t's Time for the Scientific Community to Admit We Were Wrong About COVID and It Cost Lives

[happycamper]

• dude can't even spellcheck his own opinion piece (spelled "anthony" wrong lmao)
• dude doesn't say what the scientific community was wrong about other than being mean to trump and, i guess, knowing more science than people like bob

[NMpackalum]

On 2/1/2023 at 11:24 AM, CV147 said:

Ad hominem

He has plenty of links in the article from scientific journals. Why don't you address those?

Because it's much easier to dismiss a person based on who they are rather than what they say?

Honestly your reaction is a prime example of what the author is talking about.

Have you read his links? They don't really support his premise that the scientific community hubris turned the crisis into a team sport forcing people to turn to conspiracy theories, causing unneeded deaths from people not vaccinating. And yes, an MD PhD student isn't really representative of the scientific community yet. People hear what they want to hear or read. Lay people not in the scientific community have to determine the message based on the messenger which generally are media people and political figures they trust and most of them have the same difficulty with interpretation of data. Sure there are always dissenting ideas in medicine, more than the non medical people would really expect but this was not one of the more controversial topics with varying degrees of consensus.

[RSF]

On 2/1/2023 at 12:45 PM, Bob said:

I look forward to being proven right about all the stuff I've ranted about the past couple years. I'll patiently wait and post stuff now and then that vindicate my positions.

Come to think of it....

 

 

Bob is 'looking forward' to be proven right.  Which is a tacit admission that he has not yet been proven right, and thus all of his previous posts - rants, by his own admission - are crap.

 

 

Hope for you yet, Bob.

[halfmanhalfbronco]

On 2/2/2023 at 7:03 AM, happycamper said:

• dude can't even spellcheck his own opinion piece (spelled "anthony" wrong lmao)
• dude doesn't say what the scientific community was wrong about other than being mean to trump and, i guess, knowing more science than people like bob

 

He should blame democrats and the media for misrepresenting the scientific community.  The scientific community was never ever ever in agreement about the origin of COVID, the effectiveness of cloth masks, if social distancing would work, etc...

Everybody who shouted "follow the science" while not being able to balance a simple chemical equation simply because their now dead gods told them so (looking at you @GoDogs22) should have lemon juice squirted in their eyes

 

[East Coast Aztec]

On 2/2/2023 at 9:11 AM, halfmanhalfbronco said:

 

He should blame democrats and the media for misrepresenting the scientific community.  The scientific community was never ever ever in agreement about the origin of COVID, the effectiveness of cloth masks, if social distancing would work, etc...

Everybody who shouted "follow the science" while not being able to balance a simple chemical equation simply because their now dead gods told them so (looking at you @GoDogs22) should have lemon juice squirted in their eyes

 

Why are you leaving out the republicans?  Seems a one-sided dressing down on an all-hands-on deck issue, just on science rhetoric alone.

[happycamper]

On 2/2/2023 at 12:11 PM, halfmanhalfbronco said:

 

He should blame democrats and the media for misrepresenting the scientific community.  The scientific community was never ever ever in agreement about the origin of COVID, the effectiveness of cloth masks, if social distancing would work, etc...

he should blame democrats for a societal lack of scientific literacy? 

I mean scientists said "this is our best idea of how to reduce transmission, better ideas forthcoming" because, well, that's implicit in the definition of science 

On 2/2/2023 at 12:11 PM, halfmanhalfbronco said:

Everybody who shouted "follow the science" while not being able to balance a simple chemical equation simply because their now dead gods told them so (looking at you @GoDogs22) should have lemon juice squirted in their eyes

 

Again, this dude is... blaming experts... for average americans not paying attention in high school 30 years ago?

Furthermore, "the science" showed a pretty significant gap between "enthusiastic social distancing and masking use" and, well "not". so what is the guy even complaining about? that scientists are to blame for people not wanting to restrict themselves and have less deaths, which we saw a measurable difference in with other nations who didn't have such a kneejerk reaction against such measures? that we should blame scientists for being such a huge country that universal lockdowns in march, when western washington and new york were getting whacked, didn't help when the virus had spread to more interior areas months later?

I mean... seems like you are saying that he should be blaming "scientists" for "the makeup of america". 

[Old_SD_Dude]

On 2/2/2023 at 8:56 AM, NMpackalum said:

Have you read his links? They don't really support his premise that the scientific community hubris turned the crisis into a team sport forcing people to turn to conspiracy theories, causing unneeded deaths from people not vaccinating. And yes, an MD PhD student isn't really representative of the scientific community yet. People hear what they want to hear or read. Lay people not in the scientific community have to determine the message based on the messenger which generally are media people and political figures they trust and most of them have the same difficulty with interpretation of data. Sure there are always dissenting ideas in medicine, more than the non medical people would really expect but this was not one of the more controversial topics with varying degrees of consensus.

That’s Bob SOP. Every time I’ve ever dig down into the BS he’s posted over the last 3 years it was either from completely bogus sources or sources that didn’t actually support his hogwash. I don’t think he even reads the stuff himself. 

[AztecSU]

On 2/2/2023 at 9:11 AM, halfmanhalfbronco said:

 

He should blame democrats and the media for misrepresenting the scientific community.  The scientific community was never ever ever in agreement about the origin of COVID, the effectiveness of cloth masks, if social distancing would work, etc...

Everybody who shouted "follow the science" while not being able to balance a simple chemical equation simply because their now dead gods told them so (looking at you @GoDogs22) should have lemon juice squirted in their eyes

 

Ngl, cloth mask behavior is probably going to be the biggest positive to come out of this. Those of us that dont have rocks in our heads and masked up probably noticed not only were they less likely to get COVID, but a lot of folks didnt get a cold or a flu for much longer than normal. I've talked with many people who now look back at Asian travelers who have masked for years as having had it right the whole time. But I believe in evolution and encourage those who dont think it helps to never wear a mask. 

[RSF]

On 2/2/2023 at 1:20 PM, AztecSU said:

Ngl, cloth mask behavior is probably going to be the biggest positive to come out of this. Those of us that dont have rocks in our heads and masked up probably noticed not only were they less likely to get COVID, but a lot of folks didnt get a cold or a flu for much longer than normal. I've talked with many people who now looks back at Asian travelers who have masked for years as having had it right the whole time. But I believe in evolution and encourage those who dont think it helps to never wear a mask. 

A lot of people.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/past-seasons.html

 

2019-20 symptomatic cases :36 million.  Deaths: 25,000

20-21: *

21-22: 9 million.  Deaths: 5,000

 

*Estimates are not available for the 2020-2021 flu season due to minimal influenza activity.

[renoskier]

On 2/2/2023 at 11:20 AM, AztecSU said:

Ngl, cloth mask behavior is probably going to be the biggest positive to come out of this. Those of us that dont have rocks in our heads and masked up probably noticed not only were they less likely to get COVID, but a lot of folks didnt get a cold or a flu for much longer than normal. I've talked with many people who now looks back at Asian travelers who have masked for years as having had it right the whole time. But I believe in evolution and encourage those who dont think it helps to never wear a mask. 

[GoDogs22]

On 2/2/2023 at 9:11 AM, halfmanhalfbronco said:

Everybody who shouted "follow the science" while not being able to balance a simple chemical equation simply because their now dead gods told them so (looking at you @GoDogs22) should have lemon juice squirted in their eyes

 

1st off, leave me out of this.  2nd, your inability to blame Republican idiocy is pretty galling.  3rd, your inability to grasp how science actually works shows that your post was based either in partisan attacks, or ignorance.

[AztecAlien]

On 2/2/2023 at 12:20 PM, AztecSU said:

Ngl, cloth mask behavior is probably going to be the biggest positive to come out of this. Those of us that dont have rocks in our heads and masked up probably noticed not only were they less likely to get COVID, but a lot of folks didnt get a cold or a flu for much longer than normal. I've talked with many people who now looks back at Asian travelers who have masked for years as having had it right the whole time. But I believe in evolution and encourage those who dont think it helps to never wear a mask. 

If you're just talking about cloth masks the CDC and scientists stated they did little to stop the spread of COVID and have changed directions. Again, that's cloth masks. Those masks did more environmental damage than they did stopping the virus.  

[Spaztecs]

On 2/2/2023 at 12:20 PM, AztecSU said:

Ngl, cloth mask behavior is probably going to be the biggest positive to come out of this. Those of us that dont have rocks in our heads and masked up probably noticed not only were they less likely to get COVID, but a lot of folks didnt get a cold or a flu for much longer than normal. I've talked with many people who now looks back at Asian travelers who have masked for years as having had it right the whole time. But I believe in evolution and encourage those who dont think it helps to never wear a mask. 

What amazed me during the Covid era was standard flu rates bottomed out.

Mostly because people were masking and distancing.

Like Climate Change, Covid is an inconvenient and uncomfortable reality that the hard core right is still in denial about.

[happycamper]

On 2/2/2023 at 2:46 PM, AztecAlien said:

If you're just talking about cloth masks the CDC and scientists stated they did little to stop the spread of COVID and have changed directions. Again, that's cloth masks. Those masks did more environmental damage than they did stopping the virus.  

how...

how would you even begin to develop on equivalency for that comparison

[AztecAlien]

On 2/2/2023 at 12:53 PM, happycamper said:

how...

how would you even begin to develop on equivalency for that comparison

Again, we're talking about cloth masks and mostly the disposable ones that the majority of people were wearing. 

https://www.pghr.org/post/the-harmful-environmental-impacts-of-disposable-masks

 

 

 

 

[happycamper]

On 2/2/2023 at 3:04 PM, AztecAlien said:

Again, we're talking about cloth masks and the disposable ones that the majority of people were wearing. 

https://www.pghr.org/post/the-harmful-environmental-impacts-of-disposable-masks

 

 

okay

but you said they "damaged the environment" more than they "stopped the virus"

how would you be able to compare those two lol

i mean in terms of "stopping the virus" you could make a model of % effectiveness based on all the data we have (not real effective but, like, better than nothing based on the evidence)

while in terms of "environmental damage"... what? do you have insect and bird counts from before and after mask use? can you actually pin the difference on masks instead of any other factor? how would you differentiate? would you have to say that you lose like 2% of the entire biomass of the earth to have "more environmental damage" than "virus prevention"? 

[AztecAlien]

On 2/2/2023 at 1:14 PM, happycamper said:

okay

but you said they "damaged the environment" more than they "stopped the virus"

how would you be able to compare those two lol

i mean in terms of "stopping the virus" you could make a model of % effectiveness based on all the data we have (not real effective but, like, better than nothing based on the evidence)

while in terms of "environmental damage"... what? do you have insect and bird counts from before and after mask use? can you actually pin the difference on masks instead of any other factor? how would you differentiate? would you have to say that you lose like 2% of the entire biomass of the earth to have "more environmental damage" than "virus prevention"? 

Cloth disposable masks didn't work. And as I stated the CDC and researchers changed directions on the type of masks. For two years the majority of the population were wearing ineffective masks that did not help slowing the spread of the virus. Most people are still wearing them today. And yes, they have been an environmental disaster. 

https://whnt.com/news/coronavirus/health-experts-warn-to-stop-wearing-cloth-masks/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Spaztecs]

On 2/2/2023 at 12:46 PM, AztecAlien said:

If you're just talking about cloth masks the CDC and scientists stated they did little to stop the spread of COVID and have changed directions. Again, that's cloth masks. Those masks did more environmental damage than they did stopping the virus.  

Like with guns, it's a people problem. Not a mask problem.

[happycamper]

On 2/2/2023 at 3:22 PM, AztecAlien said:

Cloth disposable masks didn't work. And as I stated the CDC and researchers changed directions on the type masks. For two years the majority of the population were wearing ineffective masks that did not help slowing the spread of the virus. Most people are still wearing them today. And yes, they have been an environmental disaster. 

https://whnt.com/news/coronavirus/health-experts-warn-to-stop-wearing-cloth-masks/

 

 

 

umm

that's from your article

so... again, like i said, not great, but better than nothing

how would you compare a 5% reduction to their environmental impact lol? 

[RSF]

Mayo Clinic.  That cloth masks offer less protection has never been in dispute - just like air filters for your home have different levels of protection.  Nonetheless, wear the best one you can, so the guidance goes.  The flu numbers I posted are pretty solid evidence of that, because unlike Covid we have historical baselines.

 

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449