FBI Director: Antisemitism now at historic levels

[MetropolitanCowboy]

On 11/22/2023 at 12:29 PM, bornontheblue said:

They already tried that many times, and even offered Palestine their own sovereignty. Palestine instead decided to elect terrorists. Choices>>>Consequences. 
Maybe this time they will learn , but I doubt it. 

Lulz. You’re not talking about the peace “deals” in the 90s right? Those were flawed from the start for a number of reasons, many that could individually fill their own books. 

They’ve never (to my knowledge) offered Palestine any sovereignty. The original deal that Bill brokered in the 90s had about the closest thing you could get to it, but it still didn’t cross the proverbial goal line. 

Read some stuff before you shut dumbassery from the digital rooftops.

[MetropolitanCowboy]

On 11/22/2023 at 5:01 PM, East Coast Aztec said:

What does color have to do with being a Cubs fan?

 

We can just ask them outright:  Do you want Jews gone, or Israel gone.  Saying it is one and the same is inaccurate.  And go the other way, ask them if they want Muslims gone, or Palestine gone.  We have heard discussions of both being wiped out.  Which is why I have been a little bewildered at support for either being such a thing as an outsider.  If they want to eradicate Jews, or eradicate Palestinians, I am not for it.  If they want to F up Hamas for what they did to innocent people, I am for it.  But if Israel does something, and they have before, and they are now, am I supposed to act like any reaction to that is a hate for the religious or ethnic Jew?  No, I just don't like Israeli gov't doing something that we get pissed at Hamas about.  Which is why I don't support either political entity, but will support innocent people of either side, and right now am definitely more pissed at Hamas for their actions that have created this situation.

 

But, I guess I am antisemitic.  Gotta go yell at my Jewish lady, I suppose.  

Weren’t Cub fans all colored green (with envy) until 2016? lol

You’re putting in strong work on this thread, I’ve enjoyed reading your thoughts. 

[Nevada Convert]

On 11/22/2023 at 10:39 AM, sactowndog said:

Just to be clear I am anti Likud as Bibi is as bad or worse than Trump.  I’ve made my call we shall see how it plays out and who was correct in due time.  
 

At no point have I ever stated that Israel doesn’t have the right to exist.  

And in one of your recent posts you compared Likud to Hamas. That is nuts. 

[sactowndog]

On 11/22/2023 at 1:37 PM, CPslograd said:

Thats two different things.

Opposing various Isreali government policy, is not inherently antisemitism.

Calling for the eradication of the Jewish nation of Israel is antisemitism by definition.  A lot of these pro hamas protesters, when you get to what they really want, it's exactly that.  They want Israel to disappear from the map.

Yeah except a significant number of protestors that are against the current campaign are in fact Jews who are horrified the state of Israel is conducting ethnic cleansing.  

Are there some extremist Israel doesn’t deserve to exist types: sure.  But even most Palestinians I know are not in that camp. 

[sactowndog]

On 11/22/2023 at 2:29 PM, Nevada Convert said:

And in one of your recent posts you compared Likud to Hamas. That is nuts. 

Well more accurately the right wing settlers but they have taken over Likud much like the Freedom Caucus owns the Republican Party.  

[Nevada Convert]

On 11/22/2023 at 11:26 AM, SAMO said:

Wearing a keffiyeh is dressing like a terrorist now?…lol

good lord what a bunch of ignorant hicks…I’m out 

Context is everything. He was talking about this type of unibrow unhinged idiot. If I grab an Italian restaurant table cloth and slap it on my head and walk down the street, no one is going to call me a terrorist. Ugly? Yes. Terrorist? No. 
 

[CPslograd]

On 11/22/2023 at 2:01 PM, East Coast Aztec said:

What does color have to do with being a Cubs fan?

 

We can just ask them outright:  Do you want Jews gone, or Israel gone.  Saying it is one and the same is inaccurate.  And go the other way, ask them if they want Muslims gone, or Palestine gone.  We have heard discussions of both being wiped out.  Which is why I have been a little bewildered at support for either being such a thing as an outsider.  If they want to eradicate Jews, or eradicate Palestinians, I am not for it.  If they want to F up Hamas for what they did to innocent people, I am for it.  But if Israel does something, and they have before, and they are now, am I supposed to act like any reaction to that is a hate for the religious or ethnic Jew?  No, I just don't like Israeli gov't doing something that we get pissed at Hamas about.  Which is why I don't support either political entity, but will support innocent people of either side, and right now am definitely more pissed at Hamas for their actions that have created this situation.

 

But, I guess I am antisemitic.  Gotta go yell at my Jewish lady, I suppose.  

If someone wants Israel gone, the country to no longer exist, I feel pretty comfortable saying they are antisemitic.  Whats the argument here, "I dont have anything against jews I just dont want them to have a country"?  

I didnt call you an antisemite, or indicate that political disagreement with Israeli policy made a person one, not sure why you are conflating two different things.

 

[sactowndog]

On 11/22/2023 at 3:06 PM, CPslograd said:

If someone wants Israel gone, the country to no longer exist, I feel pretty comfortable saying they are antisemitic.  Whats the argument here, "I dont have anything against jews I just dont want them to have a country"?  

I didnt call you an antisemite, or indicate that political disagreement with Israeli policy made a person one, not sure why you are conflating two different things.

 

You don’t but whole twitter handles exist that do and actively work to get people fired for disagreeing about Israeli government policy 

[Nevada Convert]

On 11/22/2023 at 2:24 PM, MetropolitanCowboy said:

Lulz. You’re not talking about the peace “deals” in the 90s right? Those were flawed from the start for a number of reasons, many that could individually fill their own books. 

They’ve never (to my knowledge) offered Palestine any sovereignty. The original deal that Bill brokered in the 90s had about the closest thing you could get to it, but it still didn’t cross the proverbial goal line. 

Read some stuff before you shut dumbassery from the digital rooftops.

Dude, you don’t know what you’re talking about. The P’s have NEVER been in favor of a two state solution from the very beginning. They have pretended to and then backed out with ridiculous excuses when presented with it going back to the 1940’s. The clear majority of Palestinians will not be satisfied until all the Jews are relocated far away or killed. That is a fact. 

Sure Israel has made big mistakes and certainly aren’t blameless. But Israeli culture has been created by its extraordinarily difficult environment, past and attempt to survive. It’s laughable the way some people frame Israel as the powerful arrogant cruel occupiers that are a threat to the Muslim Middle East. There are 15 Muslim state countries in the world, and only 1 Jewish. And it’s tiny. And a majority of the Muslims in these countries would like to see Israel wiped clean. Does Israel want the same for them? Of course not. They just want to be left alone. 

So the context of Israel’s difficult environment and survivalist mentality makes some of their mistakes understandable. Israel certainly could understand the P plight of having nowhere to go and no other countries that want them. But the P’s have royally fvcked that up using violent Islamic extremism. How do you think the civil rights movement would’ve gone in the 1960’s if the blacks in this country were largely Muslim and decided to use suicide bombers to get their civil rights? Not only would it not have made any progress, it would’ve gone massively backwards and this would be a very different country right now, and not nearly as great. 

[bornontheblue]

On 11/22/2023 at 3:24 PM, MetropolitanCowboy said:

Lulz. You’re not talking about the peace “deals” in the 90s right? Those were flawed from the start for a number of reasons, many that could individually fill their own books. 

They’ve never (to my knowledge) offered Palestine any sovereignty. The original deal that Bill brokered in the 90s had about the closest thing you could get to it, but it still didn’t cross the proverbial goal line. 

Read some stuff before you shut dumbassery from the digital rooftops.

You stupid bastard. The 2000 agreement at camp David had , many, many concessions offered by Israel including a separate state. You are the one who needs to educated about this son. 
 

https://www.adl.org/resources/backgrounder/camp-david-summit-2000

[RSF]

On 11/22/2023 at 3:37 PM, bornontheblue said:

Upper Midwest white folks are the terrorists? 

Just Cub fans.

 

 

Milwaukee gives us beer, which is proof God loves us and wants to be happy.

[sactowndog]

On 11/22/2023 at 7:54 AM, mugtang said:

It also didn’t start 75 years ago either. 

Here is what Israel would do if its intent were to damage or remove HAMAS but intended to have GAZA remain Palestinian

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/israel/hamas-asymmetric-advantage-gaza-cronin

They are specifically not doing those things.  In fact, they are blowing up infrastructure even after it’s been cleared of fighters.  Why, because as stated by political leaders over and over their goal is to ethnically cleanse GAZA.  If anyone actually listens to what they say and watches their actions the intent of Israel is clear.  

[MetropolitanCowboy]

On 11/22/2023 at 7:23 PM, bornontheblue said:

You stupid bastard. The 2000 agreement at camp David had , many, many concessions offered by Israel including a separate state. You are the one who needs to educated about this son. 
 

https://www.adl.org/resources/backgrounder/camp-david-summit-2000

No it didn’t. Both parties threw up a one-time Hail Mary that was a flawed approach. There was never movement on a right of return, there was never movement on Jerusalem. It was never a serious attempt at negotiation by either side. 

The only way you’d ever see any serious movement is the pre-1967 borders, which Israel isn’t willing to entertain at this point. The Palestinians have accepted the reality of a two-state solution through their Declaration of Independence in 1988, but you can’t offer a square mile in Hell’s Half Acre and say you seriously are negotiating. Israel already comprises almost 80% of the former Palestine, how much more is enough? 

Again, I’m in favor of a one-state solution, it would benefit everyone as a whole. It’ll never happen, but it should. Both peoples have competing claims to the land, and really have coexisted rather peacefully for eons before 1948. There’s two sets of polarized extremists running each actor currently, leading to the blood-filled mess we’re in. 

Also, brush up on your insult game a bit there, too. I know it must be hard molesting collies as a cuckolded Wal Mart tax preparer who lives in his in-laws’ basement broom closet with the wit of the autistic, but still, maybe try harder? 

[MetropolitanCowboy]

On 11/22/2023 at 6:46 PM, Nevada Convert said:

Dude, you don’t know what you’re talking about. The P’s have NEVER been in favor of a two state solution from the very beginning. They have pretended to and then backed out with ridiculous excuses when presented with it going back to the 1940’s. The clear majority of Palestinians will not be satisfied until all the Jews are relocated far away or killed. That is a fact. 

Sure Israel has made big mistakes and certainly aren’t blameless. But Israeli culture has been created by its extraordinarily difficult environment, past and attempt to survive. It’s laughable the way some people frame Israel as the powerful arrogant cruel occupiers that are a threat to the Muslim Middle East. There are 15 Muslim state countries in the world, and only 1 Jewish. And it’s tiny. And a majority of the Muslims in these countries would like to see Israel wiped clean. Does Israel want the same for them? Of course not. They just want to be left alone. 

So the context of Israel’s difficult environment and survivalist mentality makes some of their mistakes understandable. Israel certainly could understand the P plight of having nowhere to go and no other countries that want them. But the P’s have royally fvcked that up using violent Islamic extremism. How do you think the civil rights movement would’ve gone in the 1960’s if the blacks in this country were largely Muslim and decided to use suicide bombers to get their civil rights? Not only would it not have made any progress, it would’ve gone massively backwards and this would be a very different country right now, and not nearly as great. 

They’ve been in favor of one since 1988. Or is the UN not a reputable source, Mr. Birch? 

https://www.un.org/unispal/document/auto-insert-178680/

Your analysis is garbage and terribly misinformed lol. The Palestinians aren’t a monolithic Muslim bloc, nor is the greater Middle East. There are a number of Christians throughout the region. 

Also, let’s not forget that Israel and Lebanon nearly had a peace deal in the 1980s when the Phalangists controlled Beirut’s government. Let’s also not forget that Israel and Iran were once great allies before the rise of Khomeini. Additionally, the Saudis and Israelis have long cooperated (as have a number of Gulf nations) on a number of issues, albeit not in an official capacity, and there was nearly a deal between the Assad government in Syria and Israel prior to the war breaking out in that country in 2011.

Are there hostile parties? Yes. That can’t be disputed. There are bankrolling individuals in the Persian Gulf that fund the atrocities like 10/7. But there are individuals within Israel such as Bibi and Ariel Sharon who have moved the needle of death other directions too. 

Bottom line is, we’ve reached a point where the hardline extremists have control of their respective parties, and this is the fallout. I have relatives in Israel and am close with many Palestinians. Please spare me the “yOu DoNt KnOw ShIt FrOm ShInoLa!!!1!!” rhetoric, Dog Man, and go back to slinging stories about the time you and your hairless cats washed Eddie Vedder’s rhinestone thong in your little grass shack in Kealakekua, Hawaii. You’re better at that. 

[bornontheblue]

On 11/23/2023 at 8:55 AM, MetropolitanCowboy said:

No it didn’t. Both parties threw up a one-time Hail Mary that was a flawed approach. There was never movement on a right of return, there was never movement on Jerusalem. It was never a serious attempt at negotiation by either side. 

The only way you’d ever see any serious movement is the pre-1967 borders, which Israel isn’t willing to entertain at this point. The Palestinians have accepted the reality of a two-state solution through their Declaration of Independence in 1988, but you can’t offer a square mile in Hell’s Half Acre and say you seriously are negotiating. Israel already comprises almost 80% of the former Palestine, how much more is enough? 

Again, I’m in favor of a one-state solution, it would benefit everyone as a whole. It’ll never happen, but it should. Both peoples have competing claims to the land, and really have coexisted rather peacefully for eons before 1948. There’s two sets of polarized extremists running each actor currently, leading to the blood-filled mess we’re in. 

Also, brush up on your insult game a bit there, too. I know it must be hard molesting collies as a cuckolded Wal Mart tax preparer who lives in his in-laws’ basement broom closet with the wit of the autistic, but still, maybe try harder? 

Again you prove you have the intellect of a dirty mop. Educate yourself on the 2000 Camp David meetings with Barak and Arafat. The political mood in Israel had turned pro peace by 2000 and it was reflected in electing a pro peace prime minister. Clinton tried to take advantage of this and wanted to leave the office with a shiny new peace deal. Israel offered numerous concessions including Palestinian sovereignty. See the previous link where I had to educate your ignorant ass on the topic. 
 

Why the jealousy disguised as hostility toward my career choice. Did an accountant tell you that you didn’t make enough money to be worth his time? Well if you take your w2 from Popeyes chicken for $22,000 in a couple months and take a picture of it and upload it to turbo tax ,  it will do your taxes for you. For a guy like you with real simple finances it should be a breeze, but you might be too dumb to figure it out. 

[grandjean87]

Confirmation bias rules.

 

[SalinasSpartan]

On 11/22/2023 at 11:02 AM, CPslograd said:

The extensive West Bank settlements built in the past 3 decades have made a two state solution much harder to achieve, I do think the US should have withheld aide to Israel at various times over the construction of settlements.  The irony is elements of the hard right like Pat Buchanan supported witholding aid over that, as did some of the far left.  But there was no appetite for it in the political middle.

I disagree with you a lot, obviously. And I am pretty sure we have had some intense back and forths. But I admit one of the reasons I come here is to get the perspective of people I consider to be conservatives that truly operate in “good faith”. You are one of the best examples of that, IMO. 

[MetropolitanCowboy]

On 11/23/2023 at 12:09 PM, bornontheblue said:

Again you prove you have the intellect of a dirty mop. Educate yourself on the 2000 Camp David meetings with Barak and Arafat. The political mood in Israel had turned pro peace by 2000 and it was reflected in electing a pro peace prime minister. Clinton tried to take advantage of this and wanted to leave the office with a shiny new peace deal. Israel offered numerous concessions including Palestinian sovereignty. See the previous link where I had to educate your ignorant ass on the topic. 
 

Why the jealousy disguised as hostility toward my career choice. Did an accountant tell you that you didn’t make enough money to be worth his time? Well if you take your w2 from Popeyes chicken for $22,000 in a couple months and take a picture of it and upload it to turbo tax ,  it will do your taxes for you. For a guy like you with real simple finances it should be a breeze, but you might be too dumb to figure it out. 

Barak, much like Rabin several years before, didn’t have popular support at home, and only tried to set these up in an attempt to hastily save face after his previous negotiations with old man Assad in Syria failed. Desperate, he wanted to use the last few months of Bill’s presidency to try something for any sort of a W. In all reality, the summit should probably never have taken place. 

The summit itself was ill-conceived and ill-advised at the time. Barak and Arafat were both held hostage to the politics in their respective jurisdictions at the time; Barak’s gov’t literally came unraveled at that summit ffs. The Israelis weren’t willing to play ball on Jerusalem and didn’t consider the right of return, plus gave a really shitty attempt at a land grant…have you ever seen the map? Probably not.  

The sauce here, too, that you’re clinging to like Charlton Heston is a generalized opinion piece masquerading as news on the ADL… that’s like getting an unbiased account on Jan. 6th from the Hannity show lol.

I’ve been to Israel countless times and still have family there, please spare me the faux intellectual superiority you’re trying to broadcast because you read a slanted opinion article on the Internet is. Congrats, you’re as shitty at paraphrasing as you are at life lulz.

[bornontheblue]

On 11/23/2023 at 5:15 PM, MetropolitanCowboy said:

Barak, much like Rabin several years before, didn’t have popular support at home, and only tried to set these up in an attempt to hastily save face after his previous negotiations with old man Assad in Syria failed. Desperate, he wanted to use the last few months of Bill’s presidency to try something for any sort of a W. In all reality, the summit should probably never have taken place. 

The summit itself was ill-conceived and ill-advised at the time. Barak and Arafat were both held hostage to the politics in their respective jurisdictions at the time; Barak’s gov’t literally came unraveled at that summit ffs. The Israelis weren’t willing to play ball on Jerusalem and didn’t consider the right of return, plus gave a really shitty attempt at a land grant…have you ever seen the map? Probably not.  

The sauce here, too, that you’re clinging to like Charlton Heston is a generalized opinion piece masquerading as news on the ADL… that’s like getting an unbiased account on Jan. 6th from the Hannity show lol.

I’ve been to Israel countless times and still have family there, please spare me the faux intellectual superiority you’re trying to broadcast because you read a slanted opinion article on the Internet is. Congrats, you’re as shitty at paraphrasing as you are at life lulz.

Every piece I’ve ever read about that summit was that Arafat was just stringing them along like Palestine has at every attempt at peace. Palestine was and has never been interested in peace. They will take concessions, never offer their own in return and  when the whole world is looking at them and encouraging them to take a serious step in at lasting peace , they balk, just like they always do. 
As far as the Israeli government falling sorry shortly thereafter, well that speaks more to Israel’s political system with multiple parties and fragile alliances , than it does to a rebuke of the multiple concessions Barack made. 

I’ve can read dummy , and I’ve been to Japan several times. I won’t claim to be an expert a Japanese politics though. 

[CPslograd]

On 11/23/2023 at 11:03 AM, SalinasSpartan said:

I disagree with you a lot, obviously. And I am pretty sure we have had some intense back and forths. But I admit one of the reasons I come here is to get the perspective of people I consider to be conservatives that truly operate in “good faith”. You are one of the best examples of that, IMO. 

Happy thanksgiving Salinas Spartan.  We can at least agree to disagree, and I am grateful for that.