Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

sactowndog

Republican Party: hostage taking versus compromise

Recommended Posts

Interesting and insightful article on the Republican Party, its anathema to compromise, and the resulting strategies of Republican politicians to move their agendas forward.  It’s framed in terms of Trump but I think it’s generally true for Republicans in general.   If you believe the premise and the Dems only possible response this could be a long shutdown with the destruction of the government as a result.  

https://www.google.com/amp/nymag.com/intelligencer/amp/2019/01/trump-ransom-shutdown-do-it-again-hostage-negotiation.html

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, TheSanDiegan said:

The lead-in graphic to the article is kind of funny.

23-trump-joker.w700.h467.jpg

Because he's the president America deserves, but not the one it needs right now.

Yeah I thought it was funny but also unfortunate as it distracts from the more important point that the Republican Party has locked itself into hostage taking as the sole means of moving forward their agenda.   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, sactowndog said:

Yeah I thought it was funny but also unfortunate as it distracts from the more important point that the Republican Party has locked itself into hostage taking as the sole means of moving forward their agenda.   

You're right. 

As far as the painted corner is concerned, keep in mind the Dems are completely aware they're dealing with a vacuous egomaniac. Marks my words, there will be a compromise funding solution agreed upon through the backchannel negotiations that are surely ongoing as I type this.

Dems will offer a bill that offers some amount between the $1.6 billion Trump had already asked for (and which the R's had unanimously passed)and the $5.7 billion he's demanding now. The solution will allow for Trump to save face* by claiming ownership of the solution and by preemptively announcing an end to the shutdown once the terms of the funding bill have been agreed upon before it's introduced into either chamber.

*This will allow Trump to at least perceive he has walked away with a 'win,' though IMO the damage is already done. His numbers with Independents are back below 30%, and the Republican party is polling 26 points lower than Dems among Independents as a result of the shutdown

Which brings me to the other side of the equation. The GOP is getting skull f*cked in all this. And they know it. Mitch McTurtle may be digging in his heels, but it will only take a small number of R's in the Senate to get on board with a funding bill that doesn't give President ManBaby his Lego set.

The lynchpin will be immigration reform. Trump won't allow for a permanent pathway to immigration because he's afraid of the fringe mouthpieces who feed his base (e.g., Coulter, Limbaugh, et al). And the Dems, aware they have the upper hand - which will get immensely stronger once they introduce the forthcoming funding bill offering more than they R's had already agreed upon for border security upgrades - will likely push for paths to citizenship for both Dreamers and TPS immigrants.

St-Javelin-Sm.jpgChase.jpg 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

42 minutes ago, TheSanDiegan said:

You're right. 

As far as the painted corner is concerned, keep in mind the Dems are completely aware they're dealing with a vacuous egomaniac. Marks my words, there will be a compromise funding solution agreed upon through the backchannel negotiations that are surely ongoing as I type this.

Dems will offer a bill that offers some amount between the $1.6 billion Trump had already asked for (and which the R's had unanimously passed)and the $5.7 billion he's demanding now. The solution will allow for Trump to save face* by claiming ownership of the solution and by preemptively announcing an end to the shutdown once the terms of the funding bill have been agreed upon before it's introduced into either chamber.

*This will allow Trump to at least perceive he has walked away with a 'win,' though IMO the damage is already done. His numbers with Independents are back below 30%, and the Republican party is polling 26 points lower than Dems among Independents as a result of the shutdown

Which brings me to the other side of the equation. The GOP is getting skull f*cked in all this. And they know it. Mitch McTurtle may be digging in his heels, but it will only take a small number of R's in the Senate to get on board with a funding bill that doesn't give President ManBaby his Lego set.

The lynchpin will be immigration reform. Trump won't allow for a permanent pathway to immigration because he's afraid of the fringe mouthpieces who feed his base (e.g., Coulter, Limbaugh, et al). And the Dems, aware they have the upper hand - which will get immensely stronger once they introduce the forthcoming funding bill offering more than they R's had already agreed upon for border security upgrades - will likely push for paths to citizenship for both Dreamers and TPS immigrants.

Perhaps but a person like Trump who thinks separating children from their parents is appropriate collateral damage is unlikely to concede easily.  So likely Senate Republicans will have to choose to over ride him.   The man is pathological.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Quote

Sen. Cory Gardner (R-Colo.) is expected to break with President Trumpand vote to reopen the government without funding for a border wall.

Gardner’s spokesman said Wednesday that the senator planned to vote for a “clean funding bill … with no border-security funding attached,” according to The Denver Post.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/426720-gop-senator-to-break-with-party-vote-to-reopen-government-without-border-wall

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, retrofade said:

Hey Retro ... Comrade fan loathes The Hill and he doesn't want us to source or reference their uber-right wing capitalist fascist propaganda here. Anyway, Mike Simpson from Idaho is also breaking from the GOP party line:

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article224973125.html 

bsu_retro_bsu_logo_helmet.b_1.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, BSUTOP25 said:

Hey Retro ... Comrade fan loathes The Hill and he doesn't want us to source or reference their uber-right wing capitalist fascist propaganda here. Anyway, Mike Simpson from Idaho is also breaking from the GOP party line:

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article224973125.html 

I'll take that under advisement.  :lol:

It also sounds/looks like Murkowski will break from the GOP on this as well. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, retrofade said:

I'll take that under advisement.  :lol:

It also sounds/looks like Murkowski will break from the GOP on this as well. 

That is interesting.  It will be fascinating to see how many pay for that in the GOP primary and if it reinforces the GOP culture of no compromise.   Certainly Rush, Coulter and Hannity will remind them.   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is BS and you all know it.  The Democrats are the ones here who are refusing to compromise.   
Also, for the Dems to do anything in the Senate, would require 13 Republicans to get on board just to pass any budget bill.  But would require another 7 Republicans or so to do any veto override.  So I doubt Dems are going to get 20 Republican senators to side with them.  ALSO, the House would need over 50 republicans to override a veto.  

So if the Dems do not compromise the gov't will likely stay shutdown for quite awhile.  This IS what Democrats wanted right?  Resist Trump!  
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, pokerider said:

This is BS and you all know it.  The Democrats are the ones here who are refusing to compromise.   
Also, for the Dems to do anything in the Senate, would require 13 Republicans to get on board just to pass any budget bill.  But would require another 7 Republicans or so to do any veto override.  So I doubt Dems are going to get 20 Republican senators to side with them.  ALSO, the House would need over 50 republicans to override a veto.  

So if the Dems do not compromise the gov't will likely stay shutdown for quite awhile.  This IS what Democrats wanted right?  Resist Trump!  
 

Actually, the Democrats did compromise to begin with. A deal was brokered with the $1.3B or whatever border security funding and Trump was onboard with it. Then Coulter, Hannity, and Limbaugh started calling him names, and he changed his mind and demanded $5.7B instead. Remember that the same bill that the House passed this session was also passed by the Senate in the last session of Congress. The House didn't pass in the last session because Trump threw his tantrum and said he wouldn't sign it, so they didn't pass it either. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, TheSanDiegan said:

The lead-in graphic to the article is kind of funny.

23-trump-joker.w700.h467.jpg

Because he's the president America deserves, but not the one it needs right now.

You give him way too much credit.  Definitely the wrong clown.  He's more of this kind -

1657178200_DonaldMcDonald.jpg.17cdaa425555af8ae180f21fec7ed5e1.jpg

51t4uwlffaL._SL160_SS150_.jpg324804241_0b7c67b2af_m.jpg

BCS is to Football what Fox News is to Journalism

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, pokerider said:

This is BS and you all know it.  The Democrats are the ones here who are refusing to compromise.   
Also, for the Dems to do anything in the Senate, would require 13 Republicans to get on board just to pass any budget bill.  But would require another 7 Republicans or so to do any veto override.  So I doubt Dems are going to get 20 Republican senators to side with them.  ALSO, the House would need over 50 republicans to override a veto.  

So if the Dems do not compromise the gov't will likely stay shutdown for quite awhile.  This IS what Democrats wanted right?  Resist Trump!  
 

How about the offer of 5.7 billion for border security but not for a wall. Isn't that a compromise?

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/23/us/politics/government-shutdown-democrats-deal-trump.html

The president’s seeming capitulation came even as House Democratic leaders said they were prepared to give him a substantial sum of money for border security — perhaps even the $5.7 billion he has requested — but not for a wall and not until he agreed to reopen the government. That figure is roughly double what Democrats had previously approved.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, retrofade said:

Actually, the Democrats did compromise to begin with. A deal was brokered with the $1.3B or whatever border security funding and Trump was onboard with it. Then Coulter, Hannity, and Limbaugh started calling him names, and he changed his mind and demanded $5.7B instead. Remember that the same bill that the House passed this session was also passed by the Senate in the last session of Congress. The House didn't pass in the last session because Trump threw his tantrum and said he wouldn't sign it, so they didn't pass it either. 

Actually they didn't.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don’t recall the Democrats compromising much on Obamacare either. The bill was passed without any Republican input or votes and most didn’t even read what was passed. 

As far as giving illegals the vote, I am staunchly against that. I think most Americans are. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, sactowndog said:

Interesting and insightful article on the Republican Party, its anathema to compromise, and the resulting strategies of Republican politicians to move their agendas forward.  It’s framed in terms of Trump but I think it’s generally true for Republicans in general.   If you believe the premise and the Dems only possible response this could be a long shutdown with the destruction of the government as a result.  

https://www.google.com/amp/nymag.com/intelligencer/amp/2019/01/trump-ransom-shutdown-do-it-again-hostage-negotiation.html

LOL. Fine leftist hack article. There’s actually a history of GOP folks agreeing to compromise, then getting fvcked by the Dems  😂😂👍👍

kat.jpg

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, pokerider said:

This is BS and you all know it.  The Democrats are the ones here who are refusing to compromise.   
Also, for the Dems to do anything in the Senate, would require 13 Republicans to get on board just to pass any budget bill.  But would require another 7 Republicans or so to do any veto override.  So I doubt Dems are going to get 20 Republican senators to side with them.  ALSO, the House would need over 50 republicans to override a veto.  

So if the Dems do not compromise the gov't will likely stay shutdown for quite awhile.  This IS what Democrats wanted right?  Resist Trump!  
 

We are compromising about the wall trump told his toothless supporters Mexico was paying for amirite?  Because border security has increased funding proposed bipartisan.  So we are negotiating about his wall.  Let’s at least get that correct.  Good news is every day the government is shut down is 1 less day for trump to do stupid chit.  

Posted Image
Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, soupslam1 said:

I don’t recall the Democrats compromising much on Obamacare either. The bill was passed without any Republican input or votes and most didn’t even read what was passed. 

As far as giving illegals the vote, I am staunchly against that. I think most Americans are. 

Where was the vote on building his Great Wall?  Perhaps once that happens a shutdown on funding it would make more sense.  Increased funding on border security has been proposed without wall funding.  Apples and oranges with ACA.  

Posted Image
Link to comment
Share on other sites

http://time.com/5210780/congress-omnibus-border-security-wall-donald-trump/

As part of a massive omnibus spending package on track to be approved, Congress is expected to approve just shy of $1.6 billion for border security, of which only $38 million can be spent on “border barrier planning and design.”

Link to comment
Share on other sites



  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...