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Chris Murray: SJSU Never Should Have Been Invited to the MWC

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35 minutes ago, k5james said:

You can't kick then our until they force the issue by deciding to drop football.  Who are you realistically going to replace them with?

They would probably just move forward with 11 schools. 

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20 hours ago, Aztec Since 88 said:

I hate the idea of kicking schools out of the conference, but I honestly think it is in SJS best interest.  Their support for athletics will not allow their athletic programs to thrive in the MW.  The MW is not a great conference but it does take a commitment by each school to be competitive for all sports.  SJS is just not there and their athletic department commitment and profile is much more inline with the Big Sky than the MW.   Switching conferences would allow them to be better athletically on the field / court.

Who do you think realistically would want to join the MW if we let SJS go and is it worth it to make the trade?

SJSU's financial commitment to sports might be at the Big Sky level but that's deceptive. It's obvious that the administration of most Big Sky schools aspires to improve their athletics whereas at best, SJSU's administration doesn't care at all about football and maintains the program only because shutting it down would require SJSU to leave the MWC. Therefore, whereas most Big Sky schools have positive sports momentum, SJSU sports are headed in the opposite direction.

As to your final question, as an Aztec, I hardly care since it's unlikely we will be here eight years from now anyway.

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17 hours ago, Rofl_copter_dos said:

Yeah that was the dumbest decision i've seen a school make in a long time.  If spartan fans are to be believed (and i remain skeptical, as everyone i've talked to says the sticking point was assistant salaries) they were all set to spring for pat hill and the president personally stepped in and overruled then-AD Bleimayer.  

Those issues are not mutually exclusive. According to a couple insiders, for a few weeks before taking the Cal job, Jeff Tedford told SDSU he would come for what he was being offered if the school would give him another couple hundred thousand for assistants so he could put together the kind of staff he felt was necessary to win. Word was and it later became apparent that Tedford was simultaneously trying to get a Memorial Stadium upgrade commitment from Cal. When Tedford got the stadium commitment while not getting the requested commitment from SDSU, that was it.

A large percentage of professors at every school ignore the cliche that in the business world, you have to spend money to make money. Everybody except the totally clueless or outright liars knows that major college football is a business. If you don't want to or can't consider it as such, you need to either go down to a lower level or just drop the sport.

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UTSA which plays in the AlamoDome holds around 55k. Drop SJSU entirely and add UTSA , Texas St. and BYU for football and for basketball just add BYU and UTSA.

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1 hour ago, SleepingGiantsFan said:

A large percentage of professors at every school ignore the cliche that in the business world, you have to spend money to make money. Everybody except the totally clueless or outright liars knows that major college football is a business. If you don't want to or can't consider it as such, you need to either go down to a lower level or just drop the sport.

Basically the same reason I wrote about SJSU's new president in this thread last night. Her academic career is at D2/D3 schools. She may be supportive of college athletics but does she understand the difference to be at the FBS level (the "major college football is a business" level). President Papazian's view of the academic/athletic relationship along with her views about the spending needed for FBS will determine SJSU's future in the next few years.

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3 hours ago, rudolro said:

You don't have to replace them right away. We can go with an unbalanced schedule for a while.

 

I would make a run at Houston, or BYU that experiment is dead.

If SJS drops football we will cross that bridge when we get there.

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2 hours ago, SalinasSpartan said:

They would probably just move forward with 11 schools. 

10 schools and 6 additional football games.

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17 minutes ago, FresnoFacts said:

Basically the same reason I wrote about SJSU's new president in this thread last night. Her academic career is at D2/D3 schools. She may be supportive of college athletics but does she understand the difference to be at the FBS level (the "major college football is a business" level). President Papazian's view of the academic/athletic relationship along with her views about the spending needed for FBS will determine SJSU's future in the next few years.

I suspect she understands it takes money to compete, she most likely doesn’t approve.

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10 minutes ago, CPslograd said:

I suspect she understands it takes money to compete, she most likely doesn’t approve.

Obviously we are outsiders and the SJSU alums and fan will have some idea of her views. SJSU alums and fans are also the ones who will need to persuade her to support their team playing at the FBS level.

But SJSU also has to make some academic decisions about its future. It is now the outlier among MWC schools as the only school without a Carnegie Doctoral classification (besides Air Force as a military academy). Nothing wrong with being a good academic school that is not a doctoral school, but peers in this league are growing the number of doctorates granted.

SJSU has an EdD program but that remains small. SJSU also has a DNP jointly with Fresno State, but Fresno is the lead campus. SJSU also has a program for a PhD in Library Science granted by Queensland Univ, but that has only had 10 graduates in 10 years.

The official California State University systemwide reports of degrees awarded show

  • San Diego State awarded 138 doctorates in 2016-17;142 doctorates in 2015-16 (both years the largest number among all CSUs)
  • Fresno State awarded 74 doctorates in 2016-17; 64 doctorates in 2015-16 (both years the 2nd largest number among all CSUs)
  • San Jose State awarded 7 doctorates in 2016-17; 0 doctorates in 2015-16

http://www.calstate.edu/as/stat_reports/2016-2017/deg09.htm

SJSU is facing some expensive decisions about its future budgets in both athletics and academics.

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On 10/20/2017 at 12:23 PM, nvspuds said:

This commissioner doesn't have the power to add or kick out any school..He can make suggestions but the presidents decide.  Academics tend to view things in a far different light than fans...

 

Which was why the Big West added Boise State in 2012 and denied UC San Diego in 2017.  Academics ruled the day  :ph34r:

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23 hours ago, Aztec Since 88 said:

I hate the idea of kicking schools out of the conference, but I honestly think it is in SJS best interest.  Their support for athletics will not allow their athletic programs to thrive in the MW.  The MW is not a great conference but it does take a commitment by each school to be competitive for all sports.  SJS is just not there and their athletic department commitment and profile is much more inline with the Big Sky than the MW.   Switching conferences would allow them to be better athletically on the field / court.

Who do you think realistically would want to join the MW if we let SJS go and is it worth it to make the trade?

 

Weber State if you just want better hoops? Montana for both major sports?  EWU?? Slim pickings in the Sky.

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I forget the current NCAA rules for conferences, but I believe that if SJSU were to leave the MWC, we would have no choice but to add NMSU if we want to keep our NCAA recognition (including autobids). I think that we would have too few schools sponsoring baseball, and we wouldn't meet the NCAA minimum requirements for the number of men's sports sponsored by the conference. (Did I read somewhere that Boise State is planning to add a baseball team? If so, what is the timeline for that? If Boise adds baseball, then I think we meet the requirements even if SJSU leaves the conference.) If we have to add a school and NCAA requirements are not an issue, I know I'm in the minority, but I'm still a proponent of UC-Davis (assuming they are are willing to commit to FBS). I would rather add a school like UC-Davis (which is not currently an elite program but has enormous upside) rather than a school like Montana (which is currently successful but will probably never be better than they are now).

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50 minutes ago, StanfordAggie said:

I forget the current NCAA rules for conferences, but I believe that if SJSU were to leave the MWC, we would have no choice but to add NMSU if we want to keep our NCAA recognition (including autobids). I think that we would have too few schools sponsoring baseball, and we wouldn't meet the NCAA minimum requirements for the number of men's sports sponsored by the conference. (Did I read somewhere that Boise State is planning to add a baseball team? If so, what is the timeline for that? If Boise adds baseball, then I think we meet the requirements even if SJSU leaves the conference.) If we have to add a school and NCAA requirements are not an issue, I know I'm in the minority, but I'm still a proponent of UC-Davis (assuming they are are willing to commit to FBS). I would rather add a school like UC-Davis (which is not currently an elite program but has enormous upside) rather than a school like Montana (which is currently successful but will probably never be better than they are now).

Both TxState & TxSA play baseball & I think they both have big upsides in the future if they get into a better conference.

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2 hours ago, StanfordAggie said:

I forget the current NCAA rules for conferences, but I believe that if SJSU were to leave the MWC, we would have no choice but to add NMSU if we want to keep our NCAA recognition (including autobids). I think that we would have too few schools sponsoring baseball, and we wouldn't meet the NCAA minimum requirements for the number of men's sports sponsored by the conference. (Did I read somewhere that Boise State is planning to add a baseball team? If so, what is the timeline for that? If Boise adds baseball, then I think we meet the requirements even if SJSU leaves the conference.) If we have to add a school and NCAA requirements are not an issue, I know I'm in the minority, but I'm still a proponent of UC-Davis (assuming they are are willing to commit to FBS). I would rather add a school like UC-Davis (which is not currently an elite program but has enormous upside) rather than a school like Montana (which is currently successful but will probably never be better than they are now).

The mwc could just add a baseball affiliate

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Minimum requirement is six for baseball.  the MW is safe there,

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4 hours ago, StanfordAggie said:

I forget the current NCAA rules for conferences, but I believe that if SJSU were to leave the MWC, we would have no choice but to add NMSU if we want to keep our NCAA recognition (including autobids). I think that we would have too few schools sponsoring baseball, and we wouldn't meet the NCAA minimum requirements for the number of men's sports sponsored by the conference. (Did I read somewhere that Boise State is planning to add a baseball team? If so, what is the timeline for that? If Boise adds baseball, then I think we meet the requirements even if SJSU leaves the conference.) If we have to add a school and NCAA requirements are not an issue, I know I'm in the minority, but I'm still a proponent of UC-Davis (assuming they are are willing to commit to FBS). I would rather add a school like UC-Davis (which is not currently an elite program but has enormous upside) rather than a school like Montana (which is currently successful but will probably never be better than they are now).

no, no, no.  Keep UC Davis the hell out of FBS.    They'll end up in the PAC.   

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11 hours ago, Brew_Poke said:

10 schools and 6 additional football games.

k

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Here is some reality.

Yes SJSU sucks but they do have potential if they can ever harness the local population.  Far more potential than almost anyone else in the conference.

Second reality.....  Most of your teams suck dogshit too, just not quite as bad.   You need SJSU so people have something to distract them from looking to closely at your programs constant failures.

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3 hours ago, bluerules009 said:

Here is some reality.

Yes SJSU sucks but they do have potential if they can ever harness the local population.  Far more potential than almost anyone else in the conference.

Second reality.....  Most of your teams suck dogshit too, just not quite as bad.   You need SJSU so people have something to distract them from looking to closely at your programs constant failures.

Nope to SJSU having more potential than anyone. However, I can't argue with the 2nd point. I think SJSU could have Boise like success and still no one in the Bay Area would care. 

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16 hours ago, FresnoFacts said:

Basically the same reason I wrote about SJSU's new president in this thread last night. Her academic career is at D2/D3 schools. She may be supportive of college athletics but does she understand the difference to be at the FBS level (the "major college football is a business" level). President Papazian's view of the academic/athletic relationship along with her views about the spending needed for FBS will determine SJSU's future in the next few years.

Everybody needs a loss leader to get people in the door for the real business, such as enrollment.

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