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Nevada Convert

“Country Headed in Right Direction” Poll Reaches 12 Year High, Better Than Obama

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19 hours ago, soupslam1 said:

Obama was anti business. Remember his discussion with Joe the plumber. That and excessive regulation, excessive taxes. Obamacare, etc. slowed growth under Obama. Obamas policies and Hillary Clinton paying little attention to the plight of the average American worker (the deplorables)  resulted in Trumps election. When Trump was elected optimism for the economy grew significantly. 

If Trump wasn’t so arrogant and a jerk, the Democrats would have no hope in 2018 or 2020. 

I totally agree. If he kept the good part of his personality the same but avoided really dumb mistakes, carried himself very confident but not arrogantly and listenned to his advisers....he would be unstoppable. You wouldn’t even have Never Trumpers and would have the full support from most GOP.

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6 minutes ago, jackmormon said:

Gallup tracking poll

DgjhlQWVQAMEzjI.jpg:large

This would serve to confirm my assertion that Trump did the family separation drama to achieve other goals, because no one sane likes the idea of detaining children, but most support enforcing the border laws.

 

BTW, "Kids in Cages" was, as we all know, an Obama creation, as the detention facilities were set up on his watch.

 

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1 minute ago, Thomas said:

This would serve to confirm my assertion that Trump did the family separation drama to achieve other goals, because no one sane likes the idea of detaining children, but most support enforcing the border laws.

 

BTW, "Kids in Cages" was, as we all know, an Obama creation, as the detention facilities were set up on his watch.

 

Perpetuating the myth that it was Obama who took kids away from their parents...

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3 minutes ago, jackmormon said:

Perpetuating the myth that it was Obama who took kids away from their parents...

Because we all know the zero tolerance policy was actually Obama's idea.  Of course at the same time, he is blamed for catch and release.  So whether we separate kids from the parents or release them to come back for a court appearance, the far right has the same answer.  Blame Obama.

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3 minutes ago, jackmormon said:

Perpetuating the myth that it was Obama who took kids away from their parents...

Yes, Obama DID. He just didn't have a stated policy to do it; he did it for periods of time, as a 'deterrent', just as Trump was using it.

https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/white-house/article213525764.html

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The American government put kids in cages long before Obama. Trump and supporters are just making it OK to be proud of it. #MAGA

Planning is an exercise of power, and in a modern state much real power is suffused with boredom. The agents of planning are usually boring; the planning process is boring; the implementation of plans is always boring. In a democracy boredom works for bureaucracies and corporations as smell works for skunk. It keeps danger away. Power does not have to be exercised behind the scenes. It can be open. The audience is asleep. The modern world is forged amidst our inattention.

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3 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Yes, Obama DID. He just didn't have a stated policy to do it; he did it for periods of time, as a 'deterrent', just as Trump was using it.

https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/white-house/article213525764.html

So the zero tolerance policy has nothing to do with the current situation?  Well, that makes sense.  I've been too hard on Trump it appears.  I thought there was this whole catch and release that infuriated the right.  I recall hearing that on the news networks once or twice or a thousand times.

Of course Trump also said Obama was soft on illegal immigration and had no plan.  So one of you is not being honest.  

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12 minutes ago, alum93 said:

So the zero tolerance policy has nothing to do with the current situation?  Well, that makes sense.  I've been too hard on Trump it appears.  I thought there was this whole catch and release that infuriated the right.  I recall hearing that on the news networks once or twice or a thousand times.

Of course Trump also said Obama was soft on illegal immigration and had no plan.  So one of you is not being honest.  

Read my post again, then read yours. I never said anything about the 'current situation'.

 

You're having a dialogue with an unknown third-party who isn't really there.

 

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5 minutes ago, Thomas said:

Read my post again, then read yours. I never said anything about the 'current situation'.

 

You're having a dialogue with an unknown third-party who isn't really there.

 

I just like the comment well Obama did it.  First, even if true, that doesn't make what Trump did right.  Second, more importantly, we know exactly what caused this issue with the separation.  Trump and Session announced a zero tolerance policy, but the government was completely unprepared to handle it.  So they started separating kids from parents because no one could be trusted to appear for a court date obviously (the actual rate was 75% showed up for court dates per government records).  The evil media had the audacity to film tiny kids crying, to publish stories that parents had no clue if they would see their kids again, much less no where they were.  Audio and visual evidence of families torn apart evidently forced an outcry.  You know it's bad for the right when Evangelical leaders who will turn a blind eye to pretty much any offense are willing to speak out on record.  But hey, let's take the easy way out and bring up Obama again.  You guys all know Obama did it too right?  Am i right?  There, now you can feel better.

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2 minutes ago, alum93 said:

I just like the comment well Obama did it.  First, even if true, that doesn't make what Trump did right.  Second, more importantly, we know exactly what caused this issue with the separation.  Trump and Session announced a zero tolerance policy, but the government was completely unprepared to handle it.  So they started separating kids from parents because no one could be trusted to appear for a court date obviously (the actual rate was 75% showed up for court dates per government records).  The evil media had the audacity to film tiny kids crying, to publish stories that parents had no clue if they would see their kids again, much less no where they were.  Audio and visual evidence of families torn apart evidently forced an outcry.  You know it's bad for the right when Evangelical leaders who will turn a blind eye to pretty much any offense are willing to speak out on record.  But hey, let's take the easy way out and bring up Obama again.  You guys all know Obama did it too right?  Am i right?  There, now you can feel better.

If only, our "Paragon of Virtue" media hadn't suppressed these border stories for 8 years...

I don't blame that on Obama; I blame it on them.

 

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16 minutes ago, Thomas said:

If only, our "Paragon of Virtue" media hadn't suppressed these border stories for 8 years...

I don't blame that on Obama; I blame it on them.

 

Because the policies are so similar right?  Obama was accused of catch and release and an open border, but he was really zero tolerance before Sessions and Trump even knew it.  Dang media.  

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1 hour ago, alum93 said:

I just like the comment well Obama did it.  First, even if true, that doesn't make what Trump did right.  Second, more importantly, we know exactly what caused this issue with the separation.  Trump and Session announced a zero tolerance policy, but the government was completely unprepared to handle it.  So they started separating kids from parents because no one could be trusted to appear for a court date obviously (the actual rate was 75% showed up for court dates per government records).  The evil media had the audacity to film tiny kids crying, to publish stories that parents had no clue if they would see their kids again, much less no where they were.  Audio and visual evidence of families torn apart evidently forced an outcry.  You know it's bad for the right when Evangelical leaders who will turn a blind eye to pretty much any offense are willing to speak out on record.  But hey, let's take the easy way out and bring up Obama again.  You guys all know Obama did it too right?  Am i right?  There, now you can feel better.

https://www.justice.gov/eoir/page/file/fysb16/download page 51

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We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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11 minutes ago, thelawlorfaithful said:

I was actually quoting a Republican from one of national news shows who said even if only 25% didn't show up, that rate was still too high.  Then they argued that if ankle bracelets were used at a fraction of the cost, they could go from 75% to 99% showing up.

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1 hour ago, Thomas said:

Yes, Obama DID. He just didn't have a stated policy to do it; he did it for periods of time, as a 'deterrent', just as Trump was using it.

https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/white-house/article213525764.html

No. There were a few instances where children were removed from someone who they suspected were NOT the parent. Or where fathers were fought commiting serious charges like drug smuggling with a daughter in tow where it wasn’t practical to keep a girl in an adult male penal facility. And detention facilities for unaccompanied minors. They were not talking toddlers away from parents!

From you link...

Most fathers and children were released together, often times with an ankle bracelet. Fresco said there were cases where the administration held fathers who were carrying drugs or caught with other contraband who had to be separated from their children.

“ICE could not devise a safe way where men and children could be in detention together in one facility,” Fresco said. “It was deemed too much of a security risk.”

And...

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/was-law-separate-families-passed-1997/

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1 hour ago, alum93 said:

I was actually quoting a Republican from one of national news shows who said even if only 25% didn't show up, that rate was still too high.  Then they argued that if ankle bracelets were used at a fraction of the cost, they could go from 75% to 99% showing up.

Gotcha. I’m sure there would be some positive effect, but I’m skeptical it would be that large.

We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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1 hour ago, thelawlorfaithful said:

Gotcha. I’m sure there would be some positive effect, but I’m skeptical it would be that large.

For what it's worth, I heard on NPR that persons coming across with children are far and away the most likely to show up.

Thay Haif Said: Quhat Say Thay? Lat Thame Say

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On 6/22/2018 at 6:41 PM, Nevada Convert said:

I totally agree. If he kept the good part of his personality the same but avoided really dumb mistakes, carried himself very confident but not arrogantly and listenned to his advisers....he would be unstoppable. You wouldn’t even have Never Trumpers and would have the full support from most GOP.

True.

But creating cognitive dissonance and keeping everyone off-balance is his style, even with the GOP.

I can't see that changing.

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1 hour ago, Old_SD_Dude said:

For what it's worth, I heard on NPR that persons coming across with children are far and away the most likely to show up.

I can easily see that. I don’t know what judge’s are looking for to grant asylum, but it’s got to be easier making that case when you have kids.

We’re all sitting in the dugout. Thinking we should pitch. How you gonna throw a shutout when all you do is bitch.

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55 minutes ago, Thomas said:

True.

But creating cognitive dissonance and keeping everyone off-balance is his style, even with the GOP.

I can't see that changing.

It’s a tool to keep the short attention span media chasing crisises. When the media is focusing too much for comfort on a story. Do something outrageous to change the subject. Keep people on tilt to the point they don’t know which way is up.

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