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jackmormon

How Harley Davidson's is using it's tax cuts

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A $700,000,000 stock buyback. Close a plant in Kansas City with 800 workers. and replace it with a new plant in Phuket Thailand.

In September 2017, House Speaker Paul Ryan traveled to a Harley-Davidson plant in Menomonee Falls, Wisconsin, to tout the Republican tax bill, which President Trump would sign later that year. “Tax reform can put American manufacturers and American companies like Harley-Davidson on a much better footing to compete in the global economy and keep jobs here in America,” Ryan told workers and company leaders.

http://thehill.com/homenews/news/387120-harley-davidson-to-open-plant-in-thailand-after-closing-one-in-kansas-city

PS: Any time you get a chance to use Phuket in a sentence, you should. :D

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Stock buy backs are not the terrible thing that many people think they are. They are actually very good for the economy. It is essentially giving a non cash dividend to shareholders and their wealth is increased. Also, many investors feel they are better off selling there shares back to Harley Davidson. In a free market, transactions will only occur if all parties to it feel they will be better off than they were before. 

Too bad for the workers in KC losing their jobs, that sucks. However in the aggregate this tax legislation is causing the creation of more jobs , than what are being lost.

I do taxes for many small businesses and we took the time this last season to analyze their income and deductions from 2017 and apply it to 2018 tax law to give them a summary of what they could possibly expect. ***Most** businesses are going to save a lot of money this year. the 199A pass through deduction will save  small businesses a lot,  especially if they are a non service small business (ie manufacturing, sales & distribution etc. ) 

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

Too bad for the workers in KC losing their jobs, that sucks. However in the aggregate this tax legislation is causing the creation of more jobs , than what are being lost.

Jobs were created by Harley-Davidson too... ...in Thailand.

Thay Haif Said: Quhat Say Thay? Lat Thame Say

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4 minutes ago, Old_SD_Dude said:

Jobs were created by Harley-Davidson too... ...in Thailand.

The jobs lost in this specific example are a fraction of a fraction of a drop in a very large bucket of all jobs in our economy. It is absurd to think it is completely representative of what is going on in our labor market right now. The labor market right now is tight. Businesses, even manufacturing businesses are having trouble finding enough workers. 

 

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11 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

The jobs lost in this specific example are a fraction of a fraction of a drop in a very large bucket of all jobs in our economy. It is absurd to think it is completely representative of what is going on in our labor market right now. The labor market right now is tight. Businesses, even manufacturing businesses are having trouble finding enough workers. 

 

Job creation has slowed since Trump took office.

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13 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

The jobs lost in this specific example are a fraction of a fraction of a drop in a very large bucket of all jobs in our economy. It is absurd to think it is completely representative of what is going on in our labor market right now. The labor market right now is tight. Businesses, even manufacturing businesses are having trouble finding enough workers. 

 

Hmm, sounds like we need some low-cost immigrant labor.

Thay Haif Said: Quhat Say Thay? Lat Thame Say

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6 minutes ago, Old_SD_Dude said:

Hmm, sounds like we need some low-cost immigrant labor.

I am okay with that as long as they enter legally , and leave when they are supposed to.

We already have laws set up for a guest worker program.  

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14 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

 

49 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

Stock buy backs are not the terrible thing that many people think they are. They are actually very good for the economy. It is essentially giving a non cash dividend to shareholders and their wealth is increased. Also, many investors feel they are better off selling there shares back to Harley Davidson. In a free market, transactions will only occur if all parties to it feel they will be better off than they were before. 

Too bad for the workers in KC losing their jobs, that sucks. However in the aggregate this tax legislation is causing the creation of more jobs , than what are being lost.

I do taxes for many small businesses and we took the time this last season to analyze their income and deductions from 2017 and apply it to 2018 tax law to give them a summary of what they could possibly expect. ***Most** businesses are going to save a lot of money this year. the 199A pass through deduction will save  small businesses a lot,  especially if they are a non service small business (ie manufacturing, sales & distribution etc. ) 

 

 

 

We were told that the tax cuts would result in capital improvements and building new factories and job growth would explode. Critics said that the money would be invested overseas and spent on stock buy backs.

Stock buybacks are great for CEOs. they immediately increase stock prices, so that the CEO can get Phat bonus' and Phuket gets a new Harley manufacturing plant.

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59 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

The jobs lost in this specific example are a fraction of a fraction of a drop in a very large bucket of all jobs in our economy. It is absurd to think it is completely representative of what is going on in our labor market right now. The labor market right now is tight. Businesses, even manufacturing businesses are having trouble finding enough workers. 

Have you ever helped execute the process outsourcing of jobs? The one thing that stands out to me is how difficult it is to lay people off in other countries and how easy it is in the US. I do agree that finding workers isn’t easy but if you think the quality of work in a Thailand or China is better I would agree you’re crazy. It’s cheaper — end of story. 

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54 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

https://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2018/05/08/why-its-a-good-time-to-look-for-a-job/

This article says otherwise. A record number of unfilled jobs. 

More jobs were created in Obama's last year in office than Trump's first year.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/job-creation-poll-trump-obama_us_5a500d19e4b003133ec7d809

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55 minutes ago, jackmormon said:

We were told that the tax cuts would result in capital improvements and building new factories and job growth would explode. Critics said that the money would be invested overseas and spent on stock buy backs.

Stock buybacks are great for CEOs. they immediately increase stock prices, so that the CEO can get Phat bonus' and Phuket gets a new Harley manufacturing plant.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/capital-spending-boom-is-no-great-boost-to-capital-markets-1526376600

https://www.wsj.com/articles/boeing-offers-upbeat-2018-outlook-1517403441?mod=article_inline

Capital Spending has been growing very rapidly, fueled by the new tax legislation. 

What about the typical middle class person who has a 401(k) with direct or indirect investments in Harley Davidson. Wouldn't a stock buy back program benefit them too. What about the investor who takes his gains from he stock buy back and invests in a small business that hires more workers. It is not just the rich evil bastards that benefit from this. 

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48 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/capital-spending-boom-is-no-great-boost-to-capital-markets-1526376600

https://www.wsj.com/articles/boeing-offers-upbeat-2018-outlook-1517403441?mod=article_inline

Capital Spending has been growing very rapidly, fueled by the new tax legislation. 

What about the typical middle class person who has a 401(k) with direct or indirect investments in Harley Davidson. Wouldn't a stock buy back program benefit them too. What about the investor who takes his gains from he stock buy back and invests in a small business that hires more workers. It is not just the rich evil bastards that benefit from this. 

Trickle down theory? 

Of course employees who have 401ks benefit from a strong stock market but you’re talking about less than 40 percent? of the population who has one and an even smaller segment that regularly contributes to it. 

I’m pretty sure the hype from Republican Party  was increased domestic capital expenditure and job creation. So imo that’s how the tax cut should be measured.

I hope it works btw. 

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2 hours ago, jackmormon said:

We were told that the tax cuts would result in capital improvements and building new factories and job growth would explode. Critics said that the money would be invested overseas and spent on stock buy backs.

Stock buybacks are great for CEOs. they immediately increase stock prices, so that the CEO can get Phat bonus' and Phuket gets a new Harley manufacturing plant.

I was thinking about buying a new Harley.  Now?  Phuket.

:D

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BCS is to Football what Fox News is to Journalism

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8 minutes ago, BSUTOP25 said:

Whenever I hear partisans praising or blaming a president for the economy...

6a00d83462eb8d69e201310f7f5582970c-800wi

You don't think the policy set by Congress and the President has an impact on the economy? 

They have just as much of an impact on the economy as does the Federal reserve. 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

You don't think the policy set by Congress and the President has an impact on the economy? 

They have just as much of an impact on the economy as does the Federal reserve. 

 

 

So.....you give Obama credit for bringing us out of the "great recession"?

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12 minutes ago, renoskier said:

So.....you give Obama credit for bringing us out of the "great recession"?

Obama inherited the great recession, however his policies prolonged the recovery and the economy actually bounced along the bottom rather than recover for a long time. 

The recession in the early 1980's was much worse than Obama faced , yet we had a sharp V shaped recovery back then largely from the 1981 Bi partisan tax reform legislation. 

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15 minutes ago, bornontheblue said:

You don't think the policy set by Congress and the President has an impact on the economy? 

They have just as much of an impact on the economy as does the Federal reserve. 

Very little in the short-term as most policy tweaks take years to affect the economy. So you can flag wave and leg hump Trump all you want but reality says his tax cuts and monetary policy are not going to have substantive immediate influence on the job market or overall economy.

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