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bleachedwheat

How to make the Conference better

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1 hour ago, ole blu dude said:

 USU has had some good success with kids from Texas, Chuckie Keeton springs to mind, the best O lineman  we have is from Texas as well as the current starting Q.B. plus a very good nose tackle, back up tight end, and free safety also are Texas kids, so as far as USU goes Texas has been very good for us.

 I feel your pain with the drop down.

True.  My point was that having a lower tier Texas school isn't going to magically change the recruiting world. 

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9 minutes ago, ClevelandBrown said:

STEP ONE:  Drop SJSU

STEP TWO:   Drop Hawai'i but sign an agreement with them to play 5 MWC teams every year to aide their new Indy life, like ND has with the ACC.

STEP THREE:  Leave a door open for BYU to join as an eleventh full member.

STEP FOUR: Play a complete round-robin schedule, even if BYU was a member (leaving just 2 OOC games, 3 if that team travels to Hawai'i)

STEP FIVE: Disallow members to schedule FCS schools.

STEP SIX: Make an agreement with AAC for our Champions to meet at the end of the season, increasing the chance at a Playoff berth and National Championship for both conferences members.

STEP SEVEN: Profit.

 

You lost Air Force at step 3. You might've lost UNLV at step 5 (probably no great loss in most's eyes though). B)

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6 minutes ago, SharkTanked said:

I hope we lucked into a good coach, but Menzies has a lot to prove on the court. Things that he has yet to prove in his career (wins against top 25 and wins in the tournament both = 0).

And yes, UNM paid Weir double. That is precisely the reason why NMSU will never, ever, ever be any good at hoops. They can't pay to compete. If they don't drop football, they really have no shot at ever being competitive anywhere outside the dregs of D1, except if they get lucky one season before their coach gets poached.

And yes, most programs outside the Power 5 are stepping stones. NMSU has proven to be a stepping stone to the stepping stones.

i am assuming you are just young as opposed to ignorant.  Menzies built multiple teams capable of making NCAA tourney runs.  The lost to Final Four MSU on a bogus lane violation call and missed a 3 last shot.  That MSU team went to 3 consecutive Final Fours.  We played them the middle year.  We lost to SDSU in OT.   Losing by a possession in great games goes against your argument.  By the way, does beating UNLV the year they won the national championship mean anything to you as a UNLV fan?  Probably not, but that team had Randy Brown and Reggie Jordan.  i was actually at that game.  Did UNLV lose any other games on the road that year?  You might recognize Brown as he has rings from playing with the MJ Bulls.  If you are going to use tournament wins as your only measuring stick, then pretty much the entire MWC sucks.  Again, if you use that criteria.  Talent wise, our basketball team would fit right in the MWC.  

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Just now, VandalPride97 said:

True.  My point was that having a lower tier Texas school isn't going to magically change the recruiting world. 

Very true. We do good enough in Texas without them. I didn't see any noticeable bump when TCU was here either.

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Just now, SharkTanked said:

You lost Air Force at step 3. You might've lost UNLV at step 5 (probably no great loss in most's eyes though). B)

Air Force wouldn't leave if BYU came back and UNLV has no where else to go.

I think, therefore I'm.

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2 minutes ago, ClevelandBrown said:

Air Force wouldn't leave if BYU came back and UNLV has no where else to go.

False.  We would be happy to arrange a soft landing for UNLV in the . . . <sniff> . . . <sob> . . . Big Sky Conference. I'm gong to go cry in the shower for a while...

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14 minutes ago, alum93 said:

i am assuming you are just young as opposed to ignorant.  Menzies built multiple teams capable of making NCAA tourney runs.  The lost to Final Four MSU on a bogus lane violation call and missed a 3 last shot.  That MSU team went to 3 consecutive Final Fours.  We played them the middle year.  We lost to SDSU in OT.   Losing by a possession in great games goes against your argument.  By the way, does beating UNLV the year they won the national championship mean anything to you as a UNLV fan?  Probably not, but that team had Randy Brown and Reggie Jordan.  You might recognize Brown as he has rings from playing with the MJ Bulls.  If you are going to use tournament wins as your only measuring stick, then pretty much the entire MWC sucks.  Again, if you use that criteria.  

1. I have been a season ticket holder for 35 years. I've been around.

2. Menzies had teams capable, yes, successful, no. UNLV is not a team that wants to hire based on potential, but rather accomplishments. Unfortunately our AD at the time was wildly incompetent so here we are. Losing is losing. Menzies had plenty of chances and couldn't win a big game. That's the primary reason he was at NMSU as long as he was. Wins against top 25 = 0. Wins in the tournament = 0.

3. You aren't the only team that beat UNLV in 1989/90. Big whoop. That was almost 40 years ago (as we are reminded daily here by our conference brethren).

4. Yes pretty much the entire MWC sucks, you will get no argument from me on that. We are now deservedly a one bid conference laid low by our suckitude. Why should we add to that problem by taking NMSU?

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11 minutes ago, ClevelandBrown said:

Air Force wouldn't leave if BYU came back and UNLV has no where else to go.

Well, some of the futurists around here having us dropping football within 10 years anyway, so the point is probably moot.

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1 minute ago, SharkTanked said:

1. I have been a season ticket holder for 35 years. I've been around.

2. Menzies had teams capable, yes, successful, no. UNLV is not a team that wants to hire based on potential, but rather accomplishments. Unfortunately our AD at the time was wildly incompetent so here we are. Losing is losing. Menzies had plenty of chances and couldn't win a big game. That's the primary reason he was at NMSU as long as he was.

3. You aren't the only team that beat UNLV in 1989/90. Big whoop. That was almost 40 years ago (as we are reminded daily here by our conference brethren).

4. Yes pretty much the entire MWC sucks, you will get no argument from me on that. We are now deservedly a one bid conference laid low by our suckitude. Why should we add to that problem by taking NMSU?

Cool, my bad on the young comment.  And the ignorant one too.  As far as point 4,  i don't think the MWC sucks and i don't think NMSU basketball sucks.  So agree to disagree.  It's a solid G5 conference.  Maybe that's not good enough for some people.  You aren't going to be P5, not even close.  That doesn't mean there isn't good basketball played at upper half.   

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9 minutes ago, alum93 said:

Cool, my bad on the young comment.  And the ignorant one too.  As far as point 4,  i don't think the MWC sucks and i don't think NMSU basketball sucks.  So agree to disagree.  It's a solid G5 conference.  Maybe that's not good enough for some people.  You aren't going to be P5, not even close.  That doesn't mean there isn't good basketball played at upper half.   

No need to be so kind lol. Sadly there hasn't been good basketball here for awhile outside of SDSU. Just mediocre. We peaked as a 4 bid conference and were always the best non P5 (while counting the old Catholics in BE as a P5). We lost Kruger, never recovered, UNM lost Alford, never recovered, conference lost BYU, none of the replacements were in the same neighborhood accomplishment wise. In short we turned into the WAC minus a couple. I can understand that your experience was with that conference so you might have a different perspective, but we literally went from a "major" hoops conference to a mediocre "mid-major" in the span of a few short years.

We have a couple of schools that may be ready to take a leap up in UNR (as long as they can keep their coach), UNLV (as long as their coach can actually coach), Wyoming (if their coach can get some more talent), and Boise (again, if they can stockpile some more talent), UNM may but has a deep rebuild right now. Hopefully SDSU keeps the train rolling under Dutch. It is possible the MWC can build itself back up, but it is a pretty long ways from that right now.

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46 minutes ago, SharkTanked said:

No need to be so kind lol. Sadly there hasn't been good basketball here for awhile outside of SDSU. Just mediocre. We peaked as a 4 bid conference and were always the best non P5 (while counting the old Catholics in BE as a P5). We lost Kruger, never recovered, UNM lost Alford, never recovered, conference lost BYU, none of the replacements were in the same neighborhood accomplishment wise. In short we turned into the WAC minus a couple. I can understand that your experience was with that conference so you might have a different perspective, but we literally went from a "major" hoops conference to a mediocre "mid-major" in the span of a few short years.

We have a couple of schools that may be ready to take a leap up in UNR (as long as they can keep their coach), UNLV (as long as their coach can actually coach), Wyoming (if their coach can get some more talent), and Boise (again, if they can stockpile some more talent), UNM may but has a deep rebuild right now. Hopefully SDSU keeps the train rolling under Dutch. It is possible the MWC can build itself back up, but it is a pretty long ways from that right now.

i see your point.  Much like football,  i think the P5 are just going to keep most of the money to themselves.  MWC/CUSA/Sun Belt/Big West/WAC will find it difficult to get multiple bids to NCAA.  i think the MWC can be a 2 bid league with the right coaches, but hard to see anything more than that most years.  SOS of the big boys is tough to overcome.  They don't need to take chances and play at good G5 schools, and they have advantage of homecourt most games when they do schedule those schools.

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2 hours ago, alum93 said:

Look at the bright side.  They are part of a huge tv market.  Word is that is really important.

It's not important at all if nobody in your TV market cares to watch your games. I'm not going to bother to try to find it but about a month ago somebody linked a map identifying by zip code the three schools most often cited by poll respondents as their favorite. IIRC, SJSU wasn't in the top three even in its own zip code.

If the doofi who voted to offer SJSU admission had done even a modicum of homework, they would have discovered (1) that although they might have needed to add one school to replace SDSU and Boise they definitely didn't need to add two and (2) that SJSU hasn't had a decent fan base since I finally left the Bay Area for good in 1981. Of course, word is SJSU verbally committed to Craig Thompson that it already had the money to fully fund its North End Zone project so that thing would be completed within a few years of the Spartans gaining MWC membership. SJSU has now been a member of the MWC for four academic years but still hasn't even broken ground on the NEZ project.

Boom goes the dynamite.

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2 hours ago, VandalPride97 said:

True.  My point was that having a lower tier Texas school isn't going to magically change the recruiting world. 

I never hurts to tell a recruit that we will be playing game in your home state while you play here.

I'm not pushing any school as a member unless someone leaves there is no need to add anyone to this conference, if the schools have chosen to be FCS there is even less of a reason to add them. I feel for Idaho they have fought a good fight, and with quality leadership they could have remained, you needed to build facilities and increase revenue if FBS was the goal. 

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10 hours ago, utgrizfan said:

Tv market argument seems to be more and more of a weak excuse as time goes on, case and point it sure as hell hasn't helped San Jose

I agree, with all the cord cutting going on and people are becoming more able to watch whatever teams they want, wherever they are a league like the MWC should focus on regional rivalries.  I am more interested in seeing Utah State play Montana, than UTSA. 

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I really like the ideas presented above but I feel downsizing leaves the conference vulnerable to eventual expansion, I'd like to see:

1. SJSU either drops football or goes to the Big Sky

2. Hawaii Independent with scheduling agreement with MWC and/or becomes listed as a P5 opponent like the Service Academies to get Pac12 schools to schedule them.

3. Montana, Montana State, NDSU and SDSU join the MWC bringing in solid programs with great fan support, good facilities and National recognition in NDSU.

4. Two 7 team Divisons that would both have historically competitive teams and play 3 teams from the opposite Divison every year.

MOUNTAIN:

Montana, MSU, NDSU, SDSU, WYO, CSU, AF

WEST:

BSU, USU, SDSU, UNLV, UNR, UNM, FSU

Example Schedule:

MONTANA

-vs Idaho, @Washington, @Hawaii, vs NDSU, @SDSU, @WYO, vs CSU, vs, AF, @USU, vs UNR, @BSU, vs MSU

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Those last four schools you mentioned aren't going anywhere.

And will you please stop referring to South Dakota State as "SDSU"? The Mountain West Conference isn't the Big Sky Conference. At least not yet . . .

Boom goes the dynamite.

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16 minutes ago, SleepingGiantsFan said:

Those last four schools you mentioned aren't going anywhere.

And will you please stop referring to South Dakota State as "SDSU"? The Mountain West Conference isn't the Big Sky Conference. At least not yet . . .

I have to disagree, when the next round of expansion comes I see this as a real possibility. And acronyms aren't reserved for one team and SDSU is in the Missouri Valley not the Big Sky ?

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5 minutes ago, utgrizfan said:

I have to disagree, when the next round of expansion comes I see this as a real possibility. And acronyms aren't reserved for one team and SDSU is in the Missouri Valley not the Big Sky ?

SDSU's football stadium sits 10k and basketball sits 6k.  It's located in a place called Brookings, South Dakota with a population of 22k.  You think that's a viable option for the MWC, even if they had to replace 3-4 teams?   

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