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3 hours ago, qwelish said:

Its a big area of contention among Rebel fans. Some want Menzies to speed up the process with immediate impact transfers, but he seems averse to it.

Whatever he does, he needs to start winning big games next year or he could get canned.

Yes, I think that's true. Like everyone, I have questions about Menzies. But he is definitely taking a long-term approach. Mixing in a few high-impact transfers typically helps them win in the short-term, but instead he seems to have gone all-in with HS kids. Nothing wrong with that, as there is no one way to recruit. It could pay dividends next year, and long-term with a consistent program. As you said though, results have to start coming or UNLV's fanbase will abandon him, as you can already see.

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If the wins come, recruiting won't matter. The crowds showed up for Lon. His only 5* was a major bust. He did land some high 4*'s in Wink and Marshall, but he never recruited at a high level. He just won and that was good enough to bring the crowds.

I've come to the realization that getting over hyped about recruits seems to show that you don't have faith in the coaching staff and are just hoping to out-talent the competition.

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39 minutes ago, SharkTanked said:

I've come to the realization that getting over hyped about recruits seems to show that you don't have faith in the coaching staff and are just hoping to out-talent the competition.

Im sorry, not trying to be a jerk here, but this is a jaded attitude that is a hangover from the Dave Rice tenure. Why cant you be hyped about good recruits and have faith in the coaching staff? Why do they have to be mutually exclusive? Serious questions.

Muss is recruiting 4 and 5 star guys now. The Martin twins were very high 4 star recruits. They were not winning at this level until bringing in those guys. You need good players. 

I dont buy into the narrative that reno fans are trolling here. Dave Rice had ZERO freshman on his first UNLV team. He had a full year to identify and bring in his guys. At BYU, he was already recruiting at least some players that could play at UNLV like Katin Reinhardt. 

Menzies had to spend the entire shortened offseason recruiting players just to have a season his first year. There are still 3 players on the roster from that class, which has greatly impacted recruiting. Rice and Muss did not have those restraints on growing their programs. Lon's first UNLV team had Louis Amundson, Joel Anthony and Romel Beck. and he finished 7-7 for 4th in the MWC with NBA players on his roster. He did not finish above 4th place until his 3rd season. 

Marvin has taken much less talent and coached it to 8-10 last year, the same record as Rice in his last two seasons. If Marvin finishes 5th or above this season that is nothing short of working a minor miracle. 

Hate on that if you want, but that is true and youd be crazy to want to fire him at that point. 

The real question is, what level of conference finish would warrant DRF extending Marvin after this season. If he bombs and finishes below .500, it should not even be considered. If he finishes top 3, she should probably extend his contract so recruiting moving forward is not negatively effected.

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2 minutes ago, qwelish said:

Im sorry, not trying to be a jerk here, but this is a jaded attitude that is a hangover from the Dave Rice tenure. Why cant you be hyped about good recruits and have faith in the coaching staff? Why do they have to be mutually exclusive? Serious questions.

Muss is recruiting 4 and 5 star guys now. The Martin twins were very high 4 star recruits. They were not winning at this level until bringing in those guys. You need good players. 

I dont buy into the narrative that reno fans are trolling here. Dave Rice had ZERO freshman on his first UNLV team. He had a full year to identify and bring in his guys. At BYU, he was already recruiting at least some players that could play at UNLV like Katin Reinhardt. 

Menzies had to spend the entire shortened offseason recruiting players just to have a season his first year. There are still 3 players on the roster from that class, which has greatly impacted recruiting. Rice and Muss did not have those restraints on growing their programs. When Lon's first UNLV team had Louis Amundson, Joel Anthony and Romel Beck. and he finished 7-7 for 4th in the MWC with NBA players on his roster. He did not finish above 4th place until his 3rd season. 

Marvin has taken much less talent and coached it to 8-10 last year, the same record as Rice in his last two seasons. If Marvin finishes 5th or above this season that is nothing short of working a minor miracle. 

Hate on that if you want, but that is true and youd be crazy to want to fire him at that point. 

The real question is, what level of conference finish would warrant DRF extending Marvin after this season. If he bombs and finishes below .500, it should not even be considered. If he finishes top 3, she should probably extend his contract so recruiting moving forward is not negatively effected.

What narrative do you think Nevada fans are trying to spin here?

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58 minutes ago, SharkTanked said:

If the wins come, recruiting won't matter. The crowds showed up for Lon. His only 5* was a major bust. He did land some high 4*'s in Wink and Marshall, but he never recruited at a high level. He just won and that was good enough to bring the crowds.

I've come to the realization that getting over hyped about recruits seems to show that you don't have faith in the coaching staff and are just hoping to out-talent the competition.

When you strip away Kevin Kruger, the results under Lon in terms of recruiting left a lot to be desired. Without his son, I don’t think Lon would have lasted very long. 

After the S16 run, It seemed the program plateaued under Lon, and fans were getting frustrated because it was a 3rd place MWC team. We were 1-5 vs t25 teams and got blown out by Illinois in the final season. Most people didn’t want him back. 

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6 hours ago, qwelish said:

Nope. I have seen Ethan play a handful of times and he is the real deal. Hes also built to last and not soft. Hes a legacy pg and program changing player.

I really dont know what you people are spouting off about.

McCoy came in and was an immediate force in the middle. He led the team in scoring. Mwc freshman of the year, and voted 2nd team all mwc in his first year of d1 ball.

What happened in the draft and after UNLV are completely irrelevant.

Plus, since Menzies ha been here, his 4 star and above recruits have all been immediate impact players. I was not talking about other coaches, other players or other programs. I mentioned Ethan Anderson specifically, and that was all I was talking about. 

You guys are off topic and going off on tangents.

 It was better to have McCoy as a freshman than not at all. Anyone that tries to reason that it wasn't is silly. He still was better than 80% or more of the players in the MW.

Of course he would have been a much greater college player had he stayed a couple more years but that's irrelevant.

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Unless there's something massively weird and destructive that happens this season, I give Marvin next year.  I think we're watching a couple of very impactful players develop in Ntambwe, Mbacke and JTT and I give Marvin the chance to bear the fruits of his labors.  Anderson does look very, very good as well.  He might be that "alpha" guard we desperately need.

Next year, we need to be top 3 in MW, have a good chance to be in the tournament and I'd like to see us borderline ranked.  That will satisfy me keeping MM around a but longer.

 

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9 minutes ago, toonkee said:

Unless there's something massively weird and destructive that happens this season, I give Marvin next year.  I think we're watching a couple of very impactful players develop in Ntambwe, Mbacke and JTT and I give Marvin the chance to bear the fruits of his labors.  Anderson does look very, very good as well.  He might be that "alpha" guard we desperately need.

Next year, we need to be top 3 in MW, have a good chance to be in the tournament and I'd like to see us borderline ranked.  That will satisfy me keeping MM around a but longer.

 

Quite a leap this team has to make from this year to next. 

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1 hour ago, qwelish said:

Im sorry, not trying to be a jerk here, but this is a jaded attitude that is a hangover from the Dave Rice tenure. Why cant you be hyped about good recruits and have faith in the coaching staff? Why do they have to be mutually exclusive? Serious questions.

Muss is recruiting 4 and 5 star guys now. The Martin twins were very high 4 star recruits. They were not winning at this level until bringing in those guys. You need good players. 

I dont buy into the narrative that reno fans are trolling here. Dave Rice had ZERO freshman on his first UNLV team. He had a full year to identify and bring in his guys. At BYU, he was already recruiting at least some players that could play at UNLV like Katin Reinhardt. 

Menzies had to spend the entire shortened offseason recruiting players just to have a season his first year. There are still 3 players on the roster from that class, which has greatly impacted recruiting. Rice and Muss did not have those restraints on growing their programs. Lon's first UNLV team had Louis Amundson, Joel Anthony and Romel Beck. and he finished 7-7 for 4th in the MWC with NBA players on his roster. He did not finish above 4th place until his 3rd season. 

Marvin has taken much less talent and coached it to 8-10 last year, the same record as Rice in his last two seasons. If Marvin finishes 5th or above this season that is nothing short of working a minor miracle. 

Hate on that if you want, but that is true and youd be crazy to want to fire him at that point. 

The real question is, what level of conference finish would warrant DRF extending Marvin after this season. If he bombs and finishes below .500, it should not even be considered. If he finishes top 3, she should probably extend his contract so recruiting moving forward is not negatively effected.

Certainly you can have both. I just don't think we have had but three competent head coaches in our program's history (Tark, Spoon and Lon). And quite frankly, I don't see a need to get spun up about recruits when we don't seem to have a staff to take advantage of them. I would love for Menzies to prove me wrong. I don't consider a hangover from the Rice era, I consider an honest assessment of Menzies' coaching acumen. That said, I still don't want to see him fired even if I don't think he is capable. He needs one more year after this season to be proven he was given a fair chance.

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39 minutes ago, Rosegreen said:

When you strip away Kevin Kruger, the results under Lon in terms of recruiting left a lot to be desired. Without his son, I don’t think Lon would have lasted very long. 

After the S16 run, It seemed the program plateaued under Lon, and fans were getting frustrated because it was a 3rd place MWC team. We were 1-5 vs t25 teams and got blown out by Illinois in the final season. Most people didn’t want him back. 

Most people are idiots. Look at how we've done since he left. Plus he never had the finished Mendenhall center to recruit to.

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2 minutes ago, SharkTanked said:

Certainly you can have both. I just don't think we have had but three competent head coaches in our program's history (Tark, Spoon and Lon). And quite frankly, I don't see a need to get spun up about recruits when we don't seem to have a staff to take advantage of them. I would love for Menzies to prove me wrong. I don't consider a hangover from the Rice era, I consider an honest assessment of Menzies' coaching acumen. That said, I still don't want to see him fired even if I don't think he is capable. He needs one more year after this season to be proven he was given a fair chance.

Who the hell cares about being fair?

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1 minute ago, SharkTanked said:

Most people are idiots. Look at how we've done since he left. Plus he never had the finished Mendenhall center to recruit to.

Look at how he left the program as the walkin rebels. 

He never really recruited AAU or went after top recruits and it wasn’t because there wasn’t a Mendenhall Center. His philosophy on recruiting at unlv wasn’t ever going to be dependent on facilities. 

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Lon was instrumental in getting the Mendenhall Center built so that must have been part of his plan to move the program forward. Recruiting without capable coaching, basically the Rice years is a proven failure. Coaching without quality recruiting, the Kruger years has serious limitations as well. Somewhere in there is a formula for success but mediocre recruiting and coaching will only breed mediocrity.  The one thing for certain even after all of these years is that UNLV is still attractive in the recruiting arenas but it is still all smoke and mirrors without actually getting results when the season is comes to an end. Marv has every tool he needs to recruit at whatever level he decides. I am personally happier to see solid 4 year guys as opposed to the one and done scenario. He has been and will be given a fair shot at earning a new contract as I can see him finishing out his current contract. Results still do matter and the clock is ticking.

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6 minutes ago, Rosegreen said:

Who the hell cares about being fair?

An AD who is concerned about attracting quality candidates.

1 minute ago, Rosegreen said:

Look at how he left the program as the walkin rebels. 

He never really recruited AAU or went after top recruits and it wasn’t because there wasn’t a Mendenhall Center. His philosophy on recruiting at unlv wasn’t ever going to be dependent on facilities. 

Yet he was the one who insisted on and actually got the Mendenhall built.

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53 minutes ago, Rosegreen said:

Early in this thread we got folks saying things like “24-25 wins this season”, “NIT berth”, “top 5 MWC team” etc. 

now it’s :

 

tenor.gif

I still think this is a top 5 mwc team. Its just where the program is. Thats the same as the beginning of the season. Not lowered at all. We all knew this team was young and the pg was a mediocre player from Akron.

I also said before the season started that if Clyburn ends up being a leading scorer, its going to be a long year. He is the leading scorer. ugh

"Im not surprised, bishes" - Nick Diaz

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1 hour ago, toonkee said:

 It was better to have McCoy as a freshman than not at all. Anyone that tries to reason that it wasn't is silly. He still was better than 80% or more of the players in the MW.

Of course he would have been a much greater college player had he stayed a couple more years but that's irrelevant.

My sentiments exactly. 

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