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UNLV2001

UNLV at Fresno State

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On 1/22/2023 at 10:35 AM, renoskier said:

come on man!

the last time UNLV had "someone big" lined up, they hired Rollie Massamino...that didn't work out so well either 

 

On 1/22/2023 at 10:35 AM, renoskier said:

come on man!

the last time UNLV had "someone big" lined up, they hired Rollie Massamino...that didn't work out so well either 

Massimino took the UNLV job for two reasons

1) It got him out of the super competitive Big East into the Big West where it's way easier to win in conference

2) He was a few years away from retirement & he could come to UNLV, win easier than at Villanova & then hand the program off to his kid 

That hire was idiotic by Brad Rothermel (if he was still AD at that time) 

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On 1/22/2023 at 12:02 AM, Rosegreen said:

True, and moments like this are exactly why Lon retired. He’s going to make sure his son is given a chance.
 

This is a chance for CKK to gain a lot of experience and understanding what is needed to win games. He said he’s going to adjust and we’ll see how that turns out vs Wyoming. 

Lon Kruger might be behind the scenes as a consultant & probably won't interject any advice unless Kevin requests it.

Lon won't ever return to the bench in any capacity, but I could see him as mentor 

With the above being known, and the "Kruger" pattern of taking a few seasons to build up will AD Harper give KK the time or does he pull the trigger ??

I think it was much easier to can Arroyo......the record was iffy anyway (despite some wins) & it seems Arroyo rubbed quite a few "locals" the wrong way right down to the high school coaching ranks - Not sure Kevin has rankled the "locals" like Arroyo did..........plus FB moves the needle for P5 eyes & everyone knows that a move to P5 would aid UNLV BB just by the move alone which 

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The UNLV men's basketball team lost to Fresno State, 76-63, Saturday afternoon at the Save Mart Center.

EJ Harkless led the Runnin' Rebels (12-7 overall, 1-6 Mountain West) with 15 points, seven rebounds, four assists and two steals, while Keshon Gilbert scored 11 points and Keyshawn Hall added 10 points with five rebounds.

Fresno State (7-11, 3-4) was led by Isaiah Hill's game highs of 28 points and five assists. Eduardo Andre had a double-double with 16 points and 13 rebounds.

STAT OF THE GAME: Fresno State shot 54.3% from the field (25 of 46) and 47.4% on 3-pointers (9 of 19).

UNLV'S SHOOTING: The Runnin' Rebels shot 50.0% from the field in the first half (12 of 24), but managed just 33.3% over the final 20 minutes (9 of 27), finishing the game at 41.2%.

QUOTABLE: "There is frustration, but we need to just keep going at it. We need to get our edge and that chip back again and it's hard to do when you are struggling, but we have to understand and realize that coming into the season when no one really expected us to do anything, we had an edge and a chip and we have to get that swagger and confidence back. There were a lot of really good stretches (today) where we did things well, but unfortunately there were just a few more where we didn't." - UNLV head coach Kevin Kruger.

OTHER NOTES:
- Elijah Parquet returned from an injury he suffered on Dec. 10. He had missed eight straight games.
- Luis Rodriguez was injured late in the first half after scoring five points and didn't return. 
- It marked UNLV's fourth-straight loss. Each opponent has shot over 50% from the field in those games.
- UNLV committed a season-low-tying seven turnovers.
- Fresno State out-rebounded UNLV, 33-23.
- Hill was 7 of 12 from the field, including 4 of 7 on 3-pointers and he made 10 of 12 free throws.
- Fresno State led by four at halftime, 37-33.
- It was a four-point game just before the final media timeout, 63-59, however Fresno State outscored UNLV by nine from there.
- UNLV has made at least one 3-pointer in a NCAA-record 1,180 straight games.

NEXT FOR THE RUNNIN' REBELS: UNLV will return home to the Thomas & Mack Center for two games next week vs. Wyoming on Tuesday, Jan. 24 at 8 p.m. and on Saturday, Jan. 28 vs. UNR at 7 p.

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On 1/22/2023 at 3:26 PM, UNLV2001 said:

Massimino took the UNLV job for two reasons

 

yeah...but it was a "big time", albeit shady, hire that excited many UNLV fans

I know you're aware that the never ending "big time hire TUNLV fan hub-bub" which never materializes, and never will, amuses the rest of us :D

 

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On 1/22/2023 at 4:09 PM, renoskier said:

yeah...but it was a "big time", albeit shady, hire that excited many UNLV fans

I know you're aware that the never ending "big time hire TUNLV fan hub-bub" which never materializes, and never will, amuses the rest of us :D

 

Massimino was not a fan favorite back in the day & why he was hired when even boosters might not have been in his camp is an oddity 

The only "name hire" post Tarkanian (1993) was Lon Kruger........everyone else was either a reach (Bayno, Rice, TJO, Kevin Kruger) or a band-aid to keep the NCAA at arms length (Spoonhour) 

The incompetence from the AD's office is the only sure thing from UNLV from 1993 to 2021

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On 1/22/2023 at 3:37 PM, UNLV2001 said:

Lon Kruger might be behind the scenes as a consultant & probably won't interject any advice unless Kevin requests it.

Lon won't ever return to the bench in any capacity, but I could see him as mentor 

With the above being known, and the "Kruger" pattern of taking a few seasons to build up will AD Harper give KK the time or does he pull the trigger ??

I think it was much easier to can Arroyo......the record was iffy anyway (despite some wins) & it seems Arroyo rubbed quite a few "locals" the wrong way right down to the high school coaching ranks - Not sure Kevin has rankled the "locals" like Arroyo did..........plus FB moves the needle for P5 eyes & everyone knows that a move to P5 would aid UNLV BB just by the move alone which 

If UNLV truly fires Kruger after only two seasons, I’d have to imagine it would be nearly impossible to hire anyone with any credentials. Coaches used to deserve four years minimum, but three should be the minimum.

Otzelberger had a very similar looking first two years.

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On 1/22/2023 at 7:28 PM, bigd said:

If UNLV truly fires Kruger after only two seasons, I’d have to imagine it would be nearly impossible to hire anyone with any credentials. Coaches used to deserve four years minimum, but three should be the minimum.

Otzelberger had a very similar looking first two years.

He won't be fired, but year three better be in the top 4 in the league.

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On 1/22/2023 at 4:28 PM, bigd said:

If UNLV truly fires Kruger after only two seasons, I’d have to imagine it would be nearly impossible to hire anyone with any credentials. Coaches used to deserve four years minimum, but three should be the minimum.

Otzelberger had a very similar looking first two years.

Some credence to that thinking........UNLV can't just keep flailing away with random coaching changes & the college FB / BB landscape has changed in recent years - A lot of programs aren't going to be built up via high school recruits like they used to so that 3 to 5 years was a time frame to see if the HS recruiting was working out.........Kruger had to rebuild in year one & year two and very possibly will need massive roster changes in year 3, which for a lot of programs will be the new routine from year to year 

UNLV needs some stability in the BB program IMO 

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On 1/22/2023 at 3:37 PM, UNLV2001 said:

Lon Kruger might be behind the scenes as a consultant & probably won't interject any advice unless Kevin requests it.

That's his dad. 100% he's getting feedback. But I'm not sure that works at this stage. We have seen coaches change things drastically mid or late season. Max Good after Bayno was canned completely changed the offense. 

Menzies completely changed his offense after Juiston and Mbacke went down. He went small and had his guys hunting 3s. The ability to do that showed me that MM was a very good coach. He went away from what he wanted, but his team thrived after the change. The problem was MM was stubborn and went back big as soon as he could.

CKK has exhibited that same stubbornness and either an unwillingness or an inability to adjust. What's still unknown is even if KK finally decides to add or change things, will he be able to coach his guys to execute the changes. We have zero clue.

The best coaches can make changes in the middle of a game and their guys don't miss a beat. We haven't seen any of that from KK. We need to see these capabilities from him. The lack of adjustments are literally killing the team this season. 

If CKK rolls out the exact same scheme all season long, mw coaches will keep having a field day at his expense.

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On 1/22/2023 at 4:28 PM, bigd said:

If UNLV truly fires Kruger after only two seasons, I’d have to imagine it would be nearly impossible to hire anyone with any credentials. Coaches used to deserve four years minimum, but three should be the minimum.

Otzelberger had a very similar looking first two years.

 

On 1/22/2023 at 4:37 PM, UNLV2001 said:

Some credence to that thinking........UNLV can't just keep flailing away with random coaching changes & the college FB / BB landscape has changed in recent years - A lot of programs aren't going to be built up via high school recruits like they used to so that 3 to 5 years was a time frame to see if the HS recruiting was working out.........Kruger had to rebuild in year one & year two and very possibly will need massive roster changes in year 3, which for a lot of programs will be the new routine from year to year 

UNLV needs some stability in the BB program IMO 

I tend to agree about wishing for Kruger's firing, simply based on the historic institutional incompetence of UNLV's admin and the long list of previous embarrassing head coaching fails going all the way back to Fat Mass and "Done Deal Dave" and Pitino.

But it should be emphasized that 1-6 in the MW is quite a bit worse than the 8-10 finishes from TJ, Menzies, Rice that were previously deemed unacceptable. 

The only UNLV season it can be remotely comparible to was that 4-14 MW finish in Menzies 1st season. However Marv was taking the smoldering ashes of the program Rice (and TKM) had completely nuked to hell and it was also his 1st year, and he did improve the next year. 

Still 11 games left in this season but UNLV would have to finish 7-4 just to reach that putrid 8-10 benchmark.

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Eight seasons in UNLV history the team finished under .500 in conference play.....UNLV needs to finish 7-3 this season to to get to .500 in MWC play

1972/73 6-8 WCAC Bayer

1994/95 7-11 Big West  Edwards

1995/96 7-11 Big West  Bayno

2014/15 8-10 MWC  Rice

2015/16 8-10 MWC  Rice/Simon

2016/17 4-14 MWC Menzies

2017/18 8-10 MWC  Menzies

2020/21 8-10 MWC Otzelberger

2022/23 1-6 (To date) MWC K Kruger

UNLV was not in a conference officially from 1975/76 to 1981/82 - Even though playing a full WAC schedule for about 4 of those seasons 

 

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On 1/22/2023 at 5:13 PM, UNLV2001 said:

Eight seasons in UNLV history the team finished under .500 in conference play.....UNLV needs to finish 7-3 this season to to get to .500 in MWC play

1972/73 6-8 WCAC Bayer

1994/95 7-11 Big West  Edwards

1995/96 7-11 Big West  Bayno

2014/15 8-10 MWC  Rice

2015/16 8-10 MWC  Rice/Simon

2016/17 4-14 MWC Menzies

2017/18 8-10 MWC  Menzies

2020/21 8-10 MWC Otzelberger

2022/23 1-6 (To date) MWC K Kruger

UNLV was not in a conference officially from 1975/76 to 1981/82 - Even though playing a full WAC schedule for about 4 of those seasons 

 

I remember that 95-96 year.  I was 15, had just recently moved to Vegas from Illinois, still a student at Chaparral HS.  My Dad (who doesn't even like basketball) was a car salesman and one day his boss comped him some UNLV tickets so in an effort to have an excuse to spend some father-son time together he took me to a game.  I was hooked from that moment on. 

Bayno had the town talking because he was young and had charisma and a pedigree from a national power program (UMass and Calipari).  Even though that team sucked, Bayno recruited some great ball players here, among them Shawn Marion who I believe was the #` JUCO player in the country that year back when JUCO ball had a lot more importance, and Lamar Odom who never played a game due to his involvement with that dentist prick.  And there were a lot of others.  Bayno had some great recruiting classes and several times had us on the cusp of the top 25 similar to how we were this year prior to our collapse, but he was never able to win the big game.  I remember his OOC was filled with Tabernacle Word-like cupcakes, with a few national powers like UCLA or Cincinnati sprinkled in and we always got stomped in those games.  Basically his teams could never win the big one and they underachieved compared to the pedigree of the recruits he brought in.

But I digress.  The point is that at the time Bayno was criticized for being a huge step down from the incredible shadow of Tark that was lurking large over the program.  This makes me feel incredibly old but at that time, it had only been a few years post-Tark, less time than it has been from now since the Menzies era. 

Bayno dug his own grave with the violations, but right after his firing they hired Old Man Spoon and all chaos ensued.  First, that was the first Pitino flirtation (When Done Deal Dave McCann went on TV and publicly said Pitino was a done deal before he had even signed a contract!!) so obviously fans were going to be disappointed, similar to what happened when we brought Menzies on board after the Beard failure.  The fans were enraged over such a patty-cake hire of Spoonhour, and in under 3 years he quit mid-season after a 4-6 start to conference play as the chants "Stick a Spork in him!" became too much.  Spoon actually made the NIT in each of his 2 full years, however, and both years his teams made it to the MWC tourney championship game where they just barely lost both times.  But Spoon's performance was beyond unacceptable to most UNLV fans. 

After his son unceremoniously finished out his season, we hired easily the best UNLV coach post-Tark, Lon Kruger.  But the unsatisfied fans obsessed with returning to the glory days of Tark still found his success unacceptable, which at this point is just flabbergasting.

I apologize for the long rambling rant, your list made me think of the old days because ironically, we only had losing conference seasons once in the '70's and twice in the '90's, and hadn't had a losing conference season in nearly 20 years when Kruger was kicked to the curb and replaced by Dave Rice.  Since that point, losing seasons in conference have become common.  This will be the 6th time in the last 9 years unless we have a miraculous finish.

And to think, back in the days of Bayno, Spoon, and Kruger, their (far superior than the past decade) performances were deemed incredibly unacceptable.

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On 1/22/2023 at 5:40 PM, VincentVegaBond said:

I remember that 95-96 year.  I was 15, had just recently moved to Vegas from Illinois, still a student at Chaparral HS.  My Dad (who doesn't even like basketball) was a car salesman and one day his boss comped him some UNLV tickets so in an effort to have an excuse to spend some father-son time together he took me to a game.  I was hooked from that moment on. 

Bayno had the town talking because he was young and had charisma and a pedigree from a national power program (UMass and Calipari).  Even though that team sucked, Bayno recruited some great ball players here, among them Shawn Marion who I believe was the #` JUCO player in the country that year back when JUCO ball had a lot more importance, and Lamar Odom who never played a game due to his involvement with that dentist prick.  And there were a lot of others.  Bayno had some great recruiting classes and several times had us on the cusp of the top 25 similar to how we were this year prior to our collapse, but he was never able to win the big game.  I remember his OOC was filled with Tabernacle Word-like cupcakes, with a few national powers like UCLA or Cincinnati sprinkled in and we always got stomped in those games.  Basically his teams could never win the big one and they underachieved compared to the pedigree of the recruits he brought in.

But I digress.  The point is that at the time Bayno was criticized for being a huge step down from the incredible shadow of Tark that was lurking large over the program.  This makes me feel incredibly old but at that time, it had only been a few years post-Tark, less time than it has been from now since the Menzies era. 

Bayno dug his own grave with the violations, but right after his firing they hired Old Man Spoon and all chaos ensued.  First, that was the first Pitino flirtation (When Done Deal Dave McCann went on TV and publicly said Pitino was a done deal before he had even signed a contract!!) so obviously fans were going to be disappointed, similar to what happened when we brought Menzies on board after the Beard failure.  The fans were enraged over such a patty-cake hire of Spoonhour, and in under 3 years he quit mid-season after a 4-6 start to conference play as the chants "Stick a Spork in him!" became too much.  Spoon actually made the NIT in each of his 2 full years, however, and both years his teams made it to the MWC tourney championship game where they just barely lost both times.  But Spoon's performance was beyond unacceptable to most UNLV fans. 

After his son unceremoniously finished out his season, we hired easily the best UNLV coach post-Tark, Lon Kruger.  But the unsatisfied fans obsessed with returning to the glory days of Tark still found his success unacceptable, which at this point is just flabbergasting.

I apologize for the long rambling rant, your list made me think of the old days because ironically, we only had losing conference seasons once in the '70's and twice in the '90's, and hadn't had a losing conference season in nearly 20 years when Kruger was kicked to the curb and replaced by Dave Rice.  Since that point, losing seasons in conference have become common.  This will be the 6th time in the last 9 years unless we have a miraculous finish.

And to think, back in the days of Bayno, Spoon, and Kruger, their (far superior than the past decade) performances were deemed incredibly unacceptable.

The fan base was so divided & torn up over the end of Tark, the hiring of Massimino that almost anyone not a major blue blood coach of that era would have satisfied the UNLV fan base - Coming off the run between 1986/87 to 1990/91 made it tough for any coach to come in & not be immediately compared to the results of the run over those years.

And those year still haunt (if you want to use that term) the program 32 years later........even the kids younger than you have expectations based on what their dad's or grandfather's told them about the glory years.

By 1995/96 I had hit 36 years old and my first notice of UNLV occurred in 1977 when UNLV made that run to the first Final Four......I was 17 & living in Sparks NV & UNLV, UNR & #1 ranked USF were all in the WCAC (Now WCC) so I latched onto UNLV during that 1977 tournament

So from my age, UNLV was good from when I was 17 to when they won the title when I just turned 30 in 1990 & 31 in 1991.......so that gave me the impression UNLV would always be good & a player in CBB......now with another 30 years behind me, I'm grasping the reality that UNLV is just a regular program with some solid potential 

As a side note, when I was at the U of Idaho from 1980-84......The Vandals had their best 4 year run of BB in the schools history.......I never let go of UNLV (moved to LV area in 1978) and never really latched onto the alma mater's sports because Idaho was in the Big Sky (left then came back over the decades) & probably would never be a factor in FB or BB 

Anyway.......I lived thru the entire Tark era & the glory run........and now I'm just wanting some stability & to see the Rebels get back to something similar to the 1975/75 to 1984/85 years........some rankings, fairly regular NCAA's & some national recognition.......the glory run will never return 

Times have changed, the landscape of CBB is totally different 

UNLV FB is another story 

 

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On 1/22/2023 at 3:37 PM, UNLV2001 said:

Lon Kruger might be behind the scenes as a consultant & probably won't interject any advice unless Kevin requests it.

Lon won't ever return to the bench in any capacity, but I could see him as mentor 

With the above being known, and the "Kruger" pattern of taking a few seasons to build up will AD Harper give KK the time or does he pull the trigger ??

I think it was much easier to can Arroyo......the record was iffy anyway (despite some wins) & it seems Arroyo rubbed quite a few "locals" the wrong way right down to the high school coaching ranks - Not sure Kevin has rankled the "locals" like Arroyo did..........plus FB moves the needle for P5 eyes & everyone knows that a move to P5 would aid UNLV BB just by the move alone which 

I would imagine Kevin talks to his father quite a bit, I'm sure Lon doesn't want to see Kevin fail but my guess would be Lon doesn't interject too much.  I think Harper has to give him time, he's not Arroyo who as you said wasn't a well liked guy locally. I can't imagine a situation in which he doesn't get another year outside of having someone big lined up. 

I can't sing and I can't dance but I can make romance - Macho Man Randy Savage

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On 1/23/2023 at 6:14 PM, just_chris said:

I would imagine Kevin talks to his father quite a bit, I'm sure Lon doesn't want to see Kevin fail but my guess would be Lon doesn't interject too much.  I think Harper has to give him time, he's not Arroyo who as you said wasn't a well liked guy locally. I can't imagine a situation in which he doesn't get another year outside of having someone big lined up. 

And signed, sealed, and delivered..so, KK isn't going anywhere, lol.

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On 1/23/2023 at 6:14 PM, just_chris said:

I would imagine Kevin talks to his father quite a bit, I'm sure Lon doesn't want to see Kevin fail but my guess would be Lon doesn't interject too much.  I think Harper has to give him time, he's not Arroyo who as you said wasn't a well liked guy locally. I can't imagine a situation in which he doesn't get another year outside of having someone big lined up. 

It's a father son thing...........Lon doesn't want to be nit picking every move, but, we can bet Lon & Kevin talk on things & Lon is there for any advice Kevins wants.......but eventually this is KK's program, so Lon's input is probably limited to when asked by KK 

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Ernie Baer - My name is Yvonne. Can  you please contact me.  I know this is weird. I’m not a bot or a spammer. You share the same name as a relative of mine. I’m trying to find out more about my relative. Plz email me. 
yvonnespeck@gmail.com

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