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retrofade

The Christofascists have manufactured even more outrage

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My main issue with Christianity is in my experience they are very quick to condemn and disrespect other religions like Buddhism and Hinduism, and especially Islam which many I know put it right up there with satanism. Of course this is not all Christians, but when you see it in your everyday personal life often, it's easy to get turned off.

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I've said it once, but I'll say it again.   All of this anti-gay "protect the kids" panic is the same thing that happened back in the 1970s and 1980s. I give it two more weeks before the culture warriors trot out Anita Bryant

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On 5/27/2023 at 12:58 AM, bornontheblue said:

All of us yes 

What then? Are we better than they? Not at all. For we have previously charged both Jews and Greeks that they are all under sin. As it is written: “There is none righteous, no, not one; There is none who understands; There is none who seeks after God. They have all turned aside; They have together become unprofitable; There is none who does good, no, not one.” But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Romans 3:9‭-‬12‭, ‬21‭-‬23 NKJV

https://bible.com/bible/114/rom.3.9-23.NKJV

Read that last part again. There is no difference all have sinned and all are well short. Whether you be the moscow killer , or just a guy from Boise. There is no difference. None of us are in any position to judge ... Period 

 

First, have a great graduation celebration day. 

You have a great habit of tunnel vision and propensity for simple answers.  This seems true whether it's Biden causing inflation or literal interpretations of selected scripture passages. 

There is a context for Romans 3, omitting for brevity, and a fairly clear theology that has consensus holding across Christian theology (essential grace).  But, in no way is that passage a polemic equating all sins or defects with all others.   Your use of the term judging/judgement must be held to the very narrow matter of soteriology or it falls apart. Of course we can judge things that are wrong.  There's a line in Colossians about admonishing others (although that, too requires context).

That's the central problem with looking for passages of scripture as the sole truths to use as arguments for theological positions.  It's the central problem of how sola scriptura is interpreted in innumerable ways by countless entities over time.  I mean, just read the first of the beatitudes in Matthew.  Taken literally the poor (anawim) in spirit go to heaven for being what they are.  The meek inherit the land (kingdom). Read Matthew's account of the Sermon on the Mount knowing Jesus is speaking to the collective (the group, the plural) and not the individual.  It can definitely make for a differences from an American 21st interpretation. 

Btw:  I mentioned before, but since you always refer to Paul, the NPP should be of interest. 
https://www.theopedia.com/new-perspective-on-paul

 

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On 5/27/2023 at 10:09 AM, Stealthlobo said:

My main issue with Christianity is in my experience they are very quick to condemn and disrespect other religions like Buddhism and Hinduism, and especially Islam which many I know put it right up there with satanism. Of course this is not all Christians, but when you see it in your everyday personal life often, it's easy to get turned off.

My former pastor once wore a shirt to his gym workouts that said something like, "Dear Jesus, save me from your followers."

Of course, don't take that too literally. Lol. 

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On 5/27/2023 at 9:48 AM, RebelAlliance said:

It's all sky god mythology created by the oligarchs of the day to keep the masses subservient.  I'm not saying there isn't some higher power behind life, but none of the world's sky god books hold the key to understanding it.  

I don't know about this but I do know that "the word of God" was all written by...men :shrug:

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On 5/27/2023 at 10:48 AM, RebelAlliance said:

It's all sky god mythology created by the oligarchs of the day to keep the masses subservient.  I'm not saying there isn't some higher power behind life, but none of the world's sky god books hold the key to understanding it.  

St. Augustine beat you to that by 1,600 years or so. “Si comprehendus, non est Deus,” which means “If you understand, it is not God.”   I did have to Google for the Latin phrase.   I'd also have to redo some old history studies for more, but that quote is paralleled by early Christian theology.  A sky god is not the belief. 

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On 5/27/2023 at 11:04 AM, renoskier said:

I don't know about this but I do know that "the word of God" was all written by...men :shrug:

The word of God is not limited to writings.  I mean, read the prologue of the Gospel of John.  Our translation using the term , the "Word" comes from the Greek "logos".  The word (logos) isn't a book.  It's the beyond material essence of God which we will never understand.  We do  get some clues, however.  And, there's 'a passage in Hebrews that indicates, we have internal knowledge of the Good. 

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On 5/26/2023 at 9:49 AM, East Coast Aztec said:

Don't bring your kids.  That part is easy.  I am guessing most moderates will not want to see outright sexuality in any sort, so we can agree on that.  Now, what is a little strange is when it is "sexual" solely because of drag, which though not my taste, I don't see that as sexual, it's more of a clown type of thing.  So if the application of what is "sexual" is skewed, then that is an inconsistency and should be called out.  Same with trans existing.  I don't think kids should be going through procedures (very rare exceptions, as nothing is black and white), but if they think they are something else, eh.  It's either a fad, or it isn't.  I doubt many parents here are going to actually throw the kids to the curb over it, so I don't think I should legislate a notion of the such on those who are actually going through it.

Now, some images I have seen from some Pride parades, where there are kids, with sex toys and ass cheeks out, I have to question how that got permitted in the first place, and why would someone who has a kid in tow go there.  But I am a non-PDA or exhibitionist type of person, have been my whole life.  But that means if I don't like it, I go away.  If I am watching kids, I go away.  Shit ain't hard.

 

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On 5/27/2023 at 10:35 AM, grandjean87 said:

First, have a great graduation celebration day. 

You have a great habit of tunnel vision and propensity for simple answers.  This seems true whether it's Biden causing inflation or literal interpretations of selected scripture passages. 

There is a context for Romans 3, omitting for brevity, and a fairly clear theology that has consensus holding across Christian theology (essential grace).  But, in no way is that passage a polemic equating all sins or defects with all others.   Your use of the term judging/judgement must be held to the very narrow matter of soteriology or it falls apart. Of course we can judge things that are wrong.  There's a line in Colossians about admonishing others (although that, too requires context).

That's the central problem with looking for passages of scripture as the sole truths to use as arguments for theological positions.  It's the central problem of how sola scriptura is interpreted in innumerable ways by countless entities over time.  I mean, just read the first of the beatitudes in Matthew.  Taken literally the poor (anawim) in spirit go to heaven for being what they are.  The meek inherit the land (kingdom). Read Matthew's account of the Sermon on the Mount knowing Jesus is speaking to the collective (the group, the plural) and not the individual.  It can definitely make for a differences from an American 21st interpretation. 

Btw:  I mentioned before, but since you always refer to Paul, the NPP should be of interest. 
https://www.theopedia.com/new-perspective-on-paul

 

You have a habit of saying a lot of words without saying really much at all. 

Yes some sins are more heinous than others , but we are all subject to the same judgement. Which if you circle back to my main point puts us in no position to be judgemental of anybody else. For those who believe we are all equally dependent on Christ. 

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On 5/27/2023 at 1:39 AM, halfmanhalfbronco said:

Minute by minute?  So every ounce of human existence is a failure in Gods eyes? 

10 months ago I went down to the soup kitchen with my leather chess board to play chess with the homeless.  Never told a soul about it until now.  Was every minute of those 2 hours a failure in God's eyes?  

I would like you to reconcile your statements with my hypotheticals but you seem unwilling to address them.  

We have all fallen short of what God expects of us, even those like you who have overcome many obstacles , and spend their time serving others. Jesus says so himself. 

If God gets us through a hardship or gets us over an obstacle , all credit and praise goes to God and none to ourselves. Well that is my POV on things. I understand you  feel differently. 

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On 5/27/2023 at 10:48 AM, RebelAlliance said:

It's all sky god mythology created by the oligarchs of the day to keep the masses subservient.  I'm not saying there isn't some higher power behind life, but none of the world's sky god books hold the key to understanding it.  

I'm shocked @UNLV2001isn't here with all his atheists memes. 

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On 5/27/2023 at 1:22 PM, bornontheblue said:

You have a habit of saying a lot of words without saying really much at all. 

Yes some sins are more heinous than others , but we are all subject to the same judgement. Which if you circle back to my main point puts us in no position to be judgemental of anybody else. For those who believe we are all equally dependent on Christ. 

I'm sorry for using big words without also explaining what they mean.   When I come across unfamiliar terms (happens all the time), I search for meaning and context.

What do you mean by judgmental?   Because, in common language, that's something way different.  We're not talking about setting ourselves above others and condemning their souls.  Paul wrote to advise a community of right living in Col 3:16, "Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, as in all wisdom you teach and admonish one another, singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God."   We don't even need to know that passage to know there is a role for members of the Body to guide others and sometimes in judgment.  That's embedded in the teaching role of the church, members of the Body, parents, and other authorities, etc. 

Word of the day is "soteriology" -- study of theologies of salvation.  I agree with you here as we don't get that judgment role. 

 

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On 5/27/2023 at 1:30 PM, bornontheblue said:

We have all fallen short of what God expects of us, even those like you who have overcome many obstacles , and spend their time serving others. Jesus says so himself. 

If God gets us through a hardship or gets us over an obstacle , all credit and praise goes to God and none to ourselves. Well that is my POV on things. I understand you  feel differently. 

4 year old baby shaken to death.  What about the severally disabled.  What a bout a 5 year old who simply stole a snickers then died in a car accident.  Answer the questions you refuse to.

The "A sin is a sin is a sin" shit falls apart with little effort, always.

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On 5/27/2023 at 2:27 PM, halfmanhalfbronco said:

4 year old baby shaken to death.  What about the severally disabled.  What a bout a 5 year old who simply stole a snickers then died in a car accident.  Answer the questions you refuse to.

The "A sin is a sin is a sin" shit falls apart with little effort, always.

Even little children , and those with severe mental incapacitation are capable of understanding and accepting gods love. In fact they come to it much more naturally than most adults. We adults make it complicated. Salvation is not a long complicated process. It's just simply accepting gods love. 

As far as not being judgemental what I specifically mean is that we are in no position to criticize anybody else for their sinfulness, their lifestyle, who they love etc   when we are all guilty sinners in need of gods love and forgiveness. 

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On 5/27/2023 at 12:35 PM, grandjean87 said:

Btw:  I mentioned before, but since you always refer to Paul, the NPP should be of interest. 
https://www.theopedia.com/new-perspective-on-paul

 

I'm going to need to read that. I personally have a lot of issues with Paul and his venerated place among adherents of Chrstianity. 

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