice. We have a much larger advantage in the long term. 

 

Our economy and our standard of living is based on exploiting cheaper labor in other countries. China's economy is based on exports but our economy is consumption based. Remember what George Bush told us what to do after 911? For God's sake go shopping. If we stop buying cheap Chinese goods, our stock market will crash. 

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