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soupslam1

Universal Health Care

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Here's a chart from the study the author references to support his assertion that Canada style/socialized medicine is not the way to go. 

 

IMPORTED: www_commonwealthfund_org____media_images_news_2017_mm_table.jpg

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15 minutes ago, toonkee said:

Here's a chart from the study the author references to support his assertion that Canada style/socialized medicine is not the way to go. 

 

IMPORTED: www_commonwealthfund_org____media_images_news_2017_mm_table.jpg

One thing that stands out on the chart is all of those countries have a much smaller population than we do, thus a helluva lot less people to take care of. 

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The United States only problem is knowledge and willingness.  We have the best health care in the world.   The problem is morons in the media have perpetuated the myth that the uninsured can't get care or would go broke if they went for care.  They don't talk about free clinics and health fares.  They don't mention you can't be forced into bankruptcy for a medical bill and can finance your care you needed, just like you financed that car you didn't need.  They don't mention medicaid and other programs for the poor.

So we have so many people that don't ever go to the doctor.  Thus they fail in all those area's listed.   

So I guess according to you and the other emotional thinkers we all have to suffer because people are stupid.

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I really think the Israeli model is something we should seriously consider.  I think it could work here.  

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8 minutes ago, soupslam1 said:

One thing that stands out on the chart is all of those countries have a much smaller population than we do, thus a helluva lot less people to take care of. 

We have a helluva lot bigger economy as well.

Look, man, I don't know what the answer is for the USA, and I'm skittish at Medicare for All, etc., but our current system is really bad at a lot of things. I get it that government can run some screwy operations but I think many of us are so afraid of the "S" word that we can't see past it.  We're idiots if we do not follow the facts and realities of the situation, whatever those may be.  The fact is our current system is ass-backwards and highly inefficient. We need to make it work for everyone and lower costs through not just systematic processes but cultural as well. We need to eat better, get smarter, get more active, get preventative care. Right now we're fat, dumb, lazy and eat garbage and proud of it. It's costing a lot of money to be that way. 

 

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The Medicare option for all is the most asinine option of all.the damn system is going to be broke in less than 5 years, and we want to expand spending in that program?

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6 hours ago, toonkee said:

We have a helluva lot bigger economy as well.

Look, man, I don't know what the answer is for the USA, and I'm skittish at Medicare for All, etc., but our current system is really bad at a lot of things. I get it that government can run some screwy operations but I think many of us are so afraid of the "S" word that we can't see past it.  We're idiots if we do not follow the facts and realities of the situation, whatever those may be.  The fact is our current system is ass-backwards and highly inefficient. We need to make it work for everyone and lower costs through not just systematic processes but cultural as well. We need to eat better, get smarter, get more active, get preventative care. Right now we're fat, dumb, lazy and eat garbage and proud of it. It's costing a lot of money to be that way. 

 

I agree on not be that excited on the Medicare for all idea.  Medicare is a 1960s program that has quite a few structural issues of its own and I think we need to find a bit more innovative idea.

I would propose that we allow employees to opt-out of their employer sponsored healthcare plan and the employer could put the extra money in their pay and on their W2 and the employee could go to the exchange and get at least a bronze policy.  If they end up paying less money they can give themselves a raise and spend that extra money elsewhere.  We should also add a public option to the exchange.

Let people vote with their wallets and give people a choice.  We need to get away from employer based healthcare and tax give aways to that industry if we want prices to go down.  I don't need my employer nor the government to select my health insurance policy when it has minimum coverage benefits.

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Provide a VERY basic catastrophic insurance for all and allow people to supplement that with additional coverages they need or want through the private sector.  I’d be fine with that...

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7 hours ago, mugtang said:

I really think the Israeli model is something we should seriously consider.  I think it could work here.  

I was at a health care conference a few years ago and there was a British-American industry expert who advocated the Israeli system as well. On the surface it seems to provide a good balance of accessibility and choice.

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9 hours ago, mugtang said:

I really think the Israeli model is something we should seriously consider.  I think it could work here.  

 

1 hour ago, BSUTOP25 said:

I was at a health care conference a few years ago and there was a British-American industry expert who advocated the Israeli system as well. On the surface it seems to provide a good balance of accessibility and choice.

What’s a high level overview of the Israeli system?  I’m not familiar with it.

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2 minutes ago, NorCalCoug said:

 

What’s a high level overview of the Israeli system?  I’m not familiar with it.

https://international.commonwealthfund.org/countries/israel/

 

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2 minutes ago, BSUTOP25 said:

I feel like this makes more sense at a state level than a federal level - but then you run in to the Obamacare problem where places like Wyoming aren't big enough to have our own. I feel like using the existing state level exchange infrastructure to create this, along with allowing smaller states to create multi state co-ops, would be more efficient and have better results per dollar than going full blown federal.

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10 hours ago, toonkee said:

Here's a chart from the study the author references to support his assertion that Canada style/socialized medicine is not the way to go. 

 

IMPORTED: www_commonwealthfund_org____media_images_news_2017_mm_table.jpg

Does that normalize by how healthy or unhealthy lifestyle choices are? I mean... we're probably always going to have poorer health care outcomes per capita because of how we designed our cities and towns. 

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1 minute ago, happycamper said:

I feel like this makes more sense at a state level than a federal level - but then you run in to the Obamacare problem where places like Wyoming aren't big enough to have our own. I feel like using the existing state level exchange infrastructure to create this, along with allowing smaller states to create multi state co-ops, would be more efficient and have better results per dollar than going full blown federal.

I agree. 

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4 hours ago, NorCalCoug said:

Provide a VERY basic catastrophic insurance for all and allow people to supplement that with additional coverages they need or want through the private sector.  I’d be fine with that...

The deductibles for the cheaper silver and bronze plans for Obamacare are so high, catastrophic coverage is essentially what you have under those plans. Those plans have little benefit for your average office visit ailments. The poor aren’t much better off even though they are subsidized. They still can’t afford to  pay the deductible  to see a doctor. 

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