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The "UN"-Official SDSU to the Pac thread.

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On 7/12/2023 at 10:04 AM, soupslam1 said:

The current average GPA in HS is 3.0 or a B average. So, there’s got to be a shit load of 4.0 students to balance the 2.0 C students. In short grade inflation has made a 3.5-4.0 GPA relatively common

Which is why the move to abandon test scores makes no sense.  GPA without the context of test scores and class rank is pretty much useless in an era where parents show up to teacher meeting with their attorneys in tow.

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On 7/12/2023 at 8:07 AM, RebelAlliance said:

Which is why the move to abandon test scores makes no sense.  GPA without the context of test scores and class rank is pretty much useless in an era where parents show up to teacher meeting with their attorneys in tow.

Most of the country is not wealthy suburbs.

 

 

 

 

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On 7/12/2023 at 8:07 AM, RebelAlliance said:

Which is why the move to abandon test scores makes no sense.  GPA without the context of test scores and class rank is pretty much useless in an era where parents show up to teacher meeting with their attorneys in tow.

CA public universities have moved away from standardized testing, so the proof will be in the pudding, so to speak, soon enough.
 

Also, “Grade inflation” is not new, my younger brother’s HS had some weird scale where 50% or 60% was a C. That was 10 years ago, and I’m pretty sure that started a little before he went there. Definitely not a wealthy school. 

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On 7/9/2023 at 6:16 PM, sactowndog said:

Just to stand up for Yoda….  

Fresno gets tons of derision across the state.  Hell the pastor at our church makes Fresno/valley jokes.  

But that also creates an us versus them mentality across the San Joaquin Valley from Bakersfield to Stockton.  No one from the coastal cities want to move there. It’s literally mostly red flyover country (or drive though as fast as possible down I5) 

That said, the SJV is home to 4.3M people.  If it were a state (which it should be) it would be 27th largest state between Oregon and Kentucky.  And unlike Oregon, Oklahoma, Connecticut, Utah, Iowa,  Nevada, Arkansas, Mississippi,  Kansas, Nebraska and West Virginia (which all have less population), it doesn’t have a single P5 or Pro franchise within it.  

Just to the north of the San Joaquin valley sits the Sac Metro Market with another 2.397M people.  The combined size of 6.7 would be the 18th largest state between Indiana and Missouri.   You add the Kings as competition but still no direct P5 or Pro football competition.  

It’s a large market dying for their own team who belongs with a midwestern mentality about sports.  It led the MWC in attendance at 39,067 average and tied for the league leadership in conference Championships. It doesn’t take a lot of imagination to see Fresno as a midwestern type powerhouse in terms of attendance and ratings.  

 

I don’t disagree. But currently Fresno’s TV ratings aren’t hot. Pretty low in fact. Especially since they are a good product. 
 

As soon as Fresno improves here, I’ll buy market size/Fresno footprint. 

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On 7/12/2023 at 6:51 AM, RebelAlliance said:

Michigan rejects four out of every five applicants, yet they have an ocean of t-shirt fans.  How many Catholics root for Notre Dame knowing full well their idiot spawn will never step foot on that campus?

So Notre Dame is a poor example because the affiliation is tied to religion.  
 

Michigan is a fairer example and are closer to the USC/UCLA acceptance rates.  And yes winners always have T shirt fans because people want to be affiliated with a winner.   If you look at Northwestern however you might see a different picture.  Or look at the Ivy League which in the 30’s was college football.   
 

 

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On 7/12/2023 at 8:07 AM, RebelAlliance said:

Which is why the move to abandon test scores makes no sense.  GPA without the context of test scores and class rank is pretty much useless in an era where parents show up to teacher meeting with their attorneys in tow.

Grade inflation is very real and it varies by high school.  My oldest kid's HS had fewer than 20% of the grads this year with a 4.0 or better.  My niece's HS had exactly 40%.  My local public HS has over 40%.  I was going through some of my junk and found the graduation program for my HS and only 20% had over a 3.0 - that was 30 years ago.  The universities say that they know this and take it into account but I have my doubts seeing the results of my kid's friends acceptances and rejections this spring.  The other issue was that during covid a lot of HS's just gave kids A's even if the kids were getting a C (which is now the equivalent of an F).

MIT went no test during covid and will now be going back to requiring test scores because they ended up accepting a good amount of kids over the past couple of years who were not qualified to be able to hack it there. 

  

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On 7/12/2023 at 10:26 AM, utenation said:

I don’t disagree. But currently Fresno’s TV ratings aren’t hot. Pretty low in fact. Especially since they are a good product. 
 

As soon as Fresno improves here, I’ll buy market size/Fresno footprint. 

Fair point.  But a couple things to keep in mind:

1) Fresno is almost always playing at 7:30 pm pst when 2/3’ds of the country has gone to bed.   

2) Fresno is usually on Fox Sports 1 or 2 which also impacts ratings.  
 

Apples to Apples Fresno is still behind but not to the degree you might think. For example both Saturday….

Fresno WSU 3:30 pm ABC  1.3.  2.4M 

vs 

Iowa Kentucky 12:00 pm ABC 1.7  3.0 


So absolutely a gap exists but it isn’t what you might think it is if comparing apples to oranges.  

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On 7/12/2023 at 1:03 PM, sactowndog said:


 

Apples to Apples Fresno is still behind but not to the degree you might think. For example both Saturday….

Fresno WSU 3:30 pm ABC  1.3.  2.4M 

vs 

Iowa Kentucky 12:00 pm ABC 1.7  3.0 


So absolutely a gap exists but it isn’t what you might think it is if comparing apples to oranges.  

Bowl games.  Iowa/Kentucky was up against the Sugar Bowl.  Fresno/WSU was up against the Las Vegas Bowl.    

It gives me a headache just trying to think down to your level

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On 7/12/2023 at 11:03 AM, sactowndog said:

Fair point.  But a couple things to keep in mind:

1) Fresno is almost always playing at 7:30 pm pst when 2/3’ds of the country has gone to bed.   

2) Fresno is usually on Fox Sports 1 or 2 which also impacts ratings.  
 

Apples to Apples Fresno is still behind but not to the degree you might think. For example both Saturday….

Fresno WSU 3:30 pm ABC  1.3.  2.4M 

vs 

Iowa Kentucky 12:00 pm ABC 1.7  3.0 


So absolutely a gap exists but it isn’t what you might think it is if comparing apples to oranges.  

Fresno had 3 games this year that had such low numbers there were no ratings.  If we are to use a bowl game to analyze popularity, gotta use conference games as well.

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On 7/12/2023 at 12:03 PM, sactowndog said:

Fair point.  But a couple things to keep in mind:

1) Fresno is almost always playing at 7:30 pm pst when 2/3’ds of the country has gone to bed.   

2) Fresno is usually on Fox Sports 1 or 2 which also impacts ratings.  
 

Apples to Apples Fresno is still behind but not to the degree you might think. For example both Saturday….

Fresno WSU 3:30 pm ABC  1.3.  2.4M 

vs 

Iowa Kentucky 12:00 pm ABC 1.7  3.0 


So absolutely a gap exists but it isn’t what you might think it is if comparing apples to oranges.  

That's why an average viewers per game takes everything into account. Other Western teams have the same timeslot restrictions etc and do much better.

In 2022 they averaged 220K viewers per game which was good for 80th in the country in the regular season.

https://medium.com/run-it-back-with-zach/which-college-football-programs-were-the-most-watched-in-2022-94eca4f6acbd

 

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On 7/12/2023 at 7:29 AM, Someone Else said:

There is only so much space at a university, no?

True but we are talking about how sending 85 out of 100 letters as rejection letters impacts consumers affinity with the brand.  Affinity impacts interest and likeliness to watch.  

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On 7/11/2023 at 10:30 PM, sactowndog said:

Interesting.  I did not though I expect weighted GPA’s would be similar.  Though standardized tests do allow a fairer comparison.  But I would be happy to see where SDSU ranked among the CA based UC’s, WCC and SCIAC schools and select CSU schools.   Too be honest, I don’t really care other than being tired of @AztecMD faux snobbery.  And yes not surprised about CPSLO as that school is a tremendous school.  
 

But if you have a better metric happy to hear it…. 

At every school the acceptance rate depends upon the major.  For example at Cal Poly the acceptance rate for Architectural Engineering this year was 2% and the other engineering majors were 3% but Nutritional Sciences was 44% and some ag majors were 50%.  One of my kid's friends was accepted to Cal Poly with a 3.8 weighted GPA but he applied for construction management which has a high acceptance rate.  

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On 7/12/2023 at 12:55 PM, Fowl said:

 

MIT went no test during covid and will now be going back to requiring test scores because they ended up accepting a good amount of kids over the past couple of years who were not qualified to be able to hack it there. 

  

That last point is interesting because too often I hear people say that it doesn't matter where you go to school and that physics is physics and is taught the same everywhere.  If you think that an introductory physics class is taught the same way to a bunch of 1550 SAT kids at MIT as it is to a bunch of 1350 SAT kids at Wisconsin and that it's taught the same way there as it is to a bunch of 1000 SAT kids at Sacramento State, you're sadly mistaken. 

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On 7/12/2023 at 11:22 AM, utenation said:

That's why an average viewers per game takes everything into account. Other Western teams have the same timeslot restrictions etc and do much better.

In 2022 they averaged 220K viewers per game which was good for 80th in the country in the regular season.

https://medium.com/run-it-back-with-zach/which-college-football-programs-were-the-most-watched-in-2022-94eca4f6acbd

 

No the average is definitely not apples for apples.  Here are the ratings. You highlight the times you find PAC-12 teams on at 10:30 at Fox Sports 1 or 2.   When they are their ratings are better but not orders of magnitude better.  So some of it is Fresno versus the PAC brand.  Some of it is time slot and station.  We can’t pull those factors apart but the guys at Fox and ESPN can.   

for example FS1 at 10:30
UCLA vs AZ State  .26 share 490K 

versus 

Fresno vs SDSU  .13 share  219K
 

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/

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On 7/12/2023 at 12:50 PM, sactowndog said:

No the average is definitely not apples for apples.  Here are the ratings. You highlight the times you find PAC-12 teams on at 10:30 at Fox Sports 1 or 2.   When they are their ratings are better but not orders of magnitude better.  So some of it is Fresno versus the PAC brand.  Some of it is time slot and station.  We can’t pull those factors apart but the guys at Fox and ESPN can.   

for example FS1 at 10:30
UCLA vs AZ State  .26 share 490K 

versus 

Fresno vs SDSU  .13 share  219K
 

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/

I’m going to stick with average viewership per game. It applies all the same metrics for all teams listed. It’s not a cherry picked number.

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59 minutes ago, sactowndog said:

True but we are talking about how sending 85 out of 100 letters as rejection letters impacts consumers affinity with the brand.  Affinity impacts interest and likeliness to watch.  

I'm aware of that.  I guess my point is what is a university supposed to do if they get a much larger number of applicants, tell people not to apply because they might be rejected?

Additionally, what it doesn't seem you are accounting for in your affinity numbers is that if a school gets far fewer numbers of applicants there isn't as much affinity in the first place. (I may have missed you discussing this issue already... if so, my apologies.)

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