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The "UN"-Official SDSU to the Pac thread.

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On 7/12/2023 at 11:36 AM, RebelAlliance said:

That last point is interesting because too often I hear people say that it doesn't matter where you go to school and that physics is physics and is taught the same everywhere.  If you think that an introductory physics class is taught the same way to a bunch of 1550 SAT kids at MIT as it is to a bunch of 1350 SAT kids at Wisconsin and that it's taught the same way there as it is to a bunch of 1000 SAT kids at Sacramento State, you're sadly mistaken. 

Yep.  Like comparing an honors chemistry class to a regular chemistry.  Kids learn chemistry in both but pacing is different, level of depth is different, amount of material covered, etc etc.

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On 7/12/2023 at 10:55 AM, Fowl said:

Grade inflation is very real and it varies by high school.  My oldest kid's HS had fewer than 20% of the grads this year with a 4.0 or better.  My niece's HS had exactly 40%.  My local public HS has over 40%.  I was going through some of my junk and found the graduation program for my HS and only 20% had over a 3.0 - that was 30 years ago.  The universities say that they know this and take it into account but I have my doubts seeing the results of my kid's friends acceptances and rejections this spring.  The other issue was that during covid a lot of HS's just gave kids A's even if the kids were getting a C (which is now the equivalent of an F).

MIT went no test during covid and will now be going back to requiring test scores because they ended up accepting a good amount of kids over the past couple of years who were not qualified to be able to hack it there. 

  

Grade inflation is very real, but it isn’t very new.

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On 7/12/2023 at 11:31 AM, Fowl said:

At every school the acceptance rate depends upon the major.  For example at Cal Poly the acceptance rate for Architectural Engineering this year was 2% and the other engineering majors were 3% but Nutritional Sciences was 44% and some ag majors were 50%.  One of my kid's friends was accepted to Cal Poly with a 3.8 weighted GPA but he applied for construction management which has a high acceptance rate.  

Yes I am aware but the response doing averages by program while more accurate would be a little overwhelming don’t you think…. 

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On 7/12/2023 at 12:04 PM, utenation said:

I’m going to stick with average viewership per game. It applies all the same metrics for all teams listed. It’s not a cherry picked number.

Fine us arguing on a message board doesn’t really matter.  But my comparison was not cherry picked.  It was same day of week, same time, same station.   You are welcome to try to find other examples but good luck as usually the PAC teams play earlier or on ESPN or both. 
 

And just to be clear I am not arguing Fresno is the same.  But if they brought us in at a half share it’s about commensurate with the ratings everything being equal.  

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On 7/12/2023 at 1:03 PM, Billings said:

Yep.  Like comparing an honors chemistry class to a regular chemistry.  Kids learn chemistry in both but pacing is different, level of depth is different, amount of material covered, etc etc.

Institutional mismatch is a thing.

“Science is the belief in the ignorance of experts.”

-Richard Feynman

"When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators."

-P.J. O’Rourke

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On 7/12/2023 at 12:56 PM, Someone Else said:

I'm aware of that.  I guess my point is what is a university supposed to do if they get a much larger number of applicants, tell people not to apply because they might be rejected?

Additionally, what it doesn't seem you are accounting for in your affinity numbers is that if a school gets far fewer numbers of applicants there isn't as much affinity in the first place. (I may have missed you discussing this issue already... if so, my apologies.)

Well they could accept more graduates.  

Ohio State Undergraduate 66,444

UCLA Undergraduates 32,119

But the PAC-12 schools revel in their Ivy League exclusivity so I doubt they will do that.  They would prefer to shove the merely very good students off to UC Merced.   

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On 7/12/2023 at 3:06 PM, sactowndog said:

Fine us arguing on a message board doesn’t really matter.  But my comparison was not cherry picked.  It was same day of week, same time, same station.   You are welcome to try to find other examples but good luck as usually the PAC teams play earlier or on ESPN or both. 
 

And just to be clear I am not arguing Fresno is the same.  But if they brought us in at a half share it’s about commensurate with the ratings everything being equal.  

I'm not arguing. We just disagree. I think that if Fresno was a big ratings program, they would probably be in more expansion conversations other than what Yoda brings to the table.  

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On 7/12/2023 at 2:20 PM, utenation said:

I'm not arguing. We just disagree. I think that if Fresno was a big ratings program, they would probably be in more expansion conversations other than what Yoda brings to the table.  

Well I do think Fresno absolutely is in the Big12 expansion conversations more than most realize.  I would guess BYU might have something to do with that fact as they can pull in recruits from LA to Sac.   Will they get in?  Who knows?  

As long as Cal is in the PAC, Fresno would never get an invite.   Cal likes to claim much of the Sac/Stockton/Modesto DMA and a Fresno based PAC would expose that claim as false.   So for the PAC it really doesn’t matter what ratings Fresno drew… the coast versus valley thing is real.  

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On 7/12/2023 at 4:11 PM, sactowndog said:

Well they could accept more graduates.  

Ohio State Undergraduate 66,444

UCLA Undergraduates 32,119

But the PAC-12 schools revel in their Ivy League exclusivity so I doubt they will do that.  They would prefer to shove the merely very good students off to UC Merced.   

That seems high, and I think that's for the entire OSU system.  The Ohio universities all have their own network of two-year branch campus that were another result of stupid decisions by the Governor and state in the 1960s.  I found a figure of 47K for the main campus in Columbus.  Still a big difference (50% more) but a bit better than twice the size.

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On 7/12/2023 at 2:11 PM, sactowndog said:

Well they could accept more graduates.  

Ohio State Undergraduate 66,444

UCLA Undergraduates 32,119

But the PAC-12 schools revel in their Ivy League exclusivity so I doubt they will do that.  They would prefer to shove the merely very good students off to UC Merced.   

I doubt they have the physical capacity to do that.  Ohio State by design is the lone big research university, as are most Big Ten schools.  The size of CA made it so Cal had to have a southern brother, and they have continued to build so there is research areas for the regions.  Ohio hasn't needed to do such a thing, and they had the physical footprint to grow to account for their students.

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On 7/12/2023 at 3:33 PM, sactowndog said:

Well I do think Fresno absolutely is in the Big12 expansion conversations more than most realize.  I would guess BYU might have something to do with that fact as they can pull in recruits from LA to Sac.   Will they get in?  Who knows?  

As long as Cal is in the PAC, Fresno would never get an invite.   Cal likes to claim much of the Sac/Stockton/Modesto DMA and a Fresno based PAC would expose that claim as false.   So for the PAC it really doesn’t matter what ratings Fresno drew… the coast versus valley thing is real.  

You think BYU is going to be lobbying for Fresno to be added to the Big 12?  I doubt it.  The BYU admin's first choice would likely be Utah and then Boise State.

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On 7/12/2023 at 1:45 PM, SalinasSpartan said:

Grade inflation is very real, but it isn’t very new.

This is MY personal experience. In the late nineties and early aughts, I taught a class in the MBA program at Cal Lutheran. (I was awarded my SDSU MBA in 1981.) CLU has a higher USNWR ranking for regional universities than half of the CSU campuses including SJSU. However, to be frank, I was amazed at how much bitching I heard from students about their grades. One of my students was particularly annoying. The guy was a sergeant with a Ventura county law enforcement agency and he went ballistic that I gave him a "C." As I told the graduate school advisor to whom he complained, that guy deserved a "D" at most which I'm almost positive he would have received 20 years earlier at SDSU.

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On 7/12/2023 at 3:49 PM, 818SUDSFan said:

This is MY personal experience. In the late nineties and early aughts, I taught a class in the MBA program at Cal Lutheran. (I was awarded my SDSU MBA in 1981.) CLU has a higher USNWR ranking for regional universities than half of the CSU campuses including SJSU. However, to be frank, I was amazed at how much bitching I heard from students about their grades. One of my students was particularly annoying. The guy was a sergeant with a Ventura county law enforcement agency and he went ballistic that I gave him a "C." As I told the graduate school advisor to whom he complained, that guy deserved a "D" at most which I'm almost positive he would have received 20 years earlier at SDSU.

I was talking about at the high school level, and specifically about the actual percentages. For example 50 or 60% being a C rather than a D or F. This was the case when my younger brother was in HS 10 years ago. But I’m pretty sure that policy was enacted at his school before he even started attending, much less before he graduated.

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On 7/11/2023 at 6:16 PM, sactowndog said:

At some issue yes this point is true, but when your Kids are 4.0 and have good test scores the parents get pissed. 

hey, if they can't run fast or jump high...phuck em! :whistle:

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2 hours ago, sactowndog said:

Well they could accept more graduates.  

Ohio State Undergraduate 66,444

UCLA Undergraduates 32,119

But the PAC-12 schools revel in their Ivy League exclusivity so I doubt they will do that.  They would prefer to shove the merely very good students off to UC Merced.   

Since all these schools are for profit I would imagine that they would take more students if they could. 

I imagine they would need more infrastructure to handle a substantially higher numbers.

Just a guess though.

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On 7/12/2023 at 3:06 PM, sactowndog said:

Fine us arguing on a message board doesn’t really matter.  But my comparison was not cherry picked.  It was same day of week, same time, same station.   You are welcome to try to find other examples but good luck as usually the PAC teams play earlier or on ESPN or both. 
 

And just to be clear I am not arguing Fresno is the same.  But if they brought us in at a half share it’s about commensurate with the ratings everything being equal.  

You are right.  When comparing T.V. numbers it ONLY makes sense to compare similar time slots and channels.  

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