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Raz

Five years from now, will we have a Pac-12 and a Mountain West?

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On 6/24/2024 at 9:21 AM, Brew_Poke said:

SDSU has prestige thirst and wants to bail in a vainglorious attempt at differentiating themselves in the market. They think there's a space above the bulk of the MWC for them that'll make them feel better about themselves. I don't know how to explain it, I just know that it'll be so +++++ing funny if they leave and it doesn't work out for them a third time.

Shut Your Mouth GIF

"We don't have evidence but, we have lot's of theories."

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On 6/25/2024 at 7:09 PM, Beaver-Poke said:

If I am Utah, the Arizonas and Colorado, I look at the football schedule and go, "WTF were we thinking?" The only game that moves the needle even a little bit is Utah-BYU.

No more USC. No more Washington. No more Oregon. No more UCLA (yeah, they sucked, but UCLA is still a huge name in college athletics). But hey, enjoy those big intersectional games with WVU, Cincinnati, UCF and Iowa State. Scintillating. 

Texas Tech, Houston, Kansas and KState don't exactly move the the excitement needle either.

Baylor, Okie State, and TCU to a degree. But, as a lifetime West Coast CFB and Ute fan, the only good thing about the XII is it's not the G5.

"We don't have evidence but, we have lot's of theories."

Americans Mayor

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WSU president interview by John Canzano. Interesting reading.

Canzano: Washington State President Kirk Schulz speaks out in 1-on-1 (johncanzano.com)

Key statements: 

"I’m very committed to ensuring that we have a really great Division I conference — an all-sports conference — on the West Coast. I know some of the premier schools are in Midwest-based or East Coast-based conferences. But at the end of the day, I think the West Coast is going to want a premier conference.

"Now, does that look like some merger or whatever? I don’t know yet. But I do think that’s still really important to me and I think it’s important to some of my colleagues on the West Coast. As you can imagine, lots of egos get in the way. We’ve got to be really careful about how we message.

"I think when we came out of the gate a year ago, there was a little bit of, ‘Hey, we’re just going to go cherry-pick whatever schools we want and everybody’s going to come running.’ I think we found out that we were behaving in a way that people said, ‘Hey, what was just done to you two schools… now you’re talking about doing the same to everybody else and it’s OK?!?’ I think we took a step backward and said, ‘Hey, let’s talk about maybe partnerships instead of acquisition.’"

And this:

"I feel that in my conversations with (President) Jayathi Murthy at Oregon State, I think early in 2025, we’ve got to make a decision about where we’re going to be for the next four or five years. I don’t think we can continue having a foot in multiple conferences and hoping that something’s going to come our way.

"So I think we’re going to spend the fall planning, looking at our best options. And I think January-February, we’ve got to pick what we think is the best and aggressively move forward. So that’s where we are in the timeline.

"I know that supposedly we have more time than that with the NCAA and those things, but if we’re not careful, we’re going to keep kicking the can down the road. It’ll hurt recruiting, hurt coach retention, hurt our student-athletes. They want to know who they’re going to be competing against. And so that’s the timeline, at least I feel, is important for us to hold to."

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On 6/24/2024 at 8:21 AM, Brew_Poke said:

SDSU has prestige thirst and wants to bail in a vainglorious attempt at differentiating themselves in the market. They think there's a space above the bulk of the MWC for them that'll make them feel better about themselves. I don't know how to explain it, I just know that it'll be so +++++ing funny if they leave and it doesn't work out for them a third time.

 

It's not that. They are just frustrated because no matter what they've done over the past half century, they can't permanently shake off Fresno and SJSU. They follow the San Diegans anywhere they go. It's the same story, over...

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/conferences/pcaa/1969.html

 

...and over

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/conferences/wac/1996.html

 

...and over again

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/conferences/mwc/2013.html

 

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I agree.  It is not like BYU, Utah, UCF, Cin, and Houston, really drive the engine motor on the national stage

And do the big fan of the acc really care if Stanford and Cal are now part of the acc?

Is any fan of Utah or BYU really fired up about that delicious UCF or Cincinati ruvalry?

Is any big fan of the XII really fired up with excitement over all of the movement, jostling, alienating of fans and fan bases and destruction of traditional rivalries that has occurred?

I fear that this is where we are at for the majority of the former Pac 12 or Big XII.  Traditional rivalries are broken.  Good old fashioned hate has been replaced by TV contracts and time slots.

Is this improvement?

If you did not get a spot at the big boy table are you really any better off?

 

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On 6/27/2024 at 11:31 AM, Beaver-Poke said:

WSU president interview by John Canzano. Interesting reading.

Canzano: Washington State President Kirk Schulz speaks out in 1-on-1 (johncanzano.com)

Key statements: 

"I’m very committed to ensuring that we have a really great Division I conference — an all-sports conference — on the West Coast. I know some of the premier schools are in Midwest-based or East Coast-based conferences. But at the end of the day, I think the West Coast is going to want a premier conference.

"Now, does that look like some merger or whatever? I don’t know yet. But I do think that’s still really important to me and I think it’s important to some of my colleagues on the West Coast. As you can imagine, lots of egos get in the way. We’ve got to be really careful about how we message.

"I think when we came out of the gate a year ago, there was a little bit of, ‘Hey, we’re just going to go cherry-pick whatever schools we want and everybody’s going to come running.’ I think we found out that we were behaving in a way that people said, ‘Hey, what was just done to you two schools… now you’re talking about doing the same to everybody else and it’s OK?!?’ I think we took a step backward and said, ‘Hey, let’s talk about maybe partnerships instead of acquisition.’"

And this:

"I feel that in my conversations with (President) Jayathi Murthy at Oregon State, I think early in 2025, we’ve got to make a decision about where we’re going to be for the next four or five years. I don’t think we can continue having a foot in multiple conferences and hoping that something’s going to come our way.

"So I think we’re going to spend the fall planning, looking at our best options. And I think January-February, we’ve got to pick what we think is the best and aggressively move forward. So that’s where we are in the timeline.

"I know that supposedly we have more time than that with the NCAA and those things, but if we’re not careful, we’re going to keep kicking the can down the road. It’ll hurt recruiting, hurt coach retention, hurt our student-athletes. They want to know who they’re going to be competing against. And so that’s the timeline, at least I feel, is important for us to hold to."

Sure sounds like a MW merger to me.  They'll also call it the premier West Coast conference because it is the only West Coast conference, but it won't compare to the P4, but we all know that already.  

I hope they get it figured out in early January 2025 and everyone can start to move forward 

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On 6/27/2024 at 12:42 PM, agswin said:

I agree.  It is not like BYU, Utah, UCF, Cin, and Houston, really drive the engine motor on the national stage

And do the big fan of the acc really care if Stanford and Cal are now part of the acc?

Is any fan of Utah or BYU really fired up about that delicious UCF or Cincinati ruvalry?

Is any big fan of the XII really fired up with excitement over all of the movement, jostling, alienating of fans and fan bases and destruction of traditional rivalries that has occurred?

I fear that this is where we are at for the majority of the former Pac 12 or Big XII.  Traditional rivalries are broken.  Good old fashioned hate has been replaced by TV contracts and time slots.

Is this improvement?

If you did not get a spot at the big boy table are you really any better off?

 

The answer to your last question is look at the money paid out per school in those conferences versus any G5 conference.  It isn't remotely close.  So yes, they really are better off.  And the gap is only going to grow faster with NIL and instant transfer and play.  That is why many of us on this forum are predicting a split in FBS in the future.  

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On 6/27/2024 at 1:20 PM, Wyobraska said:

Sure sounds like a MW merger to me.  They'll also call it the premier West Coast conference because it is the only West Coast conference, but it won't compare to the P4, but we all know that already.  

I hope they get it figured out in early January 2025 and everyone can start to move forward 

Boy, I really really hope they are not planning on waiting THAT long. I was thinking we would hear a formal announcement by the start of the football season — announcing the closing of the merger by Jan. 1, 2025.

I honestly don’t think WSU’s nor OSU’s football/BB programs can survive the gutting of another season sans conference affiliation. 

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On 6/27/2024 at 11:31 AM, Beaver-Poke said:

"I think when we came out of the gate a year ago, there was a little bit of, ‘Hey, we’re just going to go cherry-pick whatever schools we want and everybody’s going to come running.’ I think we found out that we were behaving in a way that people said, ‘Hey, what was just done to you two schools… now you’re talking about doing the same to everybody else and it’s OK?!?’ I think we took a step backward and said, ‘Hey, let’s talk about maybe partnerships instead of acquisition.’"

Love it

bsu%252520mwc%252520logo.jpg

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On 6/27/2024 at 12:04 PM, jdgaucho said:

 

It's not that. They are just frustrated because no matter what they've done over the past half century, they can't permanently shake off Fresno and SJSU. They follow the San Diegans anywhere they go. It's the same story, over...

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/conferences/pcaa/1969.html

 

...and over

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/conferences/wac/1996.html

 

...and over again

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/conferences/mwc/2013.html

 

So not thirsty, but thirsty? Got it, I guess.

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On 6/27/2024 at 11:31 AM, Beaver-Poke said:

WSU president interview by John Canzano. Interesting reading.

Canzano: Washington State President Kirk Schulz speaks out in 1-on-1 (johncanzano.com)

Key statements: 

"I’m very committed to ensuring that we have a really great Division I conference — an all-sports conference — on the West Coast. I know some of the premier schools are in Midwest-based or East Coast-based conferences. But at the end of the day, I think the West Coast is going to want a premier conference.

"Now, does that look like some merger or whatever? I don’t know yet. But I do think that’s still really important to me and I think it’s important to some of my colleagues on the West Coast. As you can imagine, lots of egos get in the way. We’ve got to be really careful about how we message.

"I think when we came out of the gate a year ago, there was a little bit of, ‘Hey, we’re just going to go cherry-pick whatever schools we want and everybody’s going to come running.’ I think we found out that we were behaving in a way that people said, ‘Hey, what was just done to you two schools… now you’re talking about doing the same to everybody else and it’s OK?!?’ I think we took a step backward and said, ‘Hey, let’s talk about maybe partnerships instead of acquisition.’"

freestar

Yep. Sounds very much like a merger with the MWC, but they are worried about egos and how to message that. Sounds like they are very careful about sounding overcommitted to a decision that has already been made and are worried about egos and messaging and not offending certain people…probably some big donors. But, ultimately, they committed to a West Coast only league. And…no cherry-picking!

Which, yeah, pretty much sounds like an imminent merger with the MWC before the end of the year.

And, which if that is the case, welcome Beavers and Cougars! We will make a great go of it together or die trying! 

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On 6/27/2024 at 7:56 PM, SteedLaw said:

Yep. Sounds very much like a merger with the MWC, but they are worried about egos and how to message that. Sounds like they are very careful about sounding overcommitted to a decision that has already been made and are worried about egos and messaging and not offending certain people…probably some big donors. But, ultimately, they committed to a West Coast only league. And…no cherry-picking!

Which, yeah, pretty much sounds like an imminent merger with the MWC before the end of the year.

And, which if that is the case, welcome Beavers and Cougars! We will make a great go of it together or die trying! 

When the merger happens there is a chance, albeit slim, that the MWC could cement itself as the 5th best Conference by getting a team to the Playoff every year and winning some games. There are lots of good players who aren't seeing any or significant playing time, show them a team from the MWC that's constantly making the playoff and that could attract some good talent despite lack of $$.

Winning also will translate to more eyeballs and more National Recognition, I doubt the Conference would get Power Status but it could put itself in a position to not be left behind at the bare minimum.

The only hope Wazzu and OSU have to avoid the merger (hence the delays) is the ACC collapsing and having them either join the ACC or Big12 as backfill options.

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Yep. As GA often said, JFW. 

Simply winning solves a lot of other problems.

I don't have much doubt that at some point in the near future, the MWC's position in the overall scheme of college football is going to evolve upward and forward.

I doubt the MWC and any additions will ever ascend to being at the SEC/B1G Super-conference level.

But with continued explosion of population in the Pacific/Mountain Time Zone, I fully expect that we will see more, not less, programs from the Pacific and Mountain Time Zones.

 

 

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On 6/13/2024 at 9:07 PM, Spaztecs said:

 

The concrete stands from the open end of the Bowl remain. Seems like a great spot for a sacrifice. 

 

images.jpeg.d7135ba80465ab1257d1ead008fcd840.jpeg

 

The Grossmont League used to play the league FB carnival there back in my days. It was a thrill to get to warm up and play a quarter there as a HS player! Brings back great memories every time I’m at Viejas. 

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On 6/27/2024 at 6:54 PM, Brew_Poke said:

So not thirsty, but thirsty? Got it, I guess.

 Cal States are an interesting lot

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On 6/30/2024 at 2:58 PM, jdgaucho said:

 Cal States are an interesting lot

SDSU gets invited up before the rest of the group. It's been that way for a while. Does that bother you for some reason?

 

 

 

 

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On 6/28/2024 at 3:57 AM, utgrizfan said:

When the merger happens there is a chance, albeit slim, that the MWC could cement itself as the 5th best Conference by getting a team to the Playoff every year and winning some games. There are lots of good players who aren't seeing any or significant playing time, show them a team from the MWC that's constantly making the playoff and that could attract some good talent despite lack of $$.

Winning also will translate to more eyeballs and more National Recognition, I doubt the Conference would get Power Status but it could put itself in a position to not be left behind at the bare minimum.

The only hope Wazzu and OSU have to avoid the merger (hence the delays) is the ACC collapsing and having them either join the ACC or Big12 as backfill options.

The ACC is going to shrink.  Rather back fill with Oregon St and Wash St, it is more likely that Cal and Stanford come back.   The ACC will give up trying to be a P4 for football after losing Clemson, Fl St, Miami, UNC, and a few more (to be named later).  ESPN will drop the payout to close to the MWC.

I don't think Cal and Stanford will stick around with Wake, BC, Duke, NC St, Syracuse, UVa and SMU for chump change. 

Bye Bye, Best of luck! !! May the MWC survive, and prosper
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On 6/27/2024 at 8:12 AM, Spaztecs said:

Texas Tech, Houston, Kansas and KState don't exactly move the the excitement needle either.

Baylor, Okie State, and TCU to a degree. But, as a lifetime West Coast CFB and Ute fan, the only good thing about the XII is it's not the G5.

With Texas and Oklahoma no longer in the BigXII it seems as if you hit the nail on the head.

**  “It’s a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. The only variable is about what.”

“There’s no ‘I’ in team. There’s a ‘me’ though, if you jumble it up.”

 

hoserjpg-2009.jpg.1a3e5724d48c16a835b94dde26c99132.jpg

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On 7/1/2024 at 11:34 AM, Cougar/Frog said:

The ACC is going to shrink.  Rather back fill with Oregon St and Wash St, it is more likely that Cal and Stanford come back.   The ACC will give up trying to be a P4 for football after losing Clemson, Fl St, Miami, UNC, and a few more (to be named later).  ESPN will drop the payout to close to the MWC.

I don't think Cal and Stanford will stick around with Wake, BC, Duke, NC St, Syracuse, UVa and SMU for chump change. 

They would rather go Independent or drop Football it seems rather then be associated with any MWC schools, or even OSU and Wazzu. Stanford could probably pull off Independence but CAL would be sunk, and good riddance IMO.

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On 7/1/2024 at 11:37 PM, utgrizfan said:

They would rather go Independent or drop Football it seems rather then be associated with any MWC schools, or even OSU and Wazzu. Stanford could probably pull off Independence but CAL would be sunk, and good riddance IMO.

CAL will join the new PAC 15 once the ACC implodes (OSU + MWC + WSU + Cal). No way they are giving up on football entirely. They are not going to like it, but that is probably the most likely 3-year scenario. 
 

Stanford has plenty of money and enough of national following to just go (and stay) independent after the ACC implodes and until they and ND Get the B1G 10 invite (which will happen).

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